The mighty angel who instructed John was no less a personage than Jesus Christ. Setting His right foot on the sea, and His left upon the dry land, shows the part which He is acting in the closing scenes of the great controversy with Satan. This position denotes His supreme power and authority over the whole earth. The controversy had waxed stronger and more determined from age to age, and will continue to do so, to the concluding scenes when the masterly working of the powers of darkness shall reach their height. Satan, united with evil men, will deceive the whole world and the churches who receive not the love of the truth. But the mighty angel demands attention. He cries with a loud voice. He is to show the power and authority of His voice to those who have united with Satan to oppose the truth.
After these seven thunders uttered their voices, the injunction comes to John as to Daniel in regard to the little book: "Seal up those things which the seven thunders uttered." These relate to future events which will be disclosed in their order. Daniel shall stand in his lot at the end of the days. John sees the little book unsealed. Then Daniel's prophecies have their proper place in the first, second, and third angels' messages to be given to the world. The unsealing of the little book was the message in relation to time.
The books of Daniel and the Revelation are one. One is a prophecy, the other a revelation; one a book sealed, the other a book opened. John heard the mysteries which the thunders uttered, but he was commanded not to write them.
The special light given to John which was expressed in the seven thunders was a delineation of events which would transpire under the first and second angels' messages. It was not best for the people to know these things, for their faith must necessarily be tested. In the order of God most wonderful and advanced truths would be proclaimed. The first and second angels' messages were to be proclaimed, but no further light was to be revealed before these messages had done their specific work. This is represented by the angel standing with one foot on the sea, proclaiming with a most solemn oath that time should be no longer.
This time, which the angel declares with a solemn oath, is not the end of this world's history, neither of probationary time, but of prophetic time, which should precede the advent of our Lord. That is, the people will not have another message upon definite time. After this period of time, reaching from 1842 to 1844, there can be no definite tracing of the prophetic time. The longest reckoning reaches to the autumn of 1844.
The angel's position, with one foot on the sea, the other on the land, signifies the wide extent of the proclamation of the message. It will cross the broad waters and be proclaimed in other countries, even to all the world. The comprehension of truth, the glad reception of the message, is represented in the eating of the little book. The truth in regard to the time of the advent of our Lord was a precious message to our souls (MS 59, 1900).

I have to say here, non-Adventist Christians are often more spiritually awake than most of us. A sizable percentage of non-Adventists have now rejected the pre-tribulation rapture and are fully expecting the trumpets to sound at any time. They are often more repentant and zealous than we are. Blessed are the poor in spirit for theirs is the kingdom of heaven. It's not what you know prophetically or otherwise, it's who you know. The fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom. Many of these are already Sabbath keepers. Will the Lord have to bypass us as He did the Jews? We're at a time when He has started to gather the remnant of Israel's 12 tribes, the children of Abraham by faith, whether by blood or by adoption. None will be overlooked, but all will be children of faith.

It would be more truthful for you to say "I've been REJECTING HC's (Henry's) posts for approximately twenty years now."

The record is very clear. You must also remember one of our discussions where I misspoke and you posted a "thesis" that focused on my typo. But when I read your post, I immediately corrected the typo and my position was proven to be correct, BUT you refused to allow my reply to be posted on your forum and your error was allowed to stand. Had you been more willing to dialog through the years rather than to criticize, we both may have been blessed.



God's promise is that knowledge of the book of Daniel would increase. Before knowledge increased I did not understand everything about Bill Clinton. But I did understand how his affair with Monica fulfilled prophecy. So you remember the part I got wrong but not the part that I got right.

When Bill Clinton left office I expected Albert (6) Arnold (6) Gore II (6) to be elected President and he was, but George (6) Walker (6) Bush (4) stole the election from him with the help of the judges that his dad appointed to the Supreme Court. Then George (6) Walker (6) (President) Bush II (6) was the last man that I could see in the prophecy. I had to study some more.

Then between September 2011 to September 2012, I correctly stated (tweeted it 8 times) that Pope Benedict would not be pope after the the Spring of 2013 and he left office in February 2013. Knowledge is increasing.

I had to go back to see how President Barack Obama fit into the prophecy. Then knowledge increased and I learned how his number was (666) but President Trump now makes it look like I have not learned anything yet. But he is fulfilling prophecy and strengthening America's position on the world stage.

Knowledge is increasing. I called Brexit before it happened. And I understood when the "Other Angel" began to sound and the time allotted for the Judgment of the Living ended.

If President Trump lasts in office past 19 January 2018, I will have been wrong about my understanding about Bible prophecy. From my current understanding by 19 January 2018 Obama will have to be back in office or Christ will have to Come.

Because God's word is sure. When the vision in Daniel 7 that has been used traditionally to interpret the interpretation, the final meaning of the prophecy is different than when the interpretation is used to interpret the vision. Sea and earth are not the same. Sea beasts are not earth kings. Sea and earth are different.

And you look at the record and see major mistakes. I keep studying and praying to learn and to grow in Jesus and my understanding increases.

As knowledge continues to increase, I will continue to adjust my understanding accordingly.

Can you say the same thing of yourself? Have you ever ventured forth in faith? Have you ever grown beyond making insinuations and accusations that distort my views? Have you ever really reasoned with me? I have not seen it through the last 20 years.

Also HC I think there is some basis for your claim that prophet time, the day/year principle ended in 1844 not literal time prophecies. I'd be interested in what others have to say on that point. I'm sure most would say "prophetic time" means "prophetic time" whether day/year or literal. So what do you say to that HC?

By the way I just reviewed your post again on this at the bottom of page 5 and you give some reasons but don't quote the passages. I'd be grateful if you gave an example or two of her use of the phrase "prophetic time" and/or that quote you mentioned about worldly men asserting that all prophecies are lies.

I was a firm believer in definite time in 1844, but this prophetic time was not shown me in vision... There were many proclaiming a new time after this, but I was shown that we should not have another definite time to proclaim. 16MR 177.2

That is, the people will not have another message upon definite time. After this period of time, reaching from 1842 to 1844, there can be no definite tracing of the prophetic time. The longest reckoning reaches to the autumn of 1844… The truth in regard to the time of the advent of our Lord was a precious message to our souls. 19MR 319.3 - 321.2

They were correct in their reckoning of the prophetic periods; prophetic time closed in 1844, and Jesus entered the most holy place to cleanse the sanctuary at the ending of the days.EW 243.2

Active preachers and exhorters in 1844, now seemed to have lost their moorings, and did not know where we were in prophetic time; they were fast uniting with the spirit of the world. LS88 205.1

Many of them have denied the prophetic time and the fulfillment of prophecy, because the time passed in 1844, and did not bring the expected event. LS88 221.1

The angel standing with one foot on the sea, proclaiming with a most solemn oath that time should be no longer. This time which the angel declares…reaches to the autumn of 1844…in regard to the time of the advent of our Lord… 1MR 99.3-100.1

The prophetic time…for the coming of the Lord. LS 57.3

The world placed all time proclamation on the same level... Our position has been one of waiting and watching, with no time proclamation to intervene between the close of the prophetic periods in 1844 and the time of the Lord’s coming. We do not know the day nor the hour, or when the definite time is, and yet the prophetic reckoning shows us that Christ is at the door. 16MR 178.2

There will never again be a message for the people of God that will be based on time. We are not to know the definite time either for the outpouring of the Holy Spirit or for the coming of Christ. 1SM 188.1

Oic... George H.W. Bush stole the election for his son and undermined God's prophecy? I don't believe that.

Well, I hope you will learn present truth His Child Henry before it is too late.

32 But of that day and that hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels which are in heaven, neither the Son, but the Father.
33 Take ye heed, watch and pray: for ye know not when the time is.
34 For the Son of man is as a man taking a far journey, who left his house, and gave authority to his servants, and to every man his work, and commanded the porter to watch.
35 Watch ye therefore: for ye know not when the master of the house cometh, at even, or at midnight, or at the cockcrowing, or in the morning:
36 Lest coming suddenly he find you sleeping.
37 And what I say unto you I say unto all, Watch.

35 Let your loins be girded about, and your lights burning;
36 And ye yourselves like unto men that wait for their lord, when he will return from the wedding; that when he cometh and knocketh, they may open unto him immediately.
37 Blessed are those servants, whom the lord when he cometh shall find watching: verily I say unto you, that he shall gird himself, and make them to sit down to meat, and will come forth and serve them.
38 And if he shall come in the second watch, or come in the third watch, and find them so, blessed are those servants.

39 And this know, that if the goodman of the house had known what hour the thief would come, he would have watched, and not have suffered his house to be broken through.
40 Be ye therefore ready also: for the Son of man cometh at an hour when ye think not.

Let's set aside question on what Ellen White meant about time prophecies, and instead go to the Bible. Above already is one parable about the virgins who, whether good or bad, didn't know what time to expect.

The parable given is that the servants didn't know when their master would return. These are not bad servants. It was simply the case that they didn't know what time to watch for, and so were to watch continuously while diligently carrying out their work. In none of the parables regarding the second coming are we given an indication that those in the parable knew what time to expect.

Again, the fact that the servants were waiting and watching shows us that they didn't already know what time to look for. The possibility is presented that the return could be at various times.

The Bible is consistent on this point: we don't, can't, and won't know the time of the second coming until it is upon us.

There are still many things that we don't know about Revelation, as well as many conflicting theories, and they need careful and focused study combined always with prayer. I was thinking just today that Revelation is evidence of God, as it's clear that there's a great truth just beyond the horizon and that we can't comprehend by our own wisdom. No human mind could have produced something so perfect and yet also so difficult to fathom.

The message for this time is to fear God, who made heaven and earth. To flee the deceptions of the world. To worship God only and keep all of His commandments. This message is not one of time setting beyond the fact of judgment having begun in 1844. This is the message that all of us, including you, are called to give.

As I said in the other thread, "whether or not Ellen White was referring specifically to just calculating the time of the second coming, the act of calculating events since 1844 does end up being an attempt to do exactly that through a route of reasoning by elimination."


Do you see what this is? You've set a deadline for Jesus's second coming - and this isn't the first one I've seen from you.

Even if you were right about what Ellen White meant about calculating time, this is still just what she said not to do and is the real point of time prophecies after 1844. Every attempt I know of to calculate time post 1844, whether by presidents, popes, or jubilees, leads one directly to an attempt to calculate, even if approximately, the approach of the second coming if not the exact date.