Yes, I view it this way.



It's the other way around. She expanded "needs to know" to "or can know." If she meant to "qualify" what she wrote, she wouldn't have said "or can know." A little bit of thought should be sufficient to understand this. I'll give you some examples to illustrate the point.

1.All that man needs to know, or can know, of dental hygiene, was taught by Dr. Seuss.

What this means is there is nothing man can know of dental hygiene that Dr. Seuss did not teach.

2.All that man needs to know, or can know, of three-toed sloths, in the Encyclopedia Britannica.

This means there's nothing man can know of three-toed sloths which is not in the Encyclopedia Britannica.

MM, I don't understand how this could possibly not be clear. I can understand your disagreeing with what she said, but not your not understanding it. "All that man needs to know, or can know" is not qualified. You studied Venn diagrams in school, didn't you?

Here's another example:

1.Every state that has a city over 1,000,000 people, or any people at all, has taxes.

What this means is that every state has taxes. The first part of the statement was qualified, but the second part amplified it, so it became an unqualified statement. "Or can know" encompasses anything a person can know.



The SOP statement is that all that man needs to know of God, or can know of Him, was revealed by Christ. That's a clear statement.

Jesus said the same thing when He said:



This is the theme of John in general:



Actually, I think it's the theme of Scripture, but John was the most explicit in stating it.

how is your wife doing, my brother?

Tom, "needs to know" implies there is much more to know about God; and "can know" refers to our limited ability to grasp all there is to know about God.

Do you think she meant Jesus revealed, while here in the flesh, everything there is to know about God, that there isn't anything about God Jesus didn't reveal, that throughout eternity we will never discover something new about God that Jesus didn't reveal? Here's how these questions are answered in the Bible and the SOP:

John
16:12 I have yet many things to say unto you, but ye cannot bear them now.

Isaiah
55:8 For my thoughts [are] not your thoughts, neither [are] your ways my ways, saith the LORD.
55:9 For [as] the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways, and my thoughts than your thoughts.

Romans
11:33 O the depth of the riches both of the wisdom and knowledge of God! how unsearchable [are] his judgments, and his ways past finding out!
11:34 For who hath known the mind of the Lord? or who hath been his counsellor?

The word of God, like the character of its divine Author, presents mysteries that can never be fully comprehended by finite beings. The entrance of sin into the world, the incarnation of Christ, regeneration, the resurrection, and many other subjects presented in the Bible, are mysteries too deep for the human mind to explain, or even fully to comprehend. But we have no reason to doubt God's word because we cannot understand the mysteries of His providence. In the natural world we are constantly surrounded with mysteries that we cannot fathom. The very humblest forms of life present a problem that the wisest of philosophers is powerless to explain. Everywhere are wonders beyond our ken. Should we then be surprised to find that in the spiritual world also there are mysteries that we cannot fathom? The difficulty lies solely in the weakness and narrowness of the human mind. God has given us in the Scriptures sufficient evidence of their divine character, and we are not to doubt His word because we cannot understand all the mysteries of His providence. {SC 106.2}

If it were possible for created beings to attain to a full understanding of God and His works, then, having reached this point, there would be for them no further discovery of truth, no growth in knowledge, no further development of mind or heart. God would no longer be supreme; and men, having reached the limit of knowledge and attainment, would cease to advance. Let us thank God that it is not so. God is infinite; in Him are "all the treasures of wisdom and knowledge." Col. 2:3. And to all eternity men may be ever searching, ever learning, and yet they can never exhaust the treasures of His wisdom, His goodness, and His power. {FLB 14.3}

We can never by searching find out God. He does not lay open His plans to prying, inquisitive minds. We must not attempt to lift with presumptuous hand the curtain behind which He veils His majesty. The apostle exclaims, "How unsearchable are his judgments, and his ways past finding out!" It is a proof of His mercy that there is the hiding of His power, that He is enshrouded in the awful clouds of mystery and obscurity; for to lift the curtain that conceals the Divine Presence is death. No mortal mind can penetrate the secrecy in which the Mighty One dwells and works. We can comprehend no more of His dealings with us and the motives that actuate Him than He sees fit to reveal. He orders everything in righteousness, and we are not to be dissatisfied and distrustful, but to bow in reverent submission. He will reveal to us as much of His purposes as it is for our good to know; and beyond that we must trust the hand that is omnipotent, the heart that is full of love (Review and Herald, Apr. 7, 1885). {LHU 361.5}

But many mysteries yet remain unrevealed. How much that is acknowledged to be truth is mysterious and unexplainable to the human mind! How dark seem the dispensations of Providence! What necessity there is for implicit faith and trust in God's moral government! We are ready to say with Paul, "How unsearchable are his judgments, and his ways past finding out!" {6BC 1091.6}

"Needs to know" refers to something one needs to know. So when she speaks of "all that man needs to know of God" she means everything that needs to be known. I realize I'm just repeating what she said, but she said it so clearly, it's hard to see how else to say it. It's implying there are things that need to be known. And the Jesus Christ revealed these things.

When she says "or can know," that means that not only did Jesus Christ reveal all that can be known of God by man, but He *also* (i.e., in addition to that which man needs to know of God) revealed all man *can* know of God.

So Jesus Christ revealed:
1.Everything that man can know of God, which man needs to know.
2.Everything that man can know of God, including things which man doesn't need to know.



I think throughout eternity we will continue to learn new and wonderful things about God, but that, upon reflection, it will be seen that these things were revealed in the life and character of Jesus Christ.

Regarding your quotes, I don't think they're disagreeing with the idea that all that man can know of God was revealed in the life and character of Jesus Christ.

It's basically the same idea that Jesus Christ Himself shared, that "When you've seen Me, you've seen the Father."

Can you name anything Jesus revealed about God that we do not need to know right now?

And, can you name a time when Jesus, while here in the flesh, employed the "withdraw and permit" principle of allowing death and destruction to happen?

And, can you name a time when Jesus, while here in the flesh, commanded someone to stone a sinner to death?

Why are you asking this? I don't think her point was that Jesus Christ revealed things about God we don't need to know, but she was writing, and had the thought, "Everything man needs to know of God was revealed by Jesus Christ," and then, as she was writing that, she had the additional thought, "Not only that, but everything man *can* know of God was revealed by Jesus Christ," or, in other words, there is nothing man can know of God which Jesus Christ did not reveal.

I don't know how else one can read the statement "All that can be known of X was revealed by Y" other than "There is nothing that can be known of X which was not revealed by Y."



Yes. We've been through this. But tell me please, why are you asking this question?



Why, again, are you asking this question?

Are you trying to point out things we need to know of God, or can know of God, that Jesus didn't reveal? Or do you have some other point to make?

From my perspective, the point would be the fact that Jesus has been revealing God to us "from the foundation of the world." Does not the Bible say that is when the Lamb was slain? The Lamb referred to, of course, is none other than our Lord and Savior.

Jesus' life has been "from everlasting to everlasting." I know we have been through this before, but I can fully agree with Mrs. White's statement, considering it was Jesus who walked with Enoch, Jesus who led the children of Israel of out Egypt, who guided them in the wilderness, who met with Moses on the mount, and who taught them His commandments. Jesus has always been our King, our Guide. It has always been He who has revealed the Father to us. As I understand, it was also Jesus who walked and talked with Adam and Eve, and not the Father.

Blessings,

Green Cochoa.

PS--I've been very busy this week, and I know there's a few threads that I was needing to respond to, but never had enough time. Hopefully I can catch up sometime.

But that's not her point, GC. In fact, that way of interpreting things, IMO, makes the exact opposite point that she was trying to make, and John as well.

In point of fact, God was not understood. So Jesus came to reveal Him. *That* revelation is what she's talking about, which she makes clear in context.



This is clearly dealing with Christ's incarnation, as is John, whom she quoted. Here's another translation of John 1:18



Ellen White speaks to the misunderstanding of God's character here:



Please note:

1.The earth was dark through misapprehension of God. (This is in spite of what had been done in the OT)
2.That the gloomy shadows might be lightened, that the world might be brought back to God, Satan's deceptive power was to be broken. (This is something which had not been done, which remained to be done, and was done by Jesus Christ in the flesh).
3.This work only one Being in all the universe could do. Only He who knew the height and depth of the love of God could make it known.(This is like John 1:18, which refers to Christ's being "in the bosom of the Father," or, as another version puts it, "He who knew Him best.")

Now how was Satan's deceptive power broken? By revealing the truth.

IMO, if we don't perceive that Jesus Christ in the flesh did something important, vitally important, by means of His revelation of the Father, we're missing something vital. When Jesus Christ said, "When you've seen Me, you've seen the Father," He was proclaiming the Gospel. The Gospel is the Good News about God. God is not like the devil has portrayed him to be, but He is like this! Behold Me and see!

A couple more statements which deal with this theme:



This points out that the "whole purpose" of Christ's earthly mission was "the revelation of God." Such a vital purpose (His "whole purpose") cannot be overemphasized.



We are drawn back to God by beholding His character, which Jesus Christ revealed, especially in His death. She looks to have Peter's statement in mind here:

She's doing well, but still has quite a bit of pain.

That doctor was pretty evil and Satanic for causing her this excruciating pain. If the doctor had not made the cuts herself, but instead just allowed the drug dealers outside to come in and cause my wife this pain by cutting her up, things would be very different.

Perhaps sin, rather than the doctor, is responsible for the pain she's experiencing.

In all seriousness, I hope she does well, and suffers as little as possible.