It's time to open up the topic for this week's study on Daniel 8 which can be directly accessed from the following link:

http://www.ssnet.org/qrtrly/eng/06c/less05.html

The Sabbath afternoon section includes the following:

Quote:

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In Daniel 8, the first 14 verses deal with his vision, in which Daniel sees a ram, a goat, and a little horn, followed by the cleansing of the sanctuary. The rest of the chapter is the explanation given him regarding the ram, the goat, and the little horn. Interestingly enough, the part about the sanctuary being cleansed is not explained here. And, as we'll see—though specifically told that the vision of the sanctuary being cleansed "is true" (vs. 26)—Daniel says that he doesn't understand it (vs. 27). That's because it wasn't explained, as were the other elements in the vision. This point becomes important later, when we study the next chapter, in which an explanation is finally given.

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Daniel 8:14 is a key verse leading us to 1844 and the judgment message.

It is imperitive that we view this verse in context with the other chapters and with the verses within the chapter itself. The oft spoken accusation that we as Seventh-day Adventists simply lift this text out of context and build a doctrine is not correct.

As Ellen White writes:

Quote:

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"The prophecies present a succession of events leading down to the opening of the Judgment. This is especially true of the book of Daniel. But that part of his prophecy which related to the last days, Daniel was bidden to close up and seal "to the time of the end." Not till we reach this time could a message concerning the Judgment be proclaimed, based on a fulfillment of these prophecies.....
An angel is seen flying "in the midst of heaven, having the everlasting gospel to preach unto them that dwell on the earth, and to every nation, and kindred, and tongue, and people." "With a loud voice" he proclaims the message, "Fear God, and give glory to him; for the hour of his Judgment is come: and worship him that made heaven, and earth, and the sea, and the fountains of waters."
(REV. 14:6, 7.) GC 355

Both the prophecy of Dan. 8:14, "Unto two thousand and three hundred days; then shall the sanctuary be cleansed," and the first angel's message, "Fear God, and give glory to him; for the hour of his Judgment is come," pointed to
Christ's ministration in the most holy place, to the investigative Judgment, and not to the coming of Christ for the redemption of his people and the destruction of the wicked. The mistake had not been in the reckoning of the prophetic periods, but in the event to take place at the end of the 2300 days. GC 423-424

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Now I do have a question --

Why are there only two animal symbols in Daniel 8?

I know that Babylon is here not mentioned and I know (and believe) the reasons for saying the horn that starts small and grows exeedingly great is the same as the fourth kingdom complete with it's horns and toes of Daniel 7 and 2.

But why doesn't this vision follow the easy to understand consistancy of each progressive kingdom being represented as a separate animal?

This vision does follow the same outline as the others concerning the rise and fall of nations. This vision shows the fall of Mede and the Persians and the rise of Greece.

Daniels dream took place in 553 B.C., he was around 70 years old at this time according to some historians.
The Ram with two horns represent Medes and Persians, two horns show the two countries.

The Goat is the Macedonia kingdom that rose up with a multitude of Greeks and went to war with Medes and Persians the horn of the goat is Alexander the Great.

Peace and Grace

David

The Ram with two horns represent Medes and Persians, two horns show the two countries.

The Goat is the Macedonia kingdom

True enough but that still doesn't answer the question as to why there are only two animals. Daniel 7 has 4 animal symbols plus a horn amongst ten horns.
Daniel 8 only has TWO animals and a horn.
Why not a third?

The reason that there are only 2 creatures is that one is already destroyed or overcome and this vision is focusing on mainly Medes / Persians and the Greek empire that was on the rise. Of course as history shows the Medes / Persians lost their domain to Alexander the Great.
There is no need to discuss Babylon for it is gone by this time and Rome had not yet grown into a major nation this would really come about some years later.
Peace and Grace

David

Again -- yes, I understand that the sequence skips Babylon and starts with Mede Persia and moves on to Greece.

But really now --
Mede Persia and Greece ARE NOT the focus of this chapter. (Unless we want to adopt the Antiochus Epiphanes interpretation -- which I do not)
It's speaking of powers that reach into the end point of earth's history.

I believe this chapter is very much concerned with Rome and with the Papacy, but the question remains -- why is there NOT a third animal?

One more question that I think has significance --
Who was king when Daniel had this vision?

I posted this question on several forums and didn't receive an explanation on any of them.
This is the only forum where someone even responded.


The question:
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> Why are there only two animal symbols in Daniel 8?



>

Here's some thoughts --

In Daniel 7 the kingdoms are depicted as preditory animals. The focus is on DOMINION -- they are all fighting for dominion, including the little horn that was "different", till Christ appears before the court IN HEAVEN and is given the dominion.

In Daniel 8 there are only two animals and both of them are "sanctuary animals" -- sheep and goats usually are NOT thought of as preditory animals, however, they were very much part of the sacrificial system.

Now, some will say -- Babylon is excluded because it is already overthrown -- but the vision was in the 3rd year of Belshazzer the Babylonion king, so it was NOT YET overthrown, in fact it was just 2 years after the vision of Daniel 7.

But what if we were to look at it this way --

At the time when Daniel was in Babylon having these visions what was the condition of the temple in Jerusalem?

It was destroyed -- none functioning. No sacrifices taking place there. Thus there was no "sacrificial animal" depicting Babylon.

Persia however, commissioned the return to Jerusalem and the rebuilding of the sanctury. In fact Cyrus is depicted in the Bible in Isaiah 44:28 "Of Cyrus, [He is] my shepherd, and shall perform all my pleasure: even saying to Jerusalem, Thou shalt be built; and to the temple, Thy foundation shall be laid.
And 2 Cor. 36:23 Thus saith Cyrus king of Persia, All the kingdoms of the earth hath the LORD God of heaven given me; and he hath charged me to build him an house in Jerusalem, which [is] in Judah."

So during the time of Persia -- the temple sacrifices are again in operation.

During the time of the Greek Empire -- the Jerusalem temple sacrifices were in operation.

BUT during the time of Rome ---
Christ caused the sacrifices and oblation to cease (Dan. 9:27) when He Himself was "cut off" as the "Lamb of God, slain for the sins of the world".

So the Roman empire is NOT depicted with a sacrificial animal.
The emphasis in Daniel 8 is now on Christ's daily work in the HEAVENLY sanctuary where He has gone to be High Priest and entered with HIS BETTER BLOOD.

By the way, the word "sacrifice" does NOT appear in Daniel's writing of chapter 8. The "daily" does not have the word "sacrifice" following (it was added by the translators EVERY SINGLE time you see it in connection with the horn, it's not in the original). Daniel tells us the sacrificing ceasing when the Messiah comes in Daniel 9:27. There is no sacrificial animal depicting the earthly power that operates and attempts to eclipse Christ's work in the heavenly sanctuary.

The little horn that grows great does it's work mainly AFTER the earthly sanctuary services have ceased and there is no more need for sacrificial animals.

The whole focus of the remaining chapter is on the horn attacking the heavenly sanctuary and casting the place of the sanctuary to ground. Now the papacy didn't literally cast the place of the heavenly sanctuary to the earth and stamp on it, any more then it literally changed God's times and laws -- BUT IN THEIR TEACHINGS and in the EYES and understanding OF THE PEOPLE it was so.



So -- why only two animals-- ?
They are symbolic of Sacrificial animals operating during the time when the sacrificial service is also in operation.

No sacrificial animal depicted Babylon because --
Time of Belshazzer's Babylon -- no temple, no animal sacrifice.

1. Persia -- yes
2. Greece -- yes

During Rome and papal Rome
Christ puts an end to animal sacrifices and the forcus is now upon the heavenly sanctuary. -- sacrificial system ended-- no sacrificial animal as symbol.