I chose the screen name ProdigalOne because the Father rejoices and forgives those who turn away from the world and return to Him.
If the sinner does not turn away from sin and does not seek God, then there can be no forgiveness, no salvation, only fearful waiting for the execution of judgement when the anger of God is expressed. It is the sinner's choice: punishment, or salvation.

Whether we choose deliverance or destruction, the Lord is not to blame for our decisions.



"And found in the temple those that sold oxen and sheep and doves, and the changers of money sitting:
And when he had made a scourge of small cords, he drove them all out of the temple, and the sheep, and the oxen; and poured out the changers' money, and overthrew the tables". John 2:14-15

"...Jesus rebuked this unholy traffic. Divinity flashed through humanity, as He went into the temple of God, “and overthrew the tables of the moneychangers, and the seats of them that sold doves; ... saying unto them, Is it not written, My house shall be called ... the house of prayer? but ye have made it a den of thieves”" (Mark 11:15-17). – {1MR 207.3}


"Jesus is the EXACT representation of what God is like. If you have seen Christ, you have seen the Father."

I agree completely! The quotes above from SOP and John, show that there are times when Jesus; and therefore the Father, is angry with people.


"...when he had made a scourge of small cords, he drove them all out of the temple".

Does it seem to you that Jesus was "angry" at these people who were desecrating His Father's House? It would appear there are things that make Him "lash out at people"!

I ask over and over again because you bring it up over and over again. However, you have never truly, clearly answered the question. I can recall one time you saying the reason God permits evil men and evil angels to torture and kill innocent women and children is because He honors, respects their freedom to think and do as they please. But your answer ignores the desires of the innocent women and children who pray earnestly for safety and protection. Your view implies God chooses to dishonor, disrespect the pleas of the innocent choosing rather to honor, respect the plans of the evil. All throughout history God has repeatedly chosen to intervene and prevent the evil plans of evil men and evil angels. And He did so without violating their freedom to think and do.

So, the question remains - Why does Jesus choose to intervene and prevent the evil plans of evil men and evil angels? And why does He sometimes choose not to intervene and prevent their evil plans? Why does Jesus sometimes withdraw His protection and permit evil men and evil angels to torture and kill innocent women and children?

Again, you have never clearly answered this question. You boast of a loving God and, yet, somehow you are okay with Him allowing evil men and evil angels to torture and kill innocent women and children. I have no doubt you will avoid answering my questions. To each his own.

The mark of deliverance has been set upon those "that sigh and that cry for all the abominations that be done." Now the angel of death goes forth, represented in Ezekiel's vision by the men with the slaughtering weapons, to whom the command is given: "Slay utterly old and young, both maids, and little children, and women: but come not near any man upon whom is the mark; and begin at My sanctuary." Says the prophet: "They began at the ancient men which were before the house." Ezekiel 9:1-6. The work of destruction begins among those who have professed to be the spiritual guardians of the people. The false watchmen are the first to fall. There are none to pity or to spare. Men, women, maidens, and little children perish together. {GC 656.2}

"The Lord cometh out of His place to punish the inhabitants of the earth for their iniquity: the earth also shall disclose her blood, and shall no more cover her slain." Isaiah 26:21. "And this shall be the plague wherewith the Lord will smite all the people that have fought against Jerusalem; Their flesh shall consume away while they stand upon their feet, and their eyes shall consume away in their holes, and their tongue shall consume away in their mouth. And it shall come to pass in that day, that a great tumult from the Lord shall be among them; and they shall lay hold everyone on the hand of his neighbor, and his hand shall rise up against the hand of his neighbor." Zechariah 14:12, 13. In the mad strife of their own fierce passions, and by the awful outpouring of God's unmingled wrath, fall the wicked inhabitants of the earth--priests, rulers, and people, rich and poor, high and low. "And the slain of the Lord shall be at that day from one end of the earth even unto the other end of the earth: they shall not be lamented, neither gathered, nor buried." Jeremiah 25:33. {GC 656.3}

So, you have to turn to him or else! What would God do to those that to not turn to him? Get mad, then torture and kill you, right? So, turn to Him or He will execute you. Nice. This is, "Love me, or I'll kill you". What draws us to God? The fear of punishment? So we don't hold God responsible when He tortures sinners. Did Christ hit people with His whip? Did Christ "lash out at people?" You put this in quotes. Why? Where you quoting something or someone? Christ never hit anyone. What happened right after Christ cleansed the temple? The poor did not flee. The children came to Him. They were not afraid. I don't think you understand what really happened. Did Christ ever hit anyone? Did Christ ever kill anyone? No.

I know of only place that EGW speaks of God being angry. And that is NOT as you say, those the write Sunday laws. What situation did EGW write this as this is on topic with this thread.

Really. What is God's wrath? What is the "wrath of the lamb?" A lamb is a baby sheep. Are they wrathful? Read Romans 1 where His wrath is clearly defined.

What draws you to God? A fear of punishment?

APL, you are avoiding my questions - just as I predicted. Is it because you don't have answers? If so, no big deal. It's understandable. There are "strange" things about God He hasn't explained yet.


I find it shocking you believe the description and explanation in the passage posted above refers to God withdrawing His protection and giving evil angels permission to execute justice and punishment on His behalf. Evil angels vindicating God's retribution. Amazing.

APL, who will issue the command described above? Do you agree it is Jesus? Or, do you believe it is Satan? Again, I suspect you will avoid this question.

MM - I have answered you questions abundantly repeatedly. You choose to take a few isolated texts, and build your belief. You ignore references which unlock others. You take verses which support your violent view of God and ignore those that prove Him to be just the opposite. I can't change you, that is not my role. Only the Spirit can do that. Take the word as a whole. ONLY then can you see the truth as it is in Jesus. If all you do is use key text study, you will fail every time to see the Truth. I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God to salvation to every one that believes. If you know your Bible, you know where that reference is located and what follows. You quote Great Controversy, but refuse to take it as a whole ignoring Chapter 1.

What draws you to God? A fear of punishment? Does God say, "Love Me, or I'll kill you?"

Prodigal what's going on in Florida that you referred to initially?

APL, I am not comfortable doing what you do, namely, interpret passages which plainly say God executes justice and punishment to mean God permits evil men and evil angels to torture and kill people. I believe both scenarios are true - 1) God executes justice and punishment, and 2) God permits evil men and evil angels to torture and kill people. I also believe it is a grave disservice to interpret plainly worded passages to mean something they clearly do not say or mean.

No, you have not answered my questions. You have never answered them. So, the question remains - Why does Jesus choose to intervene and prevent the evil plans of evil men and evil angels? And why does He sometimes choose not to intervene and prevent their evil plans? Why does Jesus sometimes withdraw His protection and permit evil men and evil angels to torture and kill innocent women and children?

Again, you have never answered these questions. Never. If you believe you have, please repost it here. Otherwise, simply say so now.

Bump for APL: