I don't think the cause is from God, making the Scriptures vague or cryptic, but that we are dull of understanding.

Tom,

Is Matthew 24:28 cryptic to you, or are you just "dull of understanding"?

Blessings,

Green Cochoa.

Your question is cryptic. I'm more hard of heart than dull of understanding, but that fits too.

I think the Bible is a spiritual book, which requires the Holy Spirit to understand. Jesus said if we desire to do God's will, we would know the truth. It's not that God does something purposely to make the Bible cryptic or vague, but because spiritual things are understood, they cannot be understood apart from the Spirit of God. That this is the case is not a function of God's making things cryptic or vague, IMO.

Tom,

The question was simple in comparison to Jesus' words in that verse. If you thought my question was cryptic, it is certain that you would say the same of His statement.

Look it up, and read it in its original context.

Of course, if you can just tell me what it means, then it would appear less cryptic.

Blessings,

Green Cochoa.

Tom, while I agree the Hebrew versus Greek way of thinking and seeing things plays a part in understand biblical things, but I disagree it is the reason I do not find where Moses plainly recorded why Jesus had to die and that the animal sacrifice symbolize His death. I agree with GC that certain parts of the Bible requires deep digging to discern the truth - even for the Jews.

You seem to think the serpent on the pole clearly explains why Jesus had to die and that it clearly explains that the animal sacrifices symbolize His death. The point is- Moses did not record it in the Bible. Yes, the Jews would have read the story and made the connection to what he said about it, but we do not have that advantage today. Neither do the Jews. It has nothing to do with culture. It has everything to do with oral tradition. We have access to such information through the SOP.

I'm with Green Cochoa on this. It appears to me that you had already made up your mind that your question could not be found made by Moses. If not, you could easily search for it in multiple versions and find that string is not used. Unless you mean the idea could be implied.

So, what IS your point of posting a question you already knew the answer to?

You couldn't possibly be in a position to intelligently make this judgment, since you don't know what a Hebrew would have known. You simply have no way of making a judgment like this.

A bit earlier you wrote something which you thought would have been clear. I was pointing out that the concept you were using was a Greek one, not a Hebrew one. So while what you were suggesting Moses could have said would have been clear to you, it wouldn't have been clear to the Hebrews.



You mean the Jews today? They could certainly understand what Moses wrote if they have a background for that. Also other Semitic cultures. It wasn't just Jews that would have found what Moses wrote to be clear. The other contemporary cultures would have to.



It has everything to do with culture. There's a tremendous amount of meaning underneath the surface which would have been apparent to anyone knowing their culture. It has to do with their world view. It would be as if God had a prophet today write things in terms of TVs, cars and the internet. Such references would be easily understood by us and other people in our world. But should such writings be read thousands of years later, these references might not be clear.



You've asserted this a number of times, but with no proof. I've asked you several times now, 5 or 6 at least, for some sort of inspired reference stating this, but I don't think you've responded (my apologies if I missed something).

I'm quite sure Ellen White would have vehemently disagreed with your ideas that she clearly explained the meaning of Jesus' death, but that Jesus did not (i.e. what we have recorded in Scripture).

Kland, you have drawn a conclusion about me that is foreign to me.

Tom, the idea that it requires a Hebrew mindset and outlook to understand what Moses wrote in regards to why Jesus had to die and that the animal sacrifices symbolize His death supports the idea that Moses did not clearly explain these two aspects of Jesus. If he was using Hebrews idioms and colloquiums instead of plain speech then it would mean it is unclear to the rest of us. But if this is true why is so much of what he wrote plain to us?

Back to your example - the brazen serpent. What was it about Hebrew culture that made it clear to them the serpent symbolized the death of Jesus?

He did use plain speech. Our speech is a reflection of the world and culture in which we live. His speech was plain for the world and culture in which he lived.



It's not. We miss a bunch of it.



There's a whole mythology which involves serpents. It involves rivers, and dragons, the Hebrew agricultural cycle, the death of the dragon, which is represented by a river overflowing its banks, which becomes a serpent when it's not, the death of which leaves fertile ground behind which provides life for those who remain. That's a brief sketch.