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I have some questions #114372
06/08/09 07:51 AM
06/08/09 07:51 AM
J
James Saptenno  Offline OP
Charter Member
Active Member 2012
Dedicated Member
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 1,157
Jakarta, Indonesia
I've some questions that needed to be clarified.

1. Is the "Lord's Day" in Rev. 1:10 refers to Sabbath day or to Sunday?

In His love

Re: I have some questions [Re: James Saptenno] #114374
06/08/09 09:10 AM
06/08/09 09:10 AM
Green Cochoa  Offline
SDA
Active Member 2021

5500+ Member
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 7,003
The Orient
The "Lord's Day" in the scripture can mean one of at least three things, two of which are considered as a "Sabbath" and the third is unspecified:

1) A literal Sabbath day, the seventh day of the week. See Mark 2:27-28.
2) A millennial "Sabbath" day. See 2 Peter 3:8-13.
3) The literal day of the Lord's return, i.e. "Second Coming."

The phrase "Lord's Day" is never applied in the Scriptures to a specific weekly day except for the seventh-day Sabbath. In fact, except for named feast days or holidays, none of the days of the week is ever referred to by name except for the Sabbath, which is consistently the seventh day of the week. As I understand, the Hebrews gave only numbers to the other days, such as "first day", "sixth day", etc.

There is no Biblical reason to commemorate the first day of the week. While many people like to think it should be a memorial of Christ's resurrection, even in death, Jesus kept the Sabbath holy, and never once did He ask His followers to think of His resurrection day, nor to memorialize it in any way.

That the law is not changed is evident by the fact that Jesus kept the seventh-day Sabbath and proclaimed that He had not come to change the law, his disciples kept the Sabbath even after Jesus' death and resurrection, and there is no biblical command to keep any other day holy.

"The Son of man is Lord also of the Sabbath." Mark 2:28

Mark 2:27-28 are Jesus' own words. He proclaimed Himself "Lord of the Sabbath." That the Sabbath is His day should be evident from this, and John the Revelator wrote accordingly.

Blessings,

Green Cochoa.


We can receive of heaven's light only as we are willing to be emptied of self. We can discern the character of God, and accept Christ by faith, only as we consent to the bringing into captivity of every thought to the obedience of Christ. And to all who do this, the Holy Spirit is given without measure. In Christ "dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily. And ye are complete in Him." [Colossians 2:9, 10.] {GW 57.1} -- Ellen White.
Re: I have some questions [Re: Green Cochoa] #115031
06/24/09 03:54 AM
06/24/09 03:54 AM
J
James Saptenno  Offline OP
Charter Member
Active Member 2012
Dedicated Member
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 1,157
Jakarta, Indonesia
The Lord's Day in Rev. 1:10 has the wording "kureakê hêmera" of it original Greek, which really mean Lord's day and falls on Sunday.

We, SDA's believe it is Saturday, and claim it is Sabbath.
What is the truth?

In His love

Re: I have some questions [Re: James Saptenno] #115035
06/24/09 07:41 AM
06/24/09 07:41 AM
Will  Offline
Most Dedicated Member
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 2,332
BC, Canada
After a bit of studying I don't believe the Lords Day in Rev 1:10 is the Sabbath, or Sunday.I recall the term "The Lords Day" used in other parts of the Bible, so it dawned on me that the event happening in Rev 1:10 is the Day of The Lord. Not Sabbath, or Sunday..
It is the Revelation of Jesus Christ, and with that follows all sorts of events in the book.
I think somewhere in Hosea, or one of the books written by the minor prophets there is reference to the day of the Lord or the Lords day. The event is just as apocalyptic, and I think its referring to it.
What are your thoughts?
God Bless,
Will

Re: I have some questions [Re: Will] #115036
06/24/09 10:50 AM
06/24/09 10:50 AM
K
kland  Offline
SDA
Active Member 2024

5500+ Member
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 6,509
Midland
According to my Strong's greek, kuriakos means belonging to the Lord and hemera can mean gentle, day and can include parts of other days, period of time, for ever, judgement, while, years.

I'd be interested in how it would mean Sunday.

In reading the verse, I could see how alternatives could be:
I was in the Spirit on the day of the flood.
I was in the Spirit at creation.
I was in the Spirit in the future.
I was in the Spirit on the day of the Lord.

I would therefore, tend to agree with Will, and that this verse is setting the setting of what is to follow.

Re: I have some questions [Re: kland] #115058
06/24/09 04:22 PM
06/24/09 04:22 PM
C
Colin  Offline
Active Member 2012
Very Dedicated Member
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 1,826
E. Oregon, USA
Yes, that's another possible interpretation - but such a phrase can be read either way - day of judgement or Sabbath day (Sunday is totally excluded for good Biblical reasons!).

Re: I have some questions [Re: James Saptenno] #115081
06/25/09 03:39 AM
06/25/09 03:39 AM
dedication  Online Content
Global Moderator
Supporting Member 2022

5500+ Member
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 6,701
Canada
Here's an interesting observation someone shared -- it's somewhat complex --

In Rev. 1:5-16 are found 8 quotes from the OT

Rev. 1:5 Jesus the "witness" Isa. 55:4
Rev. 1:7 He comes with clouds Dan. 7:13
Rev. 1:7 They pierced Him, they wail Zech. 12:10
Rev. 1:8 I AM the first and last Isaiah 41:4,6 and 48:12


Rev. 1:11 I AM the first and Last Isaiah 41:4,6 and 48:12
Rev. 1:12 Seven candlesticks Zech 4:2
Rev. 1:13-15 Description of Christ as Priest Dan..7:9,13,22 and 10:5,6
Rev. 1:16 mouth sharp sword Isa 49:2


Notice the parallel order in which OT references were taken

Our text in question lies right in the middle!
Now why would John say "Lord's day"?

When we realize John was revealing Jesus as the Jehovah of the Old Testament and the Creator of all things the I AM who spoke the worlds into existance, we see that John is more concerned with exalting Jesus as LORD than to raise any question as to which is the "day" of the Lord.

The OT is very emphatic that the Sabbath is the DAY of the Jehovah thy God. So by proving that Jesus is the LORD of the OT it automatically shows that the seventh day is Jesus' Day.



Scripture repeatedly places the Sabbath in the CENTER.

It's in the center of the ten commandments.
Those commandments were placed in the center of the Isrealite worship services (the most holy)


Notice too, that the quotations before and after the mention of "the Lord's day" tell us that Jesus is the "I AM, the first and the last".
The I AM of the past, present and future.

So we see the focus -- all pointing to Christ, exalting Him.

>>
>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I AM the first and the last

Jehovah, Creator,
The Lord's Day

>>>>>>>> I AM the first and the Last
>>>>>>
>>>>
>>

Re: I have some questions [Re: dedication] #115083
06/25/09 06:44 AM
06/25/09 06:44 AM
C
Colin  Offline
Active Member 2012
Very Dedicated Member
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 1,826
E. Oregon, USA
Yes: "For the Son of man is Lord even of the Sabbath day." (Matt 12:8)

Your study is excellent as usual, Dedication. grin

Re: I have some questions [Re: dedication] #115087
06/25/09 10:12 AM
06/25/09 10:12 AM
E
Elle  Offline
Active Member 2019
Died February 12, 2019

2500+ Member
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 2,536
Canada
Quote:
>>
>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I AM the first and the last

Jehovah, Creator,
The Lord's Day
>>>>>>>> I AM the first and the Last
>>>>>>
>>>>
>>

I really like your study too Dedication and I'm sorry to bring this question on. I don't question that Jesus is the "Lord of the Sabbath day".

It just so happen that this week I started studying about the different names given to God in the OT, isn't Jehovah(H3068) giving to the Father and not the son?

And isn't Jehovah mean "the Existant one"
Quote:
The LORD(3068) said unto my Lord(113), Sit thou at my right hand, until I make thine enemies thy footstool. (Psalms 110:1, KJV)



Blessings
Re: I have some questions [Re: Elle] #115091
06/25/09 11:10 AM
06/25/09 11:10 AM
Tom  Offline
Active Member 2012
14500+ Member
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 14,795
Lawrence, Kansas
There are many examples of "Jehovah" being applied to Jesus Christ, or of titles applied to Jehovah being applied to Him. Here are a few:

1.In Isa. 6:5 Isaiah says He say Jehovah high and lifted up. John, in John 12, refers to the same passage of Isaiah, and says it was referring to Jesus Christ.

Quote:
38That the saying of Esaias the prophet might be fulfilled, which he spake, Lord, who hath believed our report? and to whom hath the arm of the Lord been revealed?

39Therefore they could not believe, because that Esaias said again,

40He hath blinded their eyes, and hardened their heart; that they should not see with their eyes, nor understand with their heart, and be converted, and I should heal them.

41These things said Esaias, when he saw his glory, and spake of him.


2.Ps. 23:1 says "Jehovah is my shepherd." Jesus referred to Himself as the "Good Shepherd."

3.Jer. prophecied that the Messiah would be called "Jehovah our righteousness" (Jer. 23:56; "Jehovah Tsidkenu")

4.Joel 2:23 says whosoever shall call on the name of Jehovah shall be saved. Both Acts 2:21 and Romans 10:13 quote this passage in reference to Christ.

5.In John 8, Jesus said, "Before Abraham was, I am," taking the name of Jehovah, which was understood by the Jews, who took up rocks to stone Him.

6.Isa. 10:20 refers to Jehovah as the "Holy One of Israel." Peter, in Acts 3, applies this same title to Christ.

7.Isa. 44:6 refers to Jehovah as "the first and the last." In Revelation, Jesus applies this title to Himself.

8.Isaiah 43:11 says: "I, even I, am Jehovah; and there is no savior besides Me." Titus 2:11-13 says this(note the end):

Quote:
For the grace of God has appeared, bringing salvation to all men, instructing us to deny ungodliness and worldly desires and to live sensibly, righteously and godly in the present age, looking for the blessed hope and the appearing of the glory of our great God and Savior, Christ Jesus.


9.Deut. 10:17 refers to Jehovah as the "Lord of Lords." Rev. 17:14 applies this title to Jesus Christ.


Those who wait for the Bridegroom's coming are to say to the people, "Behold your God." The last rays of merciful light, the last message of mercy to be given to the world, is a revelation of His character of love.
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