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the great controversy
#113957
06/01/09 03:26 AM
06/01/09 03:26 AM
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OP
SDA Active Member 2024
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Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 1,984
CA, USA
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what is the "great controversy" all about? does this person have a pretty good idea of it? http://www.gregboyd.org/essays/essays-jesus/the-christus-victor-view-of-the-atonement/
Psa 64:5 ...an evil matter: they commune of laying snares privily; they say, Who shall see them?
Psa 7:14 Behold, he travaileth with iniquity, and hath conceived mischief, and brought forth falsehood. 15 He made a pit, and digged it, and is fallen into the ditch which he made. 16 His mischief (and his violent dealing) shall return upon his own head.
Psa 7:17 I will praise the LORD according to his righteousness: and will sing praise to the name of the LORD most high.
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Re: the great controversy
[Re: teresaq]
#113961
06/01/09 04:25 AM
06/01/09 04:25 AM
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Active Member 2012
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Lawrence, Kansas
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The author of the article has written two major books on the subject, over 1,000 pages in all. One book is called "Satan and the Problem of Evil." The other is "God at War." The article is not even scratching the surface (He's also written a less academic book, aimed at the general public, called "Is God to Blame?"). Many non-SDA's think the "Great Controversy" is something an SDA made up (namely, Ellen White), but here's a non-SDA who's written hundreds of pages on the subject, using nothing but Scripture to back up his ideas. In his book he calls the theme "Trinitarian Warfare" (which we, as Adventists, would call "The Great Controversy.) Here's an article where he talks about it: http://www.gregboyd.org/category/essays/essays-spiritual-warfare/the-warfare-worldview/"Christus Victor" is dealing specifically with the atonement, but it can easily seen that the concepts morph into each other.
Those who wait for the Bridegroom's coming are to say to the people, "Behold your God." The last rays of merciful light, the last message of mercy to be given to the world, is a revelation of His character of love.
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Re: the great controversy
[Re: Tom]
#113987
06/01/09 07:20 PM
06/01/09 07:20 PM
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OP
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does his understanding match what has been laid out for us in the sop?
if so, is God raising others to join in our message?
Psa 64:5 ...an evil matter: they commune of laying snares privily; they say, Who shall see them?
Psa 7:14 Behold, he travaileth with iniquity, and hath conceived mischief, and brought forth falsehood. 15 He made a pit, and digged it, and is fallen into the ditch which he made. 16 His mischief (and his violent dealing) shall return upon his own head.
Psa 7:17 I will praise the LORD according to his righteousness: and will sing praise to the name of the LORD most high.
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Re: the great controversy
[Re: teresaq]
#113995
06/01/09 09:09 PM
06/01/09 09:09 PM
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Active Member 2012
14500+ Member
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Joined: Aug 2004
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Lawrence, Kansas
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There are things in his understanding that are different than what SDA's believe, but he has many great insights. God isn't stingy with truth.
Those who wait for the Bridegroom's coming are to say to the people, "Behold your God." The last rays of merciful light, the last message of mercy to be given to the world, is a revelation of His character of love.
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Re: the great controversy
[Re: Tom]
#118996
09/10/09 05:05 PM
09/10/09 05:05 PM
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OP
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so what all is involved in the great controversy between Christ and satan?
Psa 64:5 ...an evil matter: they commune of laying snares privily; they say, Who shall see them?
Psa 7:14 Behold, he travaileth with iniquity, and hath conceived mischief, and brought forth falsehood. 15 He made a pit, and digged it, and is fallen into the ditch which he made. 16 His mischief (and his violent dealing) shall return upon his own head.
Psa 7:17 I will praise the LORD according to his righteousness: and will sing praise to the name of the LORD most high.
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Re: the great controversy
[Re: teresaq]
#119003
09/10/09 08:51 PM
09/10/09 08:51 PM
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5500+ Member
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Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 6,154
Brazil
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"From the first, the great controversy had been upon the law of God. Satan had sought to prove that God was unjust, and that His law was faulty, and that the good of the universe required it to be changed. In attacking the law, he aimed to overthrow the authority of its Author. In the controversy it was to be shown whether the divine statutes were defective and subject to change, or perfect and immutable." {ST, November 4, 1908 par. 12}
The last great conflict between truth and error is but the final struggle of the long-standing controversy concerning the law of God. Upon this battle we are now entering. {CC 210.5}
From the opening of the great controversy it has been Satan's purpose to misrepresent God's character, and to excite rebellion against His law. {AG 130.3}
Separation from his Father, the punishment for transgression, was to fall upon him, in order to magnify God's law and testify to its immutability. And this was forever to settle the controversy between Satan and the Prince of heaven in regard to the changeless character of that law. {ST, December 9, 1897 par. 5}
When Christ entered upon His campaign, Satan met Him and contested every inch of ground, exerting his utmost powers to conquer Him. Much was involved in this controversy. Intense interests were at stake. The questions to be answered were: "Is God's law imperfect, in need of being amended or abrogated? or is it immutable? Is God's government stable? or is it in need of changes?" Not only before those living in the city of God, but before the inhabitants of all the heavenly universe, were these questions to be answered. . . . {TDG 14.1}
Well, I could quote more passages, but I think these are enough to establish the fact that the great controversy between Christ and Satan centers around the law of God (to which God's character and government are related). I haven't read Boyd's articles, but I suspect this perspective, which characterizes Ellen White's thought, is lacking in his writings.
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Re: the great controversy
[Re: Rosangela]
#119004
09/10/09 09:00 PM
09/10/09 09:00 PM
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Active Member 2011
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Joined: May 2002
Posts: 3,965
Sweden
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Hmm, Tom, you read the books? What does Boyd say regarding Rosangelas point?
Galatians 2 21 I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain.
It is so hazardous to take here a little and there a little. If you put the right little's together you can make the bible teach anything you wish. //Graham Maxwell
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Re: the great controversy
[Re: Rosangela]
#119006
09/10/09 11:46 PM
09/10/09 11:46 PM
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OP
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Well, I could quote more passages, but I think these are enough to establish the fact that the great controversy between Christ and Satan centers around the law of God (to which God's character and government are related). I haven't read Boyd's articles, but I suspect this perspective, which characterizes Ellen White's thought, is lacking in his writings. why would you suspect that without reading him? sdas are not the only ones who preach the law. i hear others who preach it much better than we do because they are not vague. they get down to what each law means and how we are to treat each other. ellen white calls it practical/primitive godliness. i dont hear that in our church. last sabbath i heard one of the greatest sermons by charles stanleys son taken from phillipians 2 and Christs humility for husbands and wives. the radio station i listen to has several 10-15 min segments a day of sermonettes on true godliness, which is the law. while i do know that the vast majority of the christian world is looking for a "feelgood" religion i do meet people from various churches who regularly meet and study the scriptures encouraging each other in the way of godliness.
Psa 64:5 ...an evil matter: they commune of laying snares privily; they say, Who shall see them?
Psa 7:14 Behold, he travaileth with iniquity, and hath conceived mischief, and brought forth falsehood. 15 He made a pit, and digged it, and is fallen into the ditch which he made. 16 His mischief (and his violent dealing) shall return upon his own head.
Psa 7:17 I will praise the LORD according to his righteousness: and will sing praise to the name of the LORD most high.
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Re: the great controversy
[Re: teresaq]
#119008
09/11/09 12:33 AM
09/11/09 12:33 AM
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5500+ Member
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Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 6,154
Brazil
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Does he speak about the law?
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Re: the great controversy
[Re: teresaq]
#119009
09/11/09 12:42 AM
09/11/09 12:42 AM
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OP
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Joined: Mar 2008
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the link was provided. that way you will know for yourself what he says and not be going on anyones say so, or potentiall faulty understanding. anyway, It was through Satan's misrepresentation of God's character that man was led to doubt the reality of his love, and came to look upon God as his enemy. As Satan had done in heaven, so he did on earth,--declared God's government unjust, the restrictions of his law unnecessary, and bade man, as he had angels, to throw aside the yoke and let the dictates of their own nature be their only guide and law. He promised liberty; but as he himself is the servant of corruption, he brought the race into bondage, to sin, misery, and death. He represented God as claiming all and giving nothing, as requiring men's service for his own glory, but denying himself nothing for man's good. {ST, February 13, 1893 par. 6}
Psa 64:5 ...an evil matter: they commune of laying snares privily; they say, Who shall see them?
Psa 7:14 Behold, he travaileth with iniquity, and hath conceived mischief, and brought forth falsehood. 15 He made a pit, and digged it, and is fallen into the ditch which he made. 16 His mischief (and his violent dealing) shall return upon his own head.
Psa 7:17 I will praise the LORD according to his righteousness: and will sing praise to the name of the LORD most high.
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