What do you mean by "certain practices"? Are talking about sinful practices? If not, which practices do you have in mind? If you do mean sinful practices, please point them out in the law of Moses. I am not aware of God including in the law of Moses certain sinful practices.


Was it is a sin for a Jew to obey the law of Moses? Did obeying any of the laws contained in the law of Moses involve sinning?


Do you believe the law of Moses describes how to practice certain sinful practices? If so, doesn't that mean obeying those particular laws would involve sinning? If so, how can it lead to the end of sinning?

Where does the law of Moses permit divorce for any reason?

Tom, please post quotes to support your assertion that God would have eventually taught the Jews that having slaves is wrong. Thank you.

I'm not sure it requires men to have slaves. It does, though, command them to treat slaves with love and kindness.

Do you think God "winked at" certain sinful practices in the law of Moses?


Yes, I totally agree with the idea that people are born with an instinctive knowledge of what is morally right and wrong. I do not, however, think people are born with an instinctive knowledge of the first four commandments. I believe people must learn about these commandments through Bible study and prayer.

If slavery is inherently wrong and sinful, though, why did God include it in the law of Moses? That is, why did He describe to the Jews the proper way to have their slaves?

Also, where in the Bible does God say it is wrong and sinful to have slaves in accordance with the law of Moses?

All the definitions of sin in the Bible boil down to "sin is the transgression of God's law." Do you agree with the following insights?

CON 75
The apostle gives us the true definition of sin. "Sin is the transgression of the law." {Con 75.2}

FW 117
John says, "Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law; for sin is the transgression of the law" (1 John 3:4). Here we have the true definition of sin; it is "the transgression of the law." {FW 117.2}

GC 493
Our only definition of sin is that given in the word of God; it is "the transgression of the law;" it is the outworking of a principle at war with the great law of love which is the foundation of the divine government. {GC 492.2}

OHC 141
What is to bring the sinner to the knowledge of his sins unless he knows what sin is? The only definition of sin in the Word of God is given us in 1 John 3:4. "Sin is the transgression of the law." {OHC 141.3}

7BC 951
"Sin is the transgression of the law." This is the only definition of sin. Without the law there can be no transgression. "By the law is the knowledge of sin." The standard of righteousness is exceeding broad, prohibiting every evil thing (MS 27, 1899). {7BC 951.3}

MM,

Where in the law does it tell us it is a sin to ignore suffering people?

Where in the law does it tell us that to do something outside of faith is sinning?

It seems to me that if one considers the OC laws as "the law" it is easy to miss the idea that "the law" is a transcript of God's character.

To truly keep the law one must love to do what is right and do everything with an unselfish motive. Neither of which can be done by the unconverted heart. The OC law hardly touches this truth. The NC, OTOH, make this point very clear.



So if the Law of Moses didn't require men to have slaves then how could one say that one could keep the law yet be guilty of sin by having a slave?

The true law is to treat everyone with love. That, followed to its logical conclusion, would eventually expose slavery for the gross sin that it is!

scott

Scott, Deut 24:1-4 does not permit divorce for any reason. Please consider the following commentary:

Deuteronomy 24 - The Law of Divorce and Other Various Laws

A. Divorce, remarriage and marriage.

1. (1) The law of divorce in ancient Israel.

When a man takes a wife and marries her, and it happens that she finds no favor in his eyes because he has found some uncleanness in her, and he writes her a certificate of divorce, puts it in her hand, and sends her out of his house,

a. A certificate of divorce: According to these laws, divorce was allowed in Israel, but carefully regulated. Under God’s law, the marriage contract cannot be simply dissolved as soon as one partner wants out; there must be cause for a certificate of divorce.

i. Even with cause, divorce was never to be seen as a preferred or easy option. The Hebrew word translated divorce has as its root the idea of “a hewing off, a cutting apart” - it is the amputation of that which is one flesh.

ii. “(Christians) all regard divorce as something like cutting up a living body, as a kind of surgical operation. Some think that the operation is so violent that it cannot be done at all; others admit that it is a desperate remedy in extreme cases. They are all agreed that it is more like having your legs cut off than it is like dissolving a business partnership or even deserting a regiment.” (C.S. Lewis)

b. He writes her a certificate of divorce: God commands here that any divorce be sealed with a certificate of divorce. In other words, it was not enough for a man to just declare “we’re divorced” to his wife. The divorce had to be recognized legally just as the marriage had been, so a certificate of divorce - a legal document - must be issued, and properly served (puts it in her hand).

c. She finds no favor in his eyes because he has found some uncleanness in her: This describes the grounds of divorce and indicates that a certificate of divorce could not be written for just any reason. It had to be founded on these two important clauses.

i. There has to be some uncleanness in her. Some later Rabbis defined uncleanness as anything in the wife which might displease the husband. At the time of Jesus, some Rabbis taught that if a wife burned her husband’s breakfast, he could divorce her.

ii. But Jesus carefully and properly defined what uncleanness is in Deuteronomy 24:1. He said, whoever divorces his wife, except for sexual immorality, and marries another, commits adultery (Matthew 19:9). Jesus rightly understood that uncleanness refers to sexual immorality, a broad term referring to sexual sin, which includes, but is not restricted to, sexual intercourse with someone who is not your spouse. The Hebrew word translated uncleanness in itself implies the meaning of sexual immorality; it is literally, “nakedness of a thing.”

iii. So, if a husband finds some uncleanness in her, he has the right to give his wife a certificate of divorce. But he is not obligated to do so. It must also be that she finds no favor in his eyes because he has found some uncleanness in her. In other words, it must be that the husband is so troubled at his wife’s sexual immorality that he simply cannot look upon her with favor in his eyes any more. The lack of favor in his eyes must be because of her uncleanness.

iv. This helps us understand what Jesus said in Matthew 19:8: Moses, because of the hardness of your hearts, permitted you to divorce your wives, but from the beginning it was not so. If a woman did not have a hard heart, she would never commit sexual immorality against her husband, and there would be no need for divorce. If a husband did not have any hardness in his heart, he could forgive and still look upon his wife with favor in his eyes, even though she was guilty of sexual immorality. But because God knows there is hardness in our hearts - both in the offending and offended parties - He grants permission for divorce.

v. In the days of Jesus, Rabbis taught that it was the duty of a godly man to divorce his wife if she displeased him. Both Moses and Jesus make it clear that God permits divorce in certain circumstances, but never commands it.

vi. Yet, if someone has Biblical grounds of divorce (which, according to 1 Corinthians 7:15, includes abandonment by an unbelieving spouse), they certainly do have permission to divorce, and God does not “hold it against them,” unless of course, He has specifically told them to not divorce and they are disobeying His specific word to their lives.

d. He writes her a certificate of divorce: Most people think that in ancient Israel, only husbands had the right to divorce their wives, and wives did not have the right of divorce. But what is said here may be intended to be applied to both husband and wife. Jesus, in Mark 10:12 says and if a woman divorces her husband and marries another, clearly saying that in His day, a wife had the right to divorce.

http://www.enduringword.com/commentaries/0524.htm

"Love thy neighbor."


It is inherent.


I don't see how anyone could miss it.


The OC explains how to keep the NC. They are not at odds.


Are you agreeing with me that it was not a sin for Jews to have slaves in accordance with the law of Moses?


In an ideal world there would be no slaves, no poor people, no employees, no presidents, no police, no military, etc. But sin makes such things unavoidable, therefore, managing them in a godly way is necessary. That's what the law of God helps us do. True, slavery can be avoided, but not in all cases. Sometimes it is a necessary evil. Not everyone in the world can afford or manage to work for themselves or to work for someone else.

Bump for Tom. See 102086, 102087, and 102088 above on this thread. Thank you.