Are you saying that other denominations can be or are "truth filled"?

It would be closer to say that I do not think "truth filled" is an adjective that applies to denominations at all. It applies to people who are living with our Lord Jesus Christ and such people are found inside and outside organisations such as denominations.

Sacrificing truth for unity does not make for unity. Name the major denominations, churches or people groups that have a correct biblical view of the sabbath, the state of the dead, the judgement both before and after the 2nd coming, the manner of the second coming, sin being just an act or state of mind, being saved from sin and not in sin, a true world view of gospel mission and humanitarianism, the correct role of Jesus in human redemption as our example, savior and advocate judge, and a biblical understanding of Joel 2 and 2nd Peter as relates to a last days and end of time prophetic gift.

dburt, you have here defined one segment of adventism. A definition specific enough to not even include the entire SDA denomination.

Thomas, I agree with you that the "body of Christ" (the church) consists of "truth filled" believers. But what do you make of God's description of His last day church (see passage below)? And, why do you think a "shaking" of the membership will be necessary prior to the close of probation?

Revelation
3:14 And unto the angel of the church of the Laodiceans write; These things saith the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the beginning of the creation of God;
3:15 I know thy works, that thou art neither cold nor hot: I would thou wert cold or hot.
3:16 So then because thou art lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will spue thee out of my mouth.
3:17 Because thou sayest, I am rich, and increased with goods, and have need of nothing; and knowest not that thou art wretched, and miserable, and poor, and blind, and naked:
3:18 I counsel thee to buy of me gold tried in the fire, that thou mayest be rich; and white raiment, that thou mayest be clothed, and [that] the shame of thy nakedness do not appear; and anoint thine eyes with eyesalve, that thou mayest see.
3:19 As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten: be zealous therefore, and repent.
3:20 Behold, I stand at the door, and knock: if any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me.
3:21 To him that overcometh will I grant to sit with me in my throne, even as I also overcame, and am set down with my Father in his throne.
3:22 He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches.

There is no shaking mentioned in the passage quoted. The description given is acqurate since there are such people among the Church today. There are also people whom are described by the six other churches previous to Laodicea within the Church. And the view that every generation has people who fit each of the descriptions is supported by Ellen refering to contemporaries quoting different church messages in the DOA book.

A shaking of the apparent membership is done to show clearly the true membership, not of any denomination but of the Church. It is necessary because so many people are preoccupied with other things than walking with their Lord, despite claiming Him as their Lord. The preoccupation may range from things everyone recognise as sin to such things as many recognise as quite pious. A puritan may well be found out not knowing the Lord while an apparent sinner may be found out to know Him. Let everyone be judged by the Lord and aquited or condemned as is their due by Him.

Thomas, it is unclear to me what you believe about the SDA Church's claim to be the remnant church of prophecy. Do you think the following insights imply all Christian Churches make up the remnant church of prophecy? If not, what do you think Ellen White was trying to convey?

Although there are evils existing in the church, and will be until the end of the world, the church in these last days is to be the light of the world that is polluted and demoralized by sin. The church, enfeebled and defective, needing to be reproved, warned, and counseled, is the only object upon earth upon which Christ bestows His supreme regard. The world is a workshop in which, through the cooperation of human and divine agencies, Jesus is making experiments by His grace and divine mercy upon human hearts. Angels are amazed as they behold the transformation of character brought about in those who yield themselves to God, and they express their joy in songs of rapturous praise to God and to the Lamb. They see those who are by nature the children of wrath, converted and becoming laborers together with Christ in drawing souls to God. They see those who were in darkness becoming lights to shine amid the moral night of this wicked and perverse generation. They see them becoming prepared by a Christlike experience to suffer with their Lord, and afterward to be partakers with Him in His glory in heaven above. {TM 49.1}

God has a church on earth who are lifting up the downtrodden law, and presenting to the world the Lamb of God that taketh away the sins of the world. The church is the depositary of the wealth of the riches of the grace of Christ, and through the church eventually will be made manifest the final and full display of the love of God to the world that is to be lightened with its glory. The prayer of Christ that His church may be one as He was one with His Father will finally be answered. The rich dowry of the Holy Spirit will be given, and through its constant supply to the people of God they will become witnesses in the world of the power of God unto salvation. {TM 50.1}

The people who have braved out their rebellion will fulfill the description given in Revelation 6:15-17. In these very caves and dens they find the very statement of truth in the letters and in the publications as witness against them. The shepherds who lead the sheep in false paths will hear the charge made against them, "It was you who made light of truth. It was you who told us that God's law was abrogated, that it was a yoke of bondage. It was you who voiced the false doctrines when I was convicted that these Seventh-day Adventists had the truth. The blood of our souls is upon your priestly garments. . . . Now will you pay the ransom for my soul? . . . What shall we do who listened to your garbling of the Scriptures and your turning into a lie the truth which if obeyed would have saved us?" {Mar 290.3}

i understood what you said and what you meant, i believe.

Some are naturally combative. . . . They would like to enter into controversy, would like to fight for their particular ideas; but they should lay this aside, for it is not developing the Christian graces. Work with all your power to answer the prayer of Christ, that His disciples may be one as He is one with the Father.—Ibid. (Review and Herald, Nov. 11, 1965). {CTr 363.8}

Mike, my view of the SDA churches claim to be the "remnant church" may be described by the phrase (hot air)..
The first two quotes fit quite well with this view that the Church is made up of all believers. The third quote, are you sure Ellen wrote it?

Teresa, your quote speaks the truth, and in my view also negates the remnant church claims so often heard. His disciples will never be one as long as some disciples are convinced they are better disciples than the other disciples.

Thank you for answering my question.


I believe Ellen White was referring specifically to the SDA Church. Do you agree? Or, do you think that by "the church" she was including all Christian churches?


Yes. Why do you ask?