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Re: I have some questions
[Re: Green Cochoa]
#123575
02/24/10 12:46 AM
02/24/10 12:46 AM
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Active Member 2012
14500+ Member
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Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 14,795
Lawrence, Kansas
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Yes. Sins of ignorance would have little, if any, impact on character. For example, natives not keeping the Sabbath probably doesn't have an impact on their character. Or keeping the Sabbath mistakenly from 6:00 to 6:00 Said the angel: "If light come, and that light is set aside or rejected, then comes condemnation and the frown of God; but before the light comes, there is no sin, for there is no light for them to reject." {1T 116.1}
Those who wait for the Bridegroom's coming are to say to the people, "Behold your God." The last rays of merciful light, the last message of mercy to be given to the world, is a revelation of His character of love.
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Re: I have some questions
[Re: Tom]
#123577
02/24/10 01:24 AM
02/24/10 01:24 AM
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SDA
Active Member 2021
5500+ Member
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Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 7,003
The Orient
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Ok. Thank you for clarifying. Do you believe Moses' sin was a "sin of ignorance" in this sense?
Blessings,
Green Cochoa.
We can receive of heaven's light only as we are willing to be emptied of self. We can discern the character of God, and accept Christ by faith, only as we consent to the bringing into captivity of every thought to the obedience of Christ. And to all who do this, the Holy Spirit is given without measure. In Christ "dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily. And ye are complete in Him." [Colossians 2:9, 10.] {GW 57.1} -- Ellen White.
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Re: I have some questions
[Re: Green Cochoa]
#123580
02/24/10 02:10 AM
02/24/10 02:10 AM
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Active Member 2012
14500+ Member
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Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 14,795
Lawrence, Kansas
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You're asking if Moses didn't know that losing his patience and getting angry, smiting the rock, was wrong?
Those who wait for the Bridegroom's coming are to say to the people, "Behold your God." The last rays of merciful light, the last message of mercy to be given to the world, is a revelation of His character of love.
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Re: I have some questions
[Re: Tom]
#123586
02/24/10 08:16 AM
02/24/10 08:16 AM
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SDA
Active Member 2021
5500+ Member
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Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 7,003
The Orient
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You're asking if Moses didn't know that losing his patience and getting angry, smiting the rock, was wrong? Exactly. Is that not what this discussion of late has centered on as its primary example? You are saying that some sins do not "impact on character." Would Moses' sin of smiting the rock be one in that category? Blessings, Green Cochoa.
We can receive of heaven's light only as we are willing to be emptied of self. We can discern the character of God, and accept Christ by faith, only as we consent to the bringing into captivity of every thought to the obedience of Christ. And to all who do this, the Holy Spirit is given without measure. In Christ "dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily. And ye are complete in Him." [Colossians 2:9, 10.] {GW 57.1} -- Ellen White.
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Re: I have some questions
[Re: Tom]
#123603
02/24/10 05:51 PM
02/24/10 05:51 PM
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SDA
Charter Member
Active Member 2019
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Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 22,256
Southwest USA
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M: Do you think God will treat such sins (unrepented of due to death in cases involving God-fearing people like Moses) in judgment as though they never happened?
T: The sins that are important are ones that have an impact on the character. You didn't answer my question.
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Re: I have some questions
[Re: Mountain Man]
#123604
02/24/10 05:54 PM
02/24/10 05:54 PM
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SDA
Charter Member
Active Member 2019
20000+ Member
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Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 22,256
Southwest USA
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Tom, I am interested in your response to GC's questions.
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Re: I have some questions
[Re: Mountain Man]
#123638
02/26/10 03:23 AM
02/26/10 03:23 AM
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Active Member 2012
14500+ Member
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Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 14,795
Lawrence, Kansas
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T:You're asking if Moses didn't know that losing his patience and getting angry, smiting the rock, was wrong? Is there any possibility that Moses would not have know this was wrong? I don't understand why you're asking this. The SOP says his repentance was immediate and deep. Is that not what this discussion of late has centered on as its primary example?
You are saying that some sins do not "impact on character." I said, "Sins of ignorance would have little, if any, impact on character." and gave the example of keeping Sabbath from 6:00pm to 6:00pm as an example. Would Moses' sin of smiting the rock be one in that category?[/quote] You mean be like keeping the Sabbath from 6:00pm to 6:00pm? Of course not. I don't understand how could this be a question. M: Do you think God will treat such sins (unrepented of due to death in cases involving God-fearing people like Moses) in judgment as though they never happened?
T: The sins that are important are ones that have an impact on the character.
M:You didn't answer my question. I'm not sure what you're asking. God treats sinners as if they hadn't sinned. What do you mean by treating sins as if they hadn't happened? Do you mean treating sinners (or former sinners, if you're dealing with the period in time after the righteous have gone to heaven) as if they hadn't sinned? If so, I believe God will do that.
Those who wait for the Bridegroom's coming are to say to the people, "Behold your God." The last rays of merciful light, the last message of mercy to be given to the world, is a revelation of His character of love.
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Re: I have some questions
[Re: Tom]
#123651
02/26/10 04:24 PM
02/26/10 04:24 PM
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SDA
Charter Member
Active Member 2019
20000+ Member
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Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 22,256
Southwest USA
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Tom, we're discussing people like Moses who sin and die before they can repent. Do you think God will treat those sins as if they never happened? Or, do you think He will pardon them as if they were repented of?
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Re: I have some questions
[Re: Mountain Man]
#123652
02/26/10 04:32 PM
02/26/10 04:32 PM
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SDA
Charter Member
Active Member 2019
20000+ Member
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Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 22,256
Southwest USA
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Tom, do you think since Moses knew he was guilty of a grievous, character impacting sin that if he had died before repenting of it that God would simply ignore it in judgment, treat it as if it never happened or as if it had been repented of? Does it matter if such people commit such sins under such circumstances that they didn't repent of it before they died?
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Re: I have some questions
[Re: Mountain Man]
#123658
02/26/10 05:45 PM
02/26/10 05:45 PM
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Active Member 2012
14500+ Member
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Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 14,795
Lawrence, Kansas
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MM, what do you think Moses' first thoughts would have been upon being resurrected? (in the scenario that he died while sinning, before he could repent)
Those who wait for the Bridegroom's coming are to say to the people, "Behold your God." The last rays of merciful light, the last message of mercy to be given to the world, is a revelation of His character of love.
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