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Re: Does Scripture explain why Christ had to die?
[Re: Mountain Man]
#109110
02/27/09 08:16 PM
02/27/09 08:16 PM
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SDA
Active Member 2021
5500+ Member
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Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 7,003
The Orient
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Tom, let's leave it at this - You believe the Bible clearly explains why Jesus had to live and die. I believe it is implied but not explicitly explained. Jesus answered and said unto him, Art thou a master of Israel, and knowest not these things? Verily, verily, I say unto thee, We speak that we do know, and testify that we have seen; and ye receive not our witness. If I have told you earthly things, and ye believe not, how shall ye believe, if I tell you of heavenly things? And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven. And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of man be lifted up: That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life. For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved. He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God. (John 3:10-18, KJV)
That's explicit in my book. Blessings, Green Cochoa.
We can receive of heaven's light only as we are willing to be emptied of self. We can discern the character of God, and accept Christ by faith, only as we consent to the bringing into captivity of every thought to the obedience of Christ. And to all who do this, the Holy Spirit is given without measure. In Christ "dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily. And ye are complete in Him." [Colossians 2:9, 10.] {GW 57.1} -- Ellen White.
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Re: Does Scripture explain why Christ had to die?
[Re: Tom]
#109176
03/01/09 04:15 PM
03/01/09 04:15 PM
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What about justification by faith? Would you say the same thing is true about that? (i.e., implied by the Bible, but not explicitly explained) It assumes Jesus had to die and, based on this assumption, it makes it very clear sinners can do nothing to earn or deserve pardon. Forgiveness is a free gift, and God earned the right on the cross to legally pardon and save sinners without violating or disregarding the requirements of law and justice, namely, that death must happen in consequence of sin.
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Re: Does Scripture explain why Christ had to die?
[Re: Mountain Man]
#109177
03/01/09 04:21 PM
03/01/09 04:21 PM
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"Even so must the Son of man be lifted up." That's explicit in my book. GC, please demonstrate from the Bible that this analogy and expression refers to the death of Jesus and that it clearly explains why Jesus had to die. Thank you.
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Re: Does Scripture explain why Christ had to die?
[Re: Mountain Man]
#109181
03/01/09 04:54 PM
03/01/09 04:54 PM
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OP
Active Member 2012
14500+ Member
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Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 14,795
Lawrence, Kansas
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Regarding #109176, you didn't address my question, which is you think the same thing in regards to justification by faith as you do regarding Christ's death, which is that Scripture does not clearly explain it.
Those who wait for the Bridegroom's coming are to say to the people, "Behold your God." The last rays of merciful light, the last message of mercy to be given to the world, is a revelation of His character of love.
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Re: Does Scripture explain why Christ had to die?
[Re: Tom]
#109232
03/02/09 03:12 PM
03/02/09 03:12 PM
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SDA
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Tom, I did answer it. Justification by faith is clearly explained in the Bible.
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Re: Does Scripture explain why Christ had to die?
[Re: Mountain Man]
#109294
03/03/09 03:53 PM
03/03/09 03:53 PM
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SDA
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Posts: 22,256
Southwest USA
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Re: Does Scripture explain why Christ had to die?
[Re: Mountain Man]
#109295
03/03/09 04:15 PM
03/03/09 04:15 PM
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OP
Active Member 2012
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Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 14,795
Lawrence, Kansas
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Yes, I agree.
Now you claim that the meaning of Christ's death is not clearly explained in Scripture, yet you say justification by faith is. So you don't see that understanding justification by faith is dependent upon understanding Christ's death. I find that rather odd. Could you explain this please?
Those who wait for the Bridegroom's coming are to say to the people, "Behold your God." The last rays of merciful light, the last message of mercy to be given to the world, is a revelation of His character of love.
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Re: Does Scripture explain why Christ had to die?
[Re: Tom]
#109326
03/03/09 09:23 PM
03/03/09 09:23 PM
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SDA
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JBF is founded on the death of Jesus but it doesn't explain why He had to die. It takes it for granted.
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Re: Does Scripture explain why Christ had to die?
[Re: Mountain Man]
#109353
03/04/09 01:43 AM
03/04/09 01:43 AM
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OP
Active Member 2012
14500+ Member
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Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 14,795
Lawrence, Kansas
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Those who wait for the Bridegroom's coming are to say to the people, "Behold your God." The last rays of merciful light, the last message of mercy to be given to the world, is a revelation of His character of love.
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Re: Does Scripture explain why Christ had to die?
[Re: Tom]
#109414
03/05/09 01:54 PM
03/05/09 01:54 PM
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SDA
Charter Member
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20000+ Member
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Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 22,256
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The death of Jesus makes it possible for God to justify pardoning and saving sinners. It gives Him the legal to pardon and save rather than punish and kill.
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