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Re: What is the Wrath of God?
[Re: Green Cochoa]
#154120
07/12/13 02:32 PM
07/12/13 02:32 PM
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OP
SDA
Active Member 2020
5500+ Member
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Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 6,368
Western, USA
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God says "I will greatly multiply thy sorrow...."
Who killed Saul? Who killed Nadab and Abihu?  Blessings, Green Cochoa. Who caused the thorns and thistles?
Oh, that men might open their minds to know God as he is revealed in his Son! {ST, January 20, 1890}
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Re: What is the Wrath of God?
[Re: APL]
#154121
07/12/13 03:13 PM
07/12/13 03:13 PM
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OP
SDA
Active Member 2020
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Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 6,368
Western, USA
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Reminder: the topic of this thread is NOT the "biology of sin." It is defining the "wrath of God." Reminder: I started this thread. And actually, the "biology of sin" as you call it, and the wrath of God are integrally tied together.
Oh, that men might open their minds to know God as he is revealed in his Son! {ST, January 20, 1890}
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Re: What is the Wrath of God?
[Re: APL]
#154122
07/12/13 10:44 PM
07/12/13 10:44 PM
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SDA
Active Member 2014
Retired Pastor
3000+ Member
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Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 3,014
Iceland
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Yesterday as I was reading the Danish Christian Daily newspaper I discovered an interesting item about education. Among the foreign graduate students in the Danish Universities three nationalities dominate:
1. American
2. German
3. Chinese
University authorities have noticed the recent increase in Chinese students and what remarkable progress they are making. It is increasingly easy for them to adapt to the Danish mentality, and that makes them among the top students.
The Chinese are quick to notice that the Danish way of thinking is not limited to a single pillar, like in their own traditions. A Danish research student in science does not limit his thinking and research to a single subject, like physics. In his research he will also make questions within chemistry and biology equal pillars to reach a sound scientific conclusion. When the Chinese students learn this they make top graduate students.
I notice that APL is doing something like that when he ties the biology of sin together with the wrath of God. This is all within the creative power of God. Will we do as well as the Chinese in these understandings?
Sigve Tonstad, a Scandinavian, is doing this in his Biblical research about God.
"Here is a last piece of advice. If you believe in goodness and if you value the approval of God, fix your minds on the things which are holy and right and pure and beautiful and good. Model your conduct on what you have learned from me, on what I have told you and shown you, and you will find the God of peace will be with you."
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Re: What is the Wrath of God?
[Re: APL]
#154146
07/15/13 12:38 PM
07/15/13 12:38 PM
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SDA
Active Member 2024
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Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 6,509
Midland
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God says "I will greatly multiply thy sorrow...."
Who killed Saul? Who killed Nadab and Abihu? Blessings, Green Cochoa. Who caused the thorns and thistles? And the same answer to all the above questions is: Not God!
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Re: What is the Wrath of God?
[Re: kland]
#154150
07/15/13 01:48 PM
07/15/13 01:48 PM
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SDA
Active Member 2021
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Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 7,003
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Who killed Nadab and Abihu? Who caused the thorns and thistles? And the same answer to all the above questions is: Not God! Nadab and Abihu were slain by the fire of God's wrath...
Nadab and Abihu drank too freely of wine, and the result was, they used common fire instead of sacred, and were destroyed for thus dishonoring God.
Nadab and Abihu, by drinking wine, beclouded their reasoning faculties, and so lost their sense of sacred things, that they thought they could as well offer common fire as sacred. God did not excuse them because the brain was confused. Fire from his presence destroyed them in their sin.
How can such service be acceptable to a holy God, who required the priests of Israel to make such special preparations before coming into his presence, lest his sacred holiness should consume them for dishonoring him, as in the case of Nadab and Abihu?
Nadab and Abihu were priests of the sanctuary...they did not discern the character of their actions, or realize what would be the fearful consequences of their sin. A fire blazed out from the holy of holies and consumed them. I guess God "withdrew His protection" for Nadab and Abihu FROM HIMSELF! But, no, "Not God!" How can we be so slow to give up cherished opinions in the face of such a weight of evidence? Blessings, Green Cochoa.
We can receive of heaven's light only as we are willing to be emptied of self. We can discern the character of God, and accept Christ by faith, only as we consent to the bringing into captivity of every thought to the obedience of Christ. And to all who do this, the Holy Spirit is given without measure. In Christ "dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily. And ye are complete in Him." [Colossians 2:9, 10.] {GW 57.1} -- Ellen White.
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Re: What is the Wrath of God?
[Re: Green Cochoa]
#154152
07/15/13 04:37 PM
07/15/13 04:37 PM
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OP
SDA
Active Member 2020
5500+ Member
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Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 6,368
Western, USA
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The death of Nadab and Abihu was the result of them going where they could not go, directly into the presence of God. "Fire from his presence destroyed them in their sin." This is not God saying "since you came into my presence, I'm going to kill you".
Who created the thorns and thistles Green? Are you still slow to give up your cherished opinion? "All tares are sown by the evil one. Every noxious herb is of his sowing, and by his ingenious methods of amalgamation he has corrupted the earth with tares. {16MR 247.2}"
Oh, that men might open their minds to know God as he is revealed in his Son! {ST, January 20, 1890}
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Re: What is the Wrath of God?
[Re: APL]
#154163
07/16/13 03:26 AM
07/16/13 03:26 AM
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SDA
Active Member 2021
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Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 7,003
The Orient
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APL, I can see how hard you are straining to come up with explanations that will fit your preconceived ideas. You are straining so hard, that you have come up with lies to fill the void, since the truth will not allow you to continue in your own opinion. For everyone who is willing to receive it, here is the truth. An example of the demoralizing effect of intoxicants is seen in the case of Nadab and Abihu. They ventured to partake of wine before they entered the tabernacle to perform the duties of their sacred office, and the result was, they could not distinguish between common fire and that which was consecrated to the holy service. For this breach of trust they were slain. Some will say, “If they were intoxicated, and could not discern the difference between these fires, why should they be punished?” When they placed the cup to their lips, they made themselves responsible for all their deeds committed while under its influence. {CTBH 18.2}
Nadab and Abihu were men in holy office; but by the use of wine their minds became so clouded that they could not distinguish between sacred and common things. By the offering of “strange fire” they disregarded God's command, and were slain by his judgments. {CTBH 28.4} We are explicitly told that they were slain for using common fire in place of sacred fire. APL, every priest, during the normal service of his office, entered the sanctuary. The presence of the Lord was there. It was not for this that they were slain, because if it had been a sin to enter God's presence to officiate in the priestly duties, then either no priest would ever have entered the sanctuary, or they would all have been slain upon entry. It is so sad to see people try to rationalize this hard in order to maintain an erroneous opinion. Won't you please reconsider? Open your heart to the truth. God wants you to trust Him above all. Blessings, Green Cochoa.
We can receive of heaven's light only as we are willing to be emptied of self. We can discern the character of God, and accept Christ by faith, only as we consent to the bringing into captivity of every thought to the obedience of Christ. And to all who do this, the Holy Spirit is given without measure. In Christ "dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily. And ye are complete in Him." [Colossians 2:9, 10.] {GW 57.1} -- Ellen White.
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Re: What is the Wrath of God?
[Re: Green Cochoa]
#154169
07/16/13 01:07 PM
07/16/13 01:07 PM
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SDA
Active Member 2024
5500+ Member
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Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 6,509
Midland
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Green, what lies is APL giving?
Cheerio,
kland.
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Re: What is the Wrath of God?
[Re: kland]
#154173
07/16/13 01:29 PM
07/16/13 01:29 PM
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SDA
Active Member 2021
5500+ Member
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Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 7,003
The Orient
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kland, APL claimed that Nadab and Abihu were killed for entering God's presence. That is simply untrue. The death of Nadab and Abihu was the result of them going where they could not go, directly into the presence of God. The priests could go into God's presence, and did so regularly. This was a part of their official duties. Nadab and Abihu were not slain for this. They were slain for bringing in common fire in place of the sacred. In other words, they were killed for their sin not for being in God's presence. Blessings, Green Cochoa.
We can receive of heaven's light only as we are willing to be emptied of self. We can discern the character of God, and accept Christ by faith, only as we consent to the bringing into captivity of every thought to the obedience of Christ. And to all who do this, the Holy Spirit is given without measure. In Christ "dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily. And ye are complete in Him." [Colossians 2:9, 10.] {GW 57.1} -- Ellen White.
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Re: What is the Wrath of God?
[Re: Green Cochoa]
#154179
07/16/13 03:48 PM
07/16/13 03:48 PM
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OP
SDA
Active Member 2020
5500+ Member
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Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 6,368
Western, USA
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kland, When I say Nadab and Abihu went where they could not go, that is a true statement. Green wants my statement to say, Nadab and Abihu NEVER could go into the presence. He neglects to say the whole truth. It required very special preparation to go into the presence of God. This, Nadab and Abihu did not do, thus, they COULD NOT GO IN and survive; my statement is true. Nadab and Abihu would never have committed that fatal sin had they not first become partially intoxicated by the free use of wine. They understood that the most careful and solemn preparation was necessary before presenting themselves in the sanctuary, where the divine Presence was manifested; but by intemperance they were disqualified for their holy office. Their minds became confused and their moral perceptions dulled so that they could not discern the difference between the sacred and the common. To Aaron and his surviving sons was given the warning: "Do not drink wine nor strong drink, thou, nor thy sons with thee, when ye go into the tabernacle of the congregation, lest ye die: {PP 361.3}
Men who have been set apart by the laying on of hands, to minister in sacred things, often stand in the desk with their mouths polluted, their lips stained, and their breath tainted with the defilements of tobacco. They speak to the people in Christ's stead. How can such service be acceptable to a holy God, who required the priests of Israel to make such special preparations before coming into his presence, lest his sacred holiness should consume them for dishonoring him, as in the case of Nadab and Abihu? {4aSG 127.2} So you see, Nadab and Abihu were disqualified from entering in, they could not go in. But I do not expect green to acknowledge he was wrong.
Oh, that men might open their minds to know God as he is revealed in his Son! {ST, January 20, 1890}
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