James Saptenno, since the fruit of the Spirit is the fruit of faith doesn't it stand to reason good works are inevitable?

... even I must disagree with EGW.

M: James Saptenno, since the fruit of the Spirit is the fruit of faith doesn't it stand to reason good works are inevitable?

J: The only thing I disagree if a sinless perfect state is a stage a believer must achieve as a PREREQUISITE to enter heaven and have eternal life. I don't believe this, even I must disagree with EGW. Fruit of the Spirit is the fruit of faith, it is an acknowledgment, agreement and the act of faith in Christ. It is not our work, but God (Phil. 2:13). Thus, everything is a gift from God; faith, the Spirit, the works, justification, eternal life, heaven, which is all "in Christ" as a nutshell. So, whatever result to us (sinless perfect state, holiness), is a GIFT not a REWARD, is FREE not a PREREQUISITE. Therefore, all what is need from us human being to make these gifts which is already ours but kept "in Christ", is to believe the Scripture and accept Christ by faith, then you accept all these gifts at then end, if you maintain your faith in Him, for only if you withdrew from faith you will lost all these gifts (Hebrew 10:38). So, according to me, Christ is the focus of my faith, and not a state as a target for having a reward. I don't mind my "works", for it is polluted with "self", but i know I have Christ that is always ready and willing to forgive my sins, and he has done that before hand at the cross, what is asked from me is confessions and believe (Romans 10:9; 1 John 1:9). Will I reach that stage of sinless perfect state? I'm not worrying about that, for I'm saved by His grace through faith which is a free gift.

You wrote, "The only thing I disagree if a sinless perfect state is a stage a believer must achieve as a PREREQUISITE to enter heaven and have eternal life." The point is moot. Sinless perfection is inevitable. You can't have one without the other. Faith and works are inseparable. It's part of the package.

Good points. Thank you. I like the way you emphasize the fact nothing Jesus accomplishes in and through us (fruits of the Spirit) adds to what He accomplishes for us (pardon, salvation, eternal life).

You wrote "everything is a gift from God . . . the works". Amen! It is God who empowers believers to manifest the fruits of the Spirit (good works). "For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of his good pleasure." Such faith and works are sinless, perfect.

You asked, "Will I reach that stage of sinless perfect state?" You already have. "Christ in you, the hope of glory." Sinless perfection isn't something you earn or achieve. Like everything else, it is a gift. So long as you are abiding in Jesus and partaking of the divine nature you are perfectly sinless. "Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not."

You wrote, "The only thing I disagree if a sinless perfect state is a stage a believer must achieve as a PREREQUISITE to enter heaven and have eternal life." The point is moot. Sinless perfection is inevitable. You can't have one without the other. Faith and works are inseparable. It's part of the package.

You understand my viewpoint, thank you.

Even the point is moot, but I held to the point view in Titus 2:11-14, which is God's will and works in me as according to Phil 2:13, not "my works."

My "works" is as according to Isaiah 64:6; Romans 7:14-24; Romans 3:23.

So, I believe, there is no faith + works to be justified, as according to Ephesians 2:8,9; Romans 3:21-28.

If what is "works" is fruit of the Spirit, it is a consequence of putting faith in Christ and His Gospel, it is "inevitable."

Finally, there is no such a PREREQUISITE state to be justified.

"In Christ" is the complete salvation done at the cross, if we remain "in Christ" by faith, the GIFT of justification, sanctification, glorification and eternal life remains ours.

Thus, the only difference between me and you all who held to the principle of a sinless perfect stage as a prerequisite to be justified for entering heaven and eat the fruit of life is,

You:
Perfect sinless character is a must, not one single weakness, stain or spot might remain in a believer for his fitness for heaven. This stage is a Prerequisite for the FINAL justification based on works as according to the law. Therefore, believers must work hard, disciplined their bodies and minds to fulfill the righteous demands of the law, with the power of the Spirit, hence, a joint operation work. They stand at the judgment in their "own righteousness."

Me:
When the individual door of Probation closed, faithful believers got their sinless perfect character, and at Glorification, they got their sinless perfect body at transformation. It is all gifts from God. Whatever stain of character remain and less perfect, is perfected by God. At the judgment they stand in "Christ Righteousness" which is their fitness for heaven. The grace of God till the end, for those who remain "in Christ" by faith. For truly, eternal life is just a gift already ours believers and non believers, just made effective through faith in Christ, for justification. Thus, a sinless perfect state is not a prerequisite for justification to enter heaven.

Do you believe God will made perfect those believers who are imperfect? Or do you believe we must perfect? Is the same saying, do you believe God's grace through Christ is sufficient for eternal life, or do you believe it is not sufficient?

From your reply above, where is your view that sinless perfect character is a prerequisite for justification to enter heaven? I don't see it. Can you clarify, why it becomes a prerequisite?