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Re: The National Sunday law is near! [Re: Mountain Man] #123754
03/01/10 06:22 PM
03/01/10 06:22 PM
C
crater  Offline
Veteran Member
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 989
United States
Acts 2:17 And it shall come to pass in the last days, saith God, I will pour out of my Spirit upon all flesh: and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, and your young men shall see visions, and your old men shall dream dreams.

Joel 2:28 And it shall come to pass afterward, [that] I will pour out my spirit upon all flesh; and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, your old men shall dream dreams, your young men shall see visions:

The verses say, "I will pour out of my Spirit upon all flesh:" The "all flesh"! Not just the church? Would this mean that the Holy Spirit is working on everyone?

The visions and dreams will be had but what kind of visions and dreams, and prophesying? I find these passages confusing!

Re: The National Sunday law is near! [Re: crater] #123785
03/03/10 02:40 AM
03/03/10 02:40 AM
JCS  Offline OP
Active Member 2012
Senior Member
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 470
Colorado, USA
If the Holy Spirit was poured out on someone who wasn't receptive to it they would focus on any points that were in harmony with what they believe, and reject everything else. Under such sircumstances, everyone who refused to wholly accept inspired truth from the Spirit would, by necessity, fully reject it thereby fully opening up their will to the influence of devils. Yes, the idea that the spirit would be poured out on everyone, not just the church, really does seem to make sense and would provide an even clearer explanation for how everyone would reach a point where they were either sealed or marked.

Re: The National Sunday law is near! [Re: JCS] #123796
03/03/10 03:07 PM
03/03/10 03:07 PM
Mountain Man  Offline
SDA
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Active Member 2019

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Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 22,256
Southwest USA
Do you think poured out "on" and poured out "around" is differentiated in the prophecy? Ellen observed, "Only those who are living up to the light they have will receive greater light. Unless we are daily advancing in the exemplification of the active Christian virtues, we shall not recognize the manifestations of the Holy Spirit in the latter rain. It may be falling on hearts all around us, but we shall not discern or receive it.--TM 507 (1897). {LDE 195.4}

Re: The National Sunday law is near! [Re: Mountain Man] #123797
03/03/10 03:09 PM
03/03/10 03:09 PM
Mountain Man  Offline
SDA
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Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 22,256
Southwest USA
JCS, did you see the post at the bottom of the previous page that is addressed to you (#123739)?

Re: The National Sunday law is near! [Re: Mountain Man] #123802
03/03/10 05:21 PM
03/03/10 05:21 PM
JCS  Offline OP
Active Member 2012
Senior Member
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 470
Colorado, USA
Quote:
Do you think poured out "on" and poured out "around" is differentiated in the prophecy?


Seems to make sense. This would correlate with the idea that those not receptive to the spirit can't receive greater light. I believe if someone is whole heartedly open to to the spirit of truth (by willingly disregarding all selfish inclinations) they will be lead to the truth by the Holy Spirit even on doctrinal truths like the Sabbath, independently of available evidence for it. Thus, even for people unexposed to scripture could still be lead to biblcal truths. Unfortunately, "the heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked" thus such events in the world are very rare.

Quote:
JCS, did you see the post at the bottom of the previous page that is addressed to you (#123739)?


I'm assuming your refering to this statement:

Quote:
I believe this prophecy began to be fulfilled on Pentecost and continued to unfold and be fulfilled thereafter. It will finish being fulfilled when Jesus returns and "delivers" us.

Earlier in the prophecy Joel wrote, "Be glad then, ye children of Zion, and rejoice in the LORD your God: for he hath given you the former rain moderately, and he will cause to come down for you the rain, the former rain, and the latter rain in the first [month]." (verse 23) It is not clear, though, if the sun and moon events described in verses 30 and 31 will happen before or after the latter rain event. Ellen White was shown they happened after the former rain and before the latter rain.


Your logic is very clear and I do not have any further points or ideas to express on how these series of events unfold. To me, the evidence suggesting what happens in Joel 2: 30-31 is before the later rain has equal ground with the opposite. I guess that means for me that the jury is still out until I find more information.

Last edited by JCS; 03/03/10 05:24 PM.
Re: The National Sunday law is near! [Re: JCS] #123824
03/04/10 02:03 PM
03/04/10 02:03 PM
Mountain Man  Offline
SDA
Charter Member
Active Member 2019

20000+ Member
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 22,256
Southwest USA
JCS, thank you for responding to my comments.

Re: The National Sunday law is near! [Re: Mountain Man] #123863
03/07/10 02:28 AM
03/07/10 02:28 AM
C
crater  Offline
Veteran Member
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 989
United States

"Organizing for America , the successor organization to Obama for America, is building on the movement that elected President Obama by empowering communities across the country to bring about our agenda of change."

On the OFA site there is a blog that some have attributed to Obama, but it appears to be coming from a Mike Pearce! It is interesting the reasoning that the person gave!
Quote:

Post from Michael Pearce's Blog:@ OFA site
Energy Conservation & Globalized America
By Mike - Jun 18th, 2008 at 6:38 pm EDT

There have been a lot of changes in the past 100 years. Not only have we seen gang activity increase along with crimes, but so has energy consumption. The other change I realized was the recinding of the "Sunday Laws" across the united states.

Originally, the sunday law were instituted to make sure that people wouldn't have to choose between work and church. Often, the nobility would use financial enticements toward the religious heads of households in order to coherce them to work in order to increase his own financial gain. This was unfair to those who needed money, feared losing their means of supporting themselves, and without such a law banning people from working (though I don't believe it applied to you working for your own business), people would be further burdened.

I have to wonder if there weren't more benefits to this. First, without businesses being open, your kids would have nowhere to go for entertainment. Parents would have at least 1 day they could spend with family & friends without having to align work schedules. Decrease in gas use across the board. Less crime (since parents are home on Sundays, there is no reason why you can't keep an eye on them.) Fewer homeless people begging in the street (Since there are no people to beg from). Less Police would be necessary (if any at all... They could go on an "On Call As Needed" basis so they might be able to spend time with family. Neighbors would have time to get to know each other. How well do you know your neighbors now? Have you had any barbecues? Right now, I would guess that most people who may have barbecues, are only hanging out with people who are white collar regardless of the neighborhood you live in. Our work schedules can determine what class you relate to and hardens those lines even more.

So perhaps we should consider enacting a Sunday Law. Not to restrict people from working, but to give liberty to those who can't choose. And imagine the tax dollars that would be saved?

Problem is, I don't believe that this would be acceptable in Washington D.C. and states that collect an Income Tax. That's the real reason why the Sunday Laws were lifted. People could be forced to work more days, some part-time workers without insurance.

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