"Running to and fro" does NOT mean by steam engine. The idiom means "earnest enquiry for renewed understanding by the awakening of interest." (Hab. 2:1-4)

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Limiting the word of God to a particular understanding that fits an individual's ideas and not considering the other possible meanings is like placing ones head in the sand. The sun may shine and the surroundings may be glorious, but the one with his head in the sand won't see any of it.

But in spite of your narrow reading of the text in Daniel about running to and fro, those studying the Scriptures in Christ's day did not generally have access to the complete Bible (old and new testaments) as we do today. "Earnest enquiry for renewed understanding by the awakening of interest" has also increased since Christ's day.

In 1844 Bible study (especially of Daniel) increased to the point that they thought they understood the day and hour of Christ's coming. Such an "earnest enquiry for renewed understanding" of Bible prophecy had never shaken the world to that extent since the time of the Apostles.

We have this promise in Proverbs 4:18 "But the path of the just is as the shining light, that shineth more and more unto the perfect day."

The shining of Scriptural understanding is more today than in ages past, but if your head remains in the sand how can you see it?

So then "running to and fro" does not mean by steam engine. In fact the idiom perfectly describes the acts of the Apostles of the first century church. They had the everlasting gospel to preach to every nation, kindred, tongue and people, and they did just that.

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Well, if you are saying I'm trying to understand what she says rather than what she actually said, you are doing the same.

According to you, then the bust received the deadly wound!


If they were right in the past that they were kingdoms, then why couldn't they still be kingdoms? What you are suggesting is confusion.

And just because more "light" will come, doesn't mean that nonsense "light" is valid light.

So shall we consider many other possible meanings? Have you considered heads to mean space shuttles crashing into the ocean, going through a mile of water, hitting the bottom and causing a great oil slick on the surface?

No? What limits should we put on considering possible meanings?

Da 2:44 These kings: <melek> 4430

Da 2:39 another kingdom <malkuw> 4437

You mess up again. That's at least twice now.

And I'm sure you'll say that it doesn't matter as it fits perfectly with how you interpret and you'll continue business as normal.....


Kingdoms, Realms, Reigns. What's the difference?


Could you give your interpretation of the four kingdoms/kings according to your "other possible meanings"?


Who's the first king and why?

Da 2:39 "But after you shall arise another kingdom inferior to yours; then another, a third kingdom of bronze, which shall rule over all the earth.

Who is the third kingdom/king and why is he likened to bronze?
Why is the forth likened to iron?


Da 5:16 "And I have heard of you, that you can give interpretations and explain enigmas. Now if you can read the writing and make known to me its interpretation, you shall be clothed with purple and have a chain of gold around your neck, and shall be the third ruler in the kingdom."

Could you explain how Daniel could be made the third ruler in the "king"?

Da 5:18 "O king, the Most High God gave Nebuchadnezzar your father a kingdom and majesty, glory and honor.

Who was the king that God gave Nebuchadnezzar?

Da 5:28 PERES; Thy kingdom is divided, and given to the Medes and Persians.

I can easily explain how a kingdom or realm is divided. Could you explain how a king is divided?

Da 5:31 And Darius the Mede received the kingdom, being about sixty-two years old.

You mean Darius received the king Belshazzar? Was it Belshazzar 62 years old or Darius? What did Darius do with the king after receiving him?

Da 6:1 ¶ It pleased Darius to set over the kingdom one hundred and twenty satraps, to be over the whole kingdom;

Was that Belshazzar he set over 120 satraps?

Da 6:3 Then this Daniel distinguished himself above the governors and satraps, because an excellent spirit was in him; and the king gave thought to setting him over the whole realm.

Who was the whole king which Darius was going to set Daniel over?

Need I go on? Do you understand? The last one was interpreted as "realm" which you think means "king". How can this make any sense according to how you interpret?

When a word like <melek> 4430 is kings, it means kings.

And when a word like <malkuw> 4437 that is translated in Daniel and every place else in the Bible as it appears in Daniel 5:20 is kingly, 6:3 realm, 6:28 reign; It can relate to the individual (kingly), realm (kingdom) or reign (length of rule).

you err by taking the word <melek> 4430 that Only Means King and redefining it to mean kingdom. And taking the word <malkuw> 4437 that can mean either king or kingdom and rigidly making it mean Kingdom.

How then can you have any understanding of Nebuchadnezzar's 4-king dynasty that was toppled by Cyrus, who was a type of Christ?

Without understanding the local application, you focus on the long-term interpretation that obscures everything but itself.

How then can you understand the endtime application?

I have given you the facts which you have trampled and twisted to make something that is clear opaque.

This piecemeal approach is not being a blessing. You need to read "America, the Obama Nation"

Then you will have the big picture. After that we might be able to clarify anything that may be unclear.

That is how you read it (limiting Scriptures to your ideas).

There are at least two meanings: The idiom "running to and fro" only partially describes the acts of the Apostles of the first century church. The idiom "running to and fro" also describes the literal meaning of people scurrying here and there that was made possible by the advent of the steam engine to literally fulfill the Scriptures in the 1800's when the Advent message blessed the world and even more so today when the meaning of Scripture that was sealed until the end is now understood more fully.

And the proclamation of the three angels' messages that was revealed to John at the close of the Apostolic period proves conclusively that the idiom "running to and fro" did not meet its full fulfillment in the acts of the Apostles of the first century church. The three angels' messages were not taught by the Apostles of the first century church. They preached no such messages.

It was not until folks literally began to "run to and fro" that Bible study revealed more fully the everlasting gospel that was then preach to every nation, kindred, tongue and people, and the Adventists did just what the idiom perfectly described of those who were awaiting Christ's Return so much so that they fired up the church in the 1800's.

So are you saying it is incorrect to understand that the metals of the image are the four empires that dominated the earth?

Now, I realize you want it both ways:
1. Giving a nodding acknowledgement to the foundational understanding of the Pioneers who recognized the Gold as Babylon, the Silver as Media Persia, the Bronze as Grecia, the iron as Rome, and the clay as the papacy.
2. But then I see you trying to refute the very foundation the above is built upon as you transplant the four beasts of Daniel 7 onto the second beast of Rev. 13 and calling them four presidents (kings) of the USA.

If the translators of Daniel 7 were wrong when they translated the chapter, then the pioneers would also have to be considered as being wrong. I'm not sure you even realize the deep trenches you dig under the foundation of the Adventist Pioneer's interpretation.

I've noticed this time and again -- you first give a nodding acknowledgment to the pioneer's interpretation but then attempt to refute the very foundation upon which it stands, in order to bring up a new theory.






The word "04437" malkuw (Aramaic) is translated kingdom (49x), reign (4x), realm (3x), kingly (1x) in the entire Bible (Only Ezra and Daniel use the word as it is Aramaic)

In the book of Daniel itself, "04437" is translated as kingdom (49x), reign (2x) and realm (1x) kingly (1x)

Realm and kingly could just as easily been translated as kingdom as well.

This tells me that KINGDOM is the meaning of the word.
Daniel used the word 49 times as he wrote about kingdoms.

Da 2:39 "But after you shall arise another kingdom inferior to yours; then another, a third kingdom of bronze, which shall rule over all the earth.




Thank you for asking.
No, that is not what I am saying.

The translation as in the 1612 KJV was correct until the prophecy was unsealed in the time of the end and more light came. The partial understanding of the past kingdoms then yields to Heaven's interpretation that is for the endtime as explained in Da. 7:17. The endtime interpretation could not be understood until the kings from the earth arose any more than the 4-kingdoms could be understood before they took their place in history.


I never took you to be a slow learner. But I have always (as far back as my first book that I began in 1997) stated that there are 3 applications to Daniel's prophecy:

1.The local application that begins the prophecy that is addressed to kings Nebuchadnezzar (you are this head of gold), Evil-Meridoch, Neglisser, Nabonidus and Belshazar.

2. The foundational understanding of the Pioneers who recognized the Gold as Babylon, the Silver as Media Persia, the Bronze as Grecia, the iron as Rome, and the clay as the papacy, which follows the prophecy from its beginning to the time of the end when knowledge is increased.

3. The four beasts of Daniel 7 are four kings from the earth (4-American Presidents-- see 7:17 & Rev 13).

When heaven's interpretation in Da. 7:17 is applied to the prophecy (7:1-9) lion-Reagan, bear-Bush, leopard-Clinton, beast #4 Bush II & Obama.

The ten horns from the sea beast are understood well (Da. 7) and they left off with the little horn papacy. Specifically the little horn is Pope John-Paul II when Reagan, Bush I and Clinton fulfill the prophecy.

But with the earth-beasts as Reagan, Bush I, Clinton and Bush II & Obama the earth-beasts ten horns are Truman through Clinton. And the three that Pope-John-Paul II plucked up with his charisma are Reagan, Bush I and Clinton.

Then when the papal beast of Rev 13 explains Daniel 7; the state of the papal beast is HEALED = post 1929.

The heads on the papal beast (rev. 13) depict the popes are Pius XI & XII, John XXIII, Paul VI, John-Paul I & II, and Benedict XVI.

The ten horns on the HEALED papal beast's seven heads are Presidents Truman thru Clinton.

Then the papal beast transitions to the earth beast (rev 13).

The transitional pope is Benedict because he ended the one pope healed papacy.

And the American beast that it transitions to has 2 horns (the two presidents identified in Daniel 7 as the 4th beast) Bush II and Obama. In Revelation 13 they are the lamblike horns on the earth beast. They claim to be christian, but speak like the dragon.

Benedict has resigned and Pope Francis I is pope.

So the papacy has transitioned from the healed papacy that had one pope at a time through 2013 to one that has a retired pope and a sitting pope.

Likewise the Presidents from Truman through Clinton were linked to the first beast in Rev 13. Thus Bush II (retired) and Obama (sitting President) are in the image of the current papacy. The only thing remaining to form the image-beast is to implement a national Sunday law.

Ready or not: The last events will be rapid ones.

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My research agrees with your facts and the (49x) kingdoms could just as easily have been translated as:

1) royalty, reign, kingdom
1a) royalty, kingship, kingly authority
1b) kingdom
1c) realm (of territory)
1d) reign (of time)

This tells me that KINGDOM is the meaning of the word only because the translators believed the 4-kingdom mode.

Daniel used the word "04437" malkuw (Aramaic) 49 times as he wrote about the endtime meaning that Heaven was explaining.

Heaven explained --Da. 7:17 "These great beasts, which are four, are four kings, which shall arise out of the earth."

But the translators ignored heaven's explanation that these beasts were kings and converted them back into kingdoms (7:18, 23, etc) when they could have easily chosen another rendition that would have harmonized with Heaven's interpretation.

More light is shinning on the prophecies of Daniel as knowledge is increased and God prepares to wrap it up.