Let us be clear. A denominated people are a people that have been given a name.

The Lord has let us know the Seventh Day Adventist Church, is His denominated people, distinct separate. Our prophet is very clear on this. She repeats this in the inspired Word over and over again.

I do understand that there is a group within adventism that does not believe in this fundamental belief, and that is unfortunate. Especially considering that the group is getting bigger.

One of the test given to God's people is always the test of believing in the chosen one. This can be seen in the history of ancient Israel. If ancient Israel rejected the counsel of the prophet, they were lost. This is always the first test. All you have to do is read the story of Noah or Moses, Nehemiah, John the Baptist etc.

Some would like to treat doctrines and the Bible as a buffet. The Bible is not a buffet nor are the doctrines of the church.

By the way, access to Sister Whites writing are free online.

I understand from your text that Ellens words are scripture to you.



Matthew 12:18
"Here is my servant whom I have chosen, the one I love, in whom I delight; I will put my Spirit on him, and he will proclaim justice to the nations.

1 Peter 2:6
For in Scripture it says: "See, I lay a stone in Zion, a chosen and precious cornerstone, and the one who trusts in him will never be put to shame."

The one who trusts in the chosen one will never be put to shame. Now, who is this chosen one?

As for prophets..

Hebrews 1:
1God, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets,

2Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;

3Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high:

4Being made so much better than the angels, as he hath by inheritance obtained a more excellent name than they.

But then in even later times this must have been reversed so that God is again speaking by the prophets. For the prophets to be superseded by the Son of God, Himself God, is an honour. But if the Son of God is superseded by a prophet, whom among them is then receiving glory?

The prophecy of Daniel 9 predicts the greatest of all revivals - one in which atonement is complete, sin is ended and everlasting righteousness established. There were two 3.5 periods in the last 7 years of the 70 weeks. According to the prophecy it was in this last week that the covenant between God and His people was to be established. The first 3.5 years of the last week of years was Christ's ministry and the second was the gospel going to the Jews - 31 to 34 AD.

If we try to line up these two periods of the greatest of all reformations where would we place them in Elijah's day and in Millerite history, and especially where would we place them in the future Loud Cry?

Elijah’s 3.5 years of drought ended in revival at Mt. Carmel. This event is paralleled in Revelation 11 where the two witnesses have power for the same period to stop the rain and call down fire and smite the earth with plagues as Moses and Elijah did.



Unlike some Adventist expositors, Ellen White applies Revelation 11, ‘every verse’ of it, to the future and ties it into Rev 18, the Loud Cry.




At the first Advent of Christ revival and a special endowment of the Holy Spirit on the church came in the middle of the seventh week at the feast of Pentecost. Similarly, in Elijah’s day, fire from heaven fell at the end of the 3.5 years of drought and revival came. In the case of the Millerites there was a power that attended the message after August 11, 1840, but the third angel’s message was not empowered or given until after October 22, 1844. In the same way that the first two angel’s sounded in the 1840’s but all three were not empowered until spiritual gifts were revived in the church after 1844 - an event/endowment that not many appreciate the significance of - similarly, in the future, there will be a dual phased revival, the latter part of it paralleling the apostolic power of the two witnesses, which as we’ve seen above, Ellen White places primarily in the future.

But regarding this dual-phased revival, here is the parallel Ellen White makes to Christ’s ministry, His dual cleansing of the temple and the three angel’s messages:

In other words, in the future we can look for an initial empowerment of the gospel message followed by a second period of empowerment mingled with judgment.

I personally believe we're well into the first phase of the empowerment.

We most definitely are into the phase of empowerment but we must remember clearly, the latter rain is first poured out with measure, meaning to some. And only those who recognize it will be able to receive it. SOP quote:

Only those who are living up to the light they have will receive greater light. Unless we are daily advancing in the exemplification of the active Christian virtues, we shall not recognize the manifestations of the Holy Spirit in the latter rain. It may be falling on hearts all around us, but we shall not discern or receive it. {TM 507.1}

In John 20:22 Jesus breathed on His disciples before pentecost, and this act of breathing on His disciples was the outpouring of the Holy Spirit with measure before it was poured out without measure during the time period of pentecost.

As I have stated before, it is critical that we understand when this begins. This moment when the empowerment begins has been prefigured or shown in past histories.

Remember "God's dealing with me are ever the same" so in the examples of the end of the world in the bible, the empowerment begins when a heavenly being descends from heaven to empower the message.

In Acts, it states that when the Holy Spirit descended in the form of a dove from heaven, that act empowered Jesus ministry, then Jesus went to be tested first and He came back to test the Jews with the message.

The Millerites were also empowered on August 11, 1840 when the angel of Rev. 10:1 descended. See GC Millerites.

So with us now, and SOP clearly tells us that when the great buildings of New York come down, Rev. 18:1-3 are fulfilled, so the angel of Rev. 18:1 has come down and our testing time has begun. The message has been empowered.

If we get this wrong, if we reject this fact, we will fall into the same trap that befell the Jews in the time of Christ, and the protestant churches in the time of the Millerites.

We must understand that the time of our visitation has arrived.

I just got back from a camp meeting which was a real blessing. The Lord is giving us more light as we proceed.

The above quote is one of the reasons I do not view 9/11 as a test of faith. In order to receive the latter rain, we have to become practical Christians, growing in the active Christian virtues. Why is a particular prophetic interpretation unlikely to be a test of faith? Because what matters in God's eyes is our characters. In order to be prepared for the return of Christ we have to be like Him. Our understanding of what happened on 9/11 isn’t a matter of character.

There was a time when a prophetic interpretation was a test - the first, second and third angel's messages were indeed tests. They are tests now and they will be tests again in the future. The difference between these and 9/11 is that all three angel’s messages embrace the entire gospel, and it’s a correct understanding of the gospel and it's power to deliver us completely from the bonds of sin, not a private interpretation of prophecy, that makes these messages present truth. Therefore these message have tested and will test the church and the world “in the day when God shall judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ according to my gospel.” Romans 2:16.

I have another question. This is regarding Brother Jeff's emphasis on the 2520. I think it's good to study what Miller taught in that regard. But why so much emphasis on it and little attention on what he taught about 666 being the number of days or years of pagan Roman, starting at the Jewish-Roman treaty of 157 BC and ending in 508. Shouldn't that time prophecy receive as much attention as the 2520.

From my study of Daniel 7, I can prove that 9/11/01 is of prophetic significance. It is a lengthy study, but it is there.

"The prophecies of Daniel and of John are to be understood. They interpret each other. They give to the world truths which every one should understand. These prophecies are to be witnesses in the world. By their fulfillment in these last days they will explain themselves" (7 BC 949.6).

Multiple fulfillments?

"There in His open hand lay the book, the roll of the history of God's providences, the prophetic history of nations and the church. Herein was contained the divine utterances, His authority, His commandments, His laws, the whole symbolic counsel of the Eternal, and the history of all ruling powers in the nations. In symbolic language was contained in that roll the influence of every nation, tongue, and people from the beginning of earth's history to its close. {20MR 197.2}
This roll was written within and without. John says: "I wept much, because no man was found worthy to open and to read the book, neither to look thereon." The vision as presented to John made its impression upon his mind. The destiny of every nation was contained in that book. John was distressed at the utter inability of any human being or angelic intelligence to read the words, or even to look thereon. His soul was wrought up to such a point of agony and suspense that one of the strong angels had compassion on him, and laying his hand on him assuringly said, "Weep not: behold, the Lion of the tribe of Judah, the Root of David, hath prevailed to open the book, and to loose the seven seals thereof."

I notices phrases like "the history of all ruling powers in the nations. In symbolic language was contained in that roll the influence of every nation..." With the roll being opened some of those things revealed must apply to more than one nation.

Have you ever compared the 4 horsemen of the apocalypse to Daniel 2 and 7? Gold, silver, brass, iron and clay? Lion, bear, leopard, beast with iron teeth and brass nails? Horseman one, two, three and death and hell?

As Adventists we tend to put prophecy in a framework of linear progression and just don't see multiple fulfillments with some exceptions (the 70 AD fall of Jerusalem for example).

I'd like to read your view of 9/11 and it's connection with scripture. Would you be willing to share that with us in a new thread? Another new thread I'd be interested in is your view of 666 and the seven heads of the beast. I'd like to hear your views on that as well. The Search of Truth forum might be a good one to use.