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Re: The Book of Revelation -- 1st Quarter 2019 [Re: kland] #188917
03/27/19 08:41 AM
03/27/19 08:41 AM
His child  Offline
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Posts: 1,673
TN, USA
Originally Posted By: kland
His child, I'm looking for facts. Including evidence from the Bible.

1417. duo duo, doo'-o
a primary numeral; "two":--both, twain, two.

The definition doesn't say four nor is it used as four in the Bible.

Mt 4:18 And Jesus, walking by the Sea of Galilee, saw two <1417> brothers, Simon called Peter, and Andrew his brother, casting a net into the sea; for they were fishermen.

Simon and Andrew were 2, not four.

Re 9:12 One woe is past. Behold, still two <1417> more woes are coming after these things.

There were a total of 3 woes, not 5 woes.

Re 13:5 And he was given a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies, and he was given authority to continue for forty-two <1417> months.

He continued 40 and 2 months, not 40 and 4 months.

Re 13:11 Then I saw another beast coming up out of the earth, and he had two <1417> horns like a lamb and spoke like a dragon.

It had 2 horns, not 4 horns.


Kland,

Dig a little deeper:

Quote:
"Later on the Lord commissioned seventy other disciples and sent them off in [ana] twos [duo] as advance-parties into every town and district where he intended to go.(Luke 10:1, Philips)


Quote:
"After these things the Lord appointed other seventy also, and sent them two and two before his face into every city and place, whither he himself would come." (KJV)


Duo only occurs once in Luke 10:1 but KJV translates it as 2 and 2 and Philips renders it as TWOS. Duo is also twos or 2 & 2.

Quote:
The prophecies of Daniel and of John REVELATION] are to be understood. They interpret each other. They give to the world truths which every one should understand. These prophecies are to be witnesses in the world. By their fulfillment in these last days they will explain themselves. {7BC 949.6} [bracketed and large text mine]


Here is how Daniel and Revelation explain themselves by their fulfillment:

Timing of Daniel 7:9 is the 1844 Judgment.

After 1844 Daniel 7 reveals 9/11/01, i.e., Season and time (7:12): 4 seasons in a year. A Prophetic year=360 days. A season is 90 days [1/4 of year]. A day in Bible prophecy can be a year. A time can also be a year. 90 days=90 years and 1 year = 91 years.

Endtime beasts are: Presidents Reagan (lion), Bush I (bear), and Clinton (leopard with 4 heads), who are the 3 kings from the prophetic earth (USA). Bush II is the beginning of the indescribable beast.

The pope speaking great words after 1844 when 9/11/01 occurred was John-Paul II (he spoke dies domoni that changed God's Sabbath to Sunday). John-Paul II plucked up Reagan (he declared pope political leader= healing deadly political wound on US behalf). John-Paul II plucked up Bush I (he said pope was "World's Moral Leader" = head of all churches = healing deadly spiritual wound on US behalf). John-Paul II plucked up Clinton (he said "this guy is on my side").

After 1844, Reagan turned 90 years old 2/6/2001. 9/11/01 marked his 91st year with an event of enormous importance. Daniel 7 states that the 3 beasts (lion, bear, leopard) would be alive (at the same time) and out of office). "As concerning the rest of the beasts, they had their dominion taken away: yet their lives were prolonged for a season and time" (Daniel 7:12).

From 9/11/01 Pope John-Paul II lived 42 FULL months. Oct. Nov, Dec 2001; 12 in 2002; 12 in 2003; 12 in 2004; Jan, Feb, March 2005=42 FULL months. There was some time left over = 42 months and 20 days.

Bible writers used the Hebrew calendar. It is a lunar calendar that adds a month (Adar 1) routinely to keep it in sync with the solar calendar. From 9/11/01 to the day Pope John-Paul II died Adar I was added exactly twice. In fact, he died 42 plus 2 months to the very day from 9/11/01 to 4/2/05 on the Hebrew lunar calendar.

By their fulfillment Daniel 7 and Revelation 13 explain how Pope John-Paul II continued 42 plus 2 months from 9/11/01 to 4/2/05.

Quote:
The thirteenth chapter of Revelation presents a power that is to be made prominent in these last days.{18MR 33.2}


Quote:
[Revelation 13:4-10 quoted.] This entire chapter is a revelation of what will surely take place[Revelation 13:11, 15-17 quoted] (MS 88, 1897). {7BC 979.10}


This quote was written after 1844. Ellen White wrote out these verses (which includes the 42 months) in long hand. If she did not intend to say that the 42 months will surely take place that they would be fulfilled in the endtime, she would not have written that verse in her statement.

But she did write it and it was fulfilled as 42 plus 2 months when prophecy met its final fulfillment. And because the DUO in the 42 months f Revelation 13:5 was fulfilled as 2 & 2, the next time that duo occurs in Revelation 13:11, it is clear that it is not 2, but 2 & 2.

How do we know that?

The first beast in Revelation 13 is the papacy. It's deadly wound was first partially healed in 1929. From 1929 until 2013 it had exactly 7 heads/popes: Pius XI & XII, John XXIII, Paul VI, John-Paul I & II, and Benedict XVI.

The pope is a head because the head/pope received the deadly wound when Pius VI was taken captive by the French.

Quote:
Pius VI... This is the pope specified in prophecy, which received the deadly wound. He was carried captive {5MR 318.1}


Quote:
one of his heads as it were wounded to death Revelation 13:3


Revelation 13 transitions from the papal beast to the earth beast during the reign of the 7th head/Pope Benedict XVI. The second beast has 2 horns.

Quote:
the great horn that [is] between his eyes [is] the first king Daniel 8:21


The horn/king/president on the earth beast that received authority as the endtime Protestant Prince of the covenant (see my study on Daniel 9) was George Bush II. Thus during the reign of Benedict XVI, the prophecy transitioned from the papal beast to America. Bush II was the president at the time. The next horn was Obama. If there were only 2 horns that is the end of the prophecy. But since (DUO) 2 was fulfilled as 2 & 2 in Revelation 13:5 THE 2 lamblike HORNS must be fulfilled as 2 & 2 horns in 13:11.

They have been Presidents: Bush II, Obama, and Trump. That leaves one final earth-beast horn/President to yet come to fulfill the count.

Quote:
when the Papacy, robbed of its strength, was forced to desist from persecution, John beheld a new power coming up to echo the dragon's voice, and carry forward the same cruel and blasphemous work. This power, the last that is to wage war against the church and the law of God, was symbolized by a beast with lamblike horns. {ST, November 1, 1899 par. 4}


This power (the USA) only has 4 horns. Bush II, Obama, Trump, AND...

Quote:
And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince...and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation [even] to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book. Daniel 12:1


As I read it Michael Pence is the great prince of America's Covenant that will stand for his people. He is the last horn of the 2 & 2 horns on the earth beast that is to wage war against God's people. Then Michael (Christ) will deliver His people.

There is more.


Quote:
And I heard, but I understood not: then said I, O my Lord, what [shall be] the end of these [things]? And he said, Go thy way, Daniel: for the words [are] closed up and sealed till the time of the end. Many shall be purified, and made white, and tried; but the wicked shall do wickedly: and none of the wicked shall understand; but the wise shall understand. Daniel 12:8-10


From 1997 when the LORD called me to study Daniel and Revelation, I have written a dozen books on it and most recently "The Last Trump Shall Sound". 170 pages, no fluff. Just giving the prophecies, their fulfillment and Spirit of Prophecy references.

If necessary, I can start a thread and post it page by page. What say you?








Last edited by His child; 03/27/19 09:28 AM.

"Ignorance is sin, when knowledge can be obtained" (HR, September 1, 1866 par. 3). www.loudcry101.com
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Re: The Book of Revelation -- 1st Quarter 2019 [Re: His child] #188923
03/28/19 01:15 PM
03/28/19 01:15 PM
K
kland  Offline
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5500+ Member
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 6,512
Midland
Originally Posted By: His child

Kland,

Dig a little deeper:

Quote:
"Later on the Lord commissioned seventy other disciples and sent them off in [ana] twos [duo] as advance-parties into every town and district where he intended to go.(Luke 10:1, Philips)


Quote:
"After these things the Lord appointed other seventy also, and sent them two and two before his face into every city and place, whither he himself would come." (KJV)


Duo only occurs once in Luke 10:1 but KJV translates it as 2 and 2 and Philips renders it as TWOS. Duo is also twos or 2 & 2.
Incorrect.

KJV translates [ana] [duo] as two and two.

Why did you emphasize ana?

303. ana

a primary preposition and adverb; properly, up; but (by extension) used (distributively) severally, or (locally) at (etc.):--and, apiece, by, each, every (man), in, through. In compounds (as a prefix) it often means (by implication) repetition, intensity, reversal, etc.

1417. duo

a primary numeral; "two":--both, twain, two.

Lu 10:1 (NKJV) After these things the Lord appointed seventy others also, and sent them two by two before His face into every city and place where He Himself was about to go.


Ana used here means repetition. Repetition of the following word, duo. Without ana, duo would only mean two rather than two by two.

And if I could post a picture, I could show you what the Interlinear Scripture has. It has
"he-dispatches them up two two before face of-him".
"apesteilen autoous ana duo duo pro prosOpou autou"

Notice the two duos.

Mr 6:7 And He called the twelve to Himself, and began to send them out two by two, and gave them power over unclean spirits.

Mark has the Greek <duo> <duo>. That is twice. One duo would only be 2. And, what do you say? Did Christ send them out by twos or by fours?

Rev 13.5 has only ONE duo. It is preceded by 40. Maybe you should consistently incorrectly translate it as 40 duos, that is 80.


His Child, perhaps you should search for your emphasized word, "ana" <303>.

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Re: The Book of Revelation -- 1st Quarter 2019 [Re: kland] #188931
03/29/19 11:50 PM
03/29/19 11:50 PM
His child  Offline
SDA
Active Member 2020
Very Dedicated Member
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 1,673
TN, USA
Originally Posted By: kland
Originally Posted By: His child

Kland,

Dig a little deeper:

Quote:
"Later on the Lord commissioned seventy other disciples and sent them off in [ana] twos [duo] as advance-parties into every town and district where he intended to go.(Luke 10:1, Philips)


Quote:
"After these things the Lord appointed other seventy also, and sent them two and two before his face into every city and place, whither he himself would come." (KJV)


Duo only occurs once in Luke 10:1 but KJV translates it as 2 and 2 and Philips renders it as TWOS. Duo is also twos or 2 & 2.
Incorrect.

KJV translates [ana] [duo] as two and two.

Why did you emphasize ana?

303. ana

a primary preposition and adverb; properly, up; but (by extension) used (distributively) severally, or (locally) at (etc.):--and, apiece, by, each, every (man), in, through. In compounds (as a prefix) it often means (by implication) repetition, intensity, reversal, etc.

1417. duo

a primary numeral; "two":--both, twain, two.

Lu 10:1 (NKJV) After these things the Lord appointed seventy others also, and sent them two by two before His face into every city and place where He Himself was about to go.


Ana used here means repetition. Repetition of the following word, duo. Without ana, duo would only mean two rather than two by two.

And if I could post a picture, I could show you what the Interlinear Scripture has. It has
"he-dispatches them up two two before face of-him".
"apesteilen autoous ana duo duo pro prosOpou autou"

Notice the two duos.

Mr 6:7 And He called the twelve to Himself, and began to send them out two by two, and gave them power over unclean spirits.

Mark has the Greek <duo> <duo>. That is twice. One duo would only be 2. And, what do you say? Did Christ send them out by twos or by fours?

Rev 13.5 has only ONE duo. It is preceded by 40. Maybe you should consistently incorrectly translate it as 40 duos, that is 80.


His Child, perhaps you should search for your emphasized word, "ana" <303>.


By their fulfillment Daniel and Revelation explain themselves.

IMHO, Since Pope John-Paul II fulfilled the 42 months as 42 full month and exactly 42 plus 2 to the very day on the Hebrew calendar, your point lacks validity. All the pieces of the puzzle taken together make it clear.

But It boils down to Christ's question "How readest thou?"

And Daniel's prophecy: "The wise will understand."

When all is said and done we will soon discover if that be ye or me.


"Ignorance is sin, when knowledge can be obtained" (HR, September 1, 1866 par. 3). www.loudcry101.com
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Re: The Book of Revelation -- 1st Quarter 2019 [Re: dedication] #188938
03/31/19 12:47 PM
03/31/19 12:47 PM
His child  Offline
SDA
Active Member 2020
Very Dedicated Member
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 1,673
TN, USA
Kland,

I thought about your last post a little more since I replied. When ana is used in Luke 10:1, your position is that it means repeat. Thus you read it as repeat duo. I consider the passage and note that ana means by thus I read that Jesus sent them out by twos.

Both readings are correct, but to understand that duo is two (or both) twos makes a significant difference on the probability that under some circumstances two is twos.

If that were a fluke like "inferior" in Daniel 2:39 that means earth and is translated as such at the end of the same text, the conversation would be of a different character. But with ana not being in Revelation 13 and duo being there twice, the point that each one has to decide for themselves is duo twos? And since twos fits the historical fulfillment thus far, is it correct? Or is the fulfillment being manipulated to make it say something that it does not say?


"Ignorance is sin, when knowledge can be obtained" (HR, September 1, 1866 par. 3). www.loudcry101.com
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Re: The Book of Revelation -- 1st Quarter 2019 [Re: dedication] #188949
04/02/19 03:50 PM
04/02/19 03:50 PM
K
kland  Offline
SDA
Active Member 2024

5500+ Member
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 6,512
Midland
I agree, Jesus sent them out by twos. Not by fours. Duo is never two twos. It is only one two.

Show us where in Revelation 13 it is used twice.

You seem to base your scripture interpretation upon your historical interpretations. That is not how to understand the Bible. For example, if your intrepretation was 42 and 6 months, would you then consider that duo means 8 (2+6)?

We must understand scripture first, with no regard to how our own opinions of interpretation of current events are. If our opinions don't match, then maybe we are wrong or have applied the wrong scripture to them.

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Re: The Book of Revelation -- 1st Quarter 2019 [Re: kland] #188954
04/02/19 11:19 PM
04/02/19 11:19 PM
His child  Offline
SDA
Active Member 2020
Very Dedicated Member
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 1,673
TN, USA
Originally Posted By: kland
I agree, Jesus sent them out by twos. Not by fours. Duo is never two twos. It is only one two.

Show us where in Revelation 13 it is used twice.

You seem to base your scripture interpretation upon your historical interpretations. That is not how to understand the Bible. For example, if your intrepretation was 42 and 6 months, would you then consider that duo means 8 (2+6)?

We must understand scripture first, with no regard to how our own opinions of interpretation of current events are. If our opinions don't match, then maybe we are wrong or have applied the wrong scripture to them.


I did that several times on this forum, you'll have to look it up


"Ignorance is sin, when knowledge can be obtained" (HR, September 1, 1866 par. 3). www.loudcry101.com
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