Old Tom: The careful student of His life will note that He did not torture and then kill those who disagreed with Him.

Rosangela: Tom, in your conception removing life can never be an act of mercy?

Tom: If by "removing life" you mean "allowing one's life to end," certainly this can be an act of mercy.

Old Tom:
In fact, to those who would have fire from heaven come down to devore those who did not agree with Him, He explained that such were acting according to a different spirit.

Rosangela:
People in Sodom were incorrigible sinners, while the people to whom the disciples were referring still could be saved. This makes all the difference in the world.

Tom: What makes the difference is thinking that force is a principle of God's government and a way of solving the problems of sin. It isn't.

It appears that I have not made clear that my posts are dealing with the wrath of God in the context of the judgment of the wicked. Please do not ask me any more questions about Sodom and Gemorrah or the flood.

I haven't seen any discussion whatsoever on the posts I quoted from Scriptures or the Spirit of Prophesy regarding the wrath of God. The purpose of these posts was to demonstrate the principle that God's wrath is His giving those who reject Him over to the result of their choices. Which of the Scriptures I presented, or texts from the Spirit of Prophesy do not make that point? Did I establish the point I was trying to establish or not? If I didn't, why not?

I also wrote a long post explaining the concepts in my own words. I think that was one of my better posts. That is, it is always a challenge to convey one's thoughts on topics like this, and I felt in that post that I did a better job than I often feel I did. So I would be happy to answer any questions regarding that post or discuss any of the points made.

Please bear in mind that I am addressing God's wrath in the context of the judgment.

Tom, yes, you have clearly articulated one aspect of the wrath of God. The problem is you believe that is the only aspect. But it isn't. You want to avoid discussing the Flood and Sodom, in the context of judgment, but that is precisely the events the Bible uses to describe it. How can we ignore them? When God gave people over to reap the results of their sowing He stipulated the results. Sometimes holy angels carried out His will, sometimes it was evil angels, and other times it was other human beings. But always, in all cases, everything happened according to God's will and plan. When God swallowed Korah and his rebels it was no accident that they happened to be standing where the ground opened and closed.

Tom, your view of the wrath of God reminds of a grenade. Sinners are like grenades in the hand of God with the pin pulled. As soon as He releases His grip they explode. But this view doesn't explain the flood, the fires of Sodom, the plagues of Egypt, the death of David's son, etc. None of these situations can be explained as natural causes or consequences. They occured because God either caused them Himself or allowed someone else to cause them. Rebelling against the authority of Moses doesn't cause an earthquake to suddenly swallow you up, or cause the Red Sea to suddenly drown you - as if things like this would happen naturally if God wasn't holding back such results.

1- Tom, I mean depriving someone of life. Can this never be an act of mercy?

2- You said

quote:

---

The Spirit of Prophesy tells us that all that needs to be known about God or can be known about God was revealed in Jesus Christ.

---

This is both in His life and in His death. What killed Christ? Our sins in and of themselves? Or God's wrath against sin?

If I may interject here; Jesus endured and suffered the wrath of God, and He tasted the second death before He died the first death, but nothing actually "killed" Him, rather He laid down His life voluntarily and took it up again three days later.

John
10:15 As the Father knoweth me, even so know I the Father: and I lay down my life for the sheep.
10:16 And other sheep I have, which are not of this fold: them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice; and there shall be one fold, [and] one shepherd.
10:17 Therefore doth my Father love me, because I lay down my life, that I might take it again.
10:18 No man taketh it from me, but I lay it down of myself. I have power to lay it down, and I have power to take it again. This commandment have I received of my Father.

No, Tom, there is more to God than what Jesus revealed during His sojourn as a human being. The way God, that is, Jesus Christ, dealt with sinners in the OT is what God is like. He is slow to anger but will in no wise clear the guilty.

John
16:12 I have yet many things to say unto you, but ye cannot bear them now.
16:13 Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, [that] shall he speak: and he will show you things to come.
16:14 He shall glorify me: for he shall receive of mine, and shall show [it] unto you.
16:15 All things that the Father hath are mine: therefore said I, that he shall take of mine, and shall show [it] unto you.

1 Corinthians
10:1 Moreover, brethren, I would not that ye should be ignorant, how that all our fathers were under the cloud, and all passed through the sea;
10:2 And were all baptized unto Moses in the cloud and in the sea;
10:3 And did all eat the same spiritual meat;
10:4 And did all drink the same spiritual drink: for they drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them: and that Rock was Christ.
10:5 But with many of them God was not well pleased: for they were overthrown in the wilderness.
10:6 Now these things were our examples, to the intent we should not lust after evil things, as they also lusted.
10:7 Neither be ye idolaters, as [were] some of them; as it is written, The people sat down to eat and drink, and rose up to play.
10:8 Neither let us commit fornication, as some of them committed, and fell in one day three and twenty thousand.
10:9 Neither let us tempt Christ, as some of them also tempted, and were destroyed of serpents.
10:10 Neither murmur ye, as some of them also murmured, and were destroyed of the destroyer.
10:11 Now all these things happened unto them for ensamples: and they are written for our admonition, upon whom the ends of the world are come.