Sorry to go back to the subject of Satan visiting other worlds. From the following quote, it seems their test was similar to that of earth's inhabitants, but in these worlds no one has ever approached the tree of knowledge or eaten of its fruit:

The Lord has given me a view of other worlds. Wings were given me, and an angel attended me from the city to a place that was bright and glorious. The grass of the place was living green, and the birds there warbled a sweet song. The inhabitants of the place were of all sizes; they were noble, majestic, and lovely. They bore the express image of Jesus, and their countenances beamed with holy joy, expressive of the freedom and happiness of the place. I asked one of them why they were so much more lovely than those on the earth. The reply was, "We have lived in strict obedience to the commandments of God, and have not fallen by disobedience, like those on the earth." Then I saw two trees, one looked much like the tree of life in the city. The fruit of both looked beautiful, but of one they could not eat. They had power to eat of both, but were forbidden to eat of one. Then my attending angel said to me, "None in this place have tasted of the forbidden tree; but if they should eat, they would fall." (EW 39,40)

These two other quotes suggest that until the millennium he will continue to have access to other worlds to tempt them (he must have one of his angels in charge of each unfallen planet):

Here is to be the home of Satan with his evil angels for a thousand years. Limited to the earth, he will not have access to other worlds to tempt and annoy those who have never fallen. It is in this sense that he is bound.--GC 659. {TA 281.2}

I heard shouts of triumph from the angels and from the redeemed saints, which sounded like ten thousand musical instruments, because they were to be no more annoyed and tempted by Satan, and because the inhabitants of other worlds were delivered from his presence and his temptations.--EW 290. {TA 281.3}

[ April 28, 2005, 08:35 AM: Message edited by: Rosangela ]

I recall that the trees of the knowledge of good and evil were taken away after the cross (but I could be making this up).

It's hard to imagine God giving Satan free reign of the universe, to tempt and annoy unfallen beings without restraint. But the SOP implies it.

ED 301, 302
Between the school established in Eden at the beginning and the school of the hereafter there lies the whole compass of this world's history--the history of human transgression and suffering, of divine sacrifice, and of victory over death and sin. Not all the conditions of that first school of Eden will be found in the school of the future life. No tree of knowledge of good and evil will afford opportunity for temptation. No tempter is there, no possibility of wrong. Every character has withstood the testing of evil, and none are longer susceptible to its power. {Ed 301.6}

Tom, I have never doubted the love and goodness of God. I have always looked to Him as a tender and compassionate Father. Because of this it rarely occurs to me that God is anything but a loving heavenly Father. Throughout my many years of ministry, since 1982, I cannot recall meeting anyone who feared God as someone who is greedy to inflict pain, who is anxious to kill us.

Instead, I frequently run in to people who take God's love for granted, who prey on His great desire to pardon and save us. They view God as someone who is too kind to hold our sins against us, who readily forgives and forgets. Thus, they tend to lightly regard their defects and imperfections, rarely do they repent. I find these people almost impossible to lead to repentance and salvation.

Exodus
20:5 Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them: for I the LORD thy God [am] a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth [generation] of them that hate me;
20:6 And showing mercy unto thousands of them that love me, and keep my commandments.

3BC 1166
Very few realize the sinfulness of sin; they flatter themselves that God is too good to punish the offender. But the cases of Miriam, Aaron, David, and many others show that it is not a safe thing to sin against God in deed, in word, or even in thought. God is a being of infinite love and compassion, but He also declares Himself to be a "consuming fire, even a jealous God" (RH Aug. 14, 1900). {3BC 1166.2}

SC 31, 32
But let none deceive themselves with the thought that God, in His great love and mercy, will yet save even the rejecters of His grace. The exceeding sinfulness of sin can be estimated only in the light of the cross. When men urge that God is too good to cast off the sinner, let them look to Calvary. It was because there was no other way in which man could be saved, because without this sacrifice it was impossible for the human race to escape from the defiling power of sin, and be restored to communion with holy beings,--impossible for them again to become partakers of spiritual life,--it was because of this that Christ took upon Himself the guilt of the disobedient and suffered in the sinner's stead. The love and suffering and death of the Son of God all testify to the terrible enormity of sin and declare that there is no escape from its power, no hope of the higher life, but through the submission of the soul to Christ. {SC 31.2}

Tom, if the holy angels rejoice when God punishes and destroys unsaved sinners, who are we to question it? People who deny, or downplay, the wrath of God, the day of vengeance, are either unaware of the truth, or they are willfully ignorant of the truth. "For this they willingly are ignorant." Yes, God is slow to anger, and is not willing that any should perish. He doesn't want to lose one single soul. However, God is not ashamed to punish and destroy sinners who reject or neglect "so great salvation". Here's what the Bible says about the wrath and vengeance of God:

Romans
3:5 But if our unrighteousness commend the righteousness of God, what shall we say? [Is] God unrighteous who taketh vengeance? (I speak as a man)
3:6 God forbid: for then how shall God judge the world?

Romans
11:22 Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, severity; but toward thee, goodness, if thou continue in [his] goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be cut off.

Romans
12:19 Dearly beloved, avenge not yourselves, but [rather] give place unto wrath: for it is written, Vengeance [is] mine; I will repay, saith the Lord.

2 Thessalonians
1:6 Seeing [it is] a righteous thing with God to recompense tribulation to them that trouble you;
1:7 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels,
1:8 In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:
1:9 Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power;
1:10 When he shall come to be glorified in his saints, and to be admired in all them that believe (because our testimony among you was believed) in that day.

Hebrews
2:2 For if the word spoken by angels was stedfast, and every transgression and disobedience received a just recompense of reward;
2:3 How shall we escape, if we neglect so great salvation; which at the first began to be spoken by the Lord, and was confirmed unto us by them that heard [him];

2 Peter
3:5 For this they willingly are ignorant of, that by the word of God the heavens were of old, and the earth standing out of the water and in the water:
3:6 Whereby the world that then was, being overflowed with water, perished:
3:7 But the heavens and the earth, which are now, by the same word are kept in store, reserved unto fire against the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men.

Jude
1:7 Even as Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about them in like manner, giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh, are set forth for an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire.

Deuteronomy
32:41 If I whet my glittering sword, and mine hand take hold on judgment; I will render vengeance to mine enemies, and will reward them that hate me.
32:42 I will make mine arrows drunk with blood, and my sword shall devour flesh; [and that] with the blood of the slain and of the captives, from the beginning of revenges upon the enemy.
32:43 Rejoice, O ye nations, [with] his people: for he will avenge the blood of his servants, and will render vengeance to his adversaries, and will be merciful unto his land, [and] to his people.

Psalm
58:10 The righteous shall rejoice when he seeth the vengeance: he shall wash his feet in the blood of the wicked.
58:11 So that a man shall say, Verily [there is] a reward for the righteous: verily he is a God that judgeth in the earth.

Psalm
94:1 O LORD God, to whom vengeance belongeth; O God, to whom vengeance belongeth, show thyself.

Psalm
149:6 [Let] the high [praises] of God [be] in their mouth, and a twoedged sword in their hand;
149:7 To execute vengeance upon the heathen, [and] punishments upon the people;
149:8 To bind their kings with chains, and their nobles with fetters of iron;
149:9 To execute upon them the judgment written: this honour have all his saints. Praise ye the LORD.

Isaiah
35:4 Say to them [that are] of a fearful heart, Be strong, fear not: behold, your God will come [with] vengeance, [even] God [with] a recompense; he will come and save you.

Isaiah
63:4 For the day of vengeance [is] in mine heart, and the year of my redeemed is come.
63:5 And I looked, and [there was] none to help; and I wondered that [there was] none to uphold: therefore mine own arm brought salvation unto me; and my fury, it upheld me.
63:6 And I will tread down the people in mine anger, and make them drunk in my fury, and I will bring down their strength to the earth.

Jeremiah
11:20 But, O LORD of hosts, that judgest righteously, that triest the reins and the heart, let me see thy vengeance on them: for unto thee have I revealed my cause.

Jeremiah
46:10 For this [is] the day of the Lord GOD of hosts, a day of vengeance, that he may avenge him of his adversaries: and the sword shall devour, and it shall be satiate and made drunk with their blood: for the Lord GOD of hosts hath a sacrifice in the north country by the river Euphrates.

Ezekiel
25:12 Thus saith the Lord GOD; Because that Edom hath dealt against the house of Judah by taking vengeance, and hath greatly offended, and revenged himself upon them;
25:13 Therefore thus saith the Lord GOD; I will also stretch out mine hand upon Edom, and will cut off man and beast from it; and I will make it desolate from Teman; and they of Dedan shall fall by the sword.
25:14 And I will lay my vengeance upon Edom by the hand of my people Israel: and they shall do in Edom according to mine anger and according to my fury; and they shall know my vengeance, saith the Lord GOD.
25:15 Thus saith the Lord GOD; Because the Philistines have dealt by revenge, and have taken vengeance with a despiteful heart, to destroy [it] for the old hatred;
25:16 Therefore thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, I will stretch out mine hand upon the Philistines, and I will cut off the Cherethims, and destroy the remnant of the sea coast.
25:17 And I will execute great vengeance upon them with furious rebukes; and they shall know that I [am] the LORD, when I shall lay my vengeance upon them.

Nahum
1:2 God [is] jealous, and the LORD revengeth; the LORD revengeth, and [is] furious; the LORD will take vengeance on his adversaries, and he reserveth [wrath] for his enemies.
1:3 The LORD [is] slow to anger, and great in power, and will not at all acquit [the wicked]: the LORD hath his way in the whirlwind and in the storm, and the clouds [are] the dust of his feet.
1:4 He rebuketh the sea, and maketh it dry, and drieth up all the rivers: Bashan languisheth, and Carmel, and the flower of Lebanon languisheth.
1:5 The mountains quake at him, and the hills melt, and the earth is burned at his presence, yea, the world, and all that dwell therein.
1:6 Who can stand before his indignation? and who can abide in the fierceness of his anger? his fury is poured out like fire, and the rocks are thrown down by him.
1:7 The LORD [is] good, a strong hold in the day of trouble; and he knoweth them that trust in him.
1:8 But with an overrunning flood he will make an utter end of the place thereof, and darkness shall pursue his enemies.
1:9 What do ye imagine against the LORD? he will make an utter end: affliction shall not rise up the second time.

Getting back to "the process of conversion." According to the SOP, what happens during the process of conversion. And, what happens the moment we experience the miracle of rebirth?

DA 172
The wind is heard among the branches of the trees, rustling the leaves and flowers; yet it is invisible, and no man knows whence it comes or whither it goes. So with the work of the Holy Spirit upon the heart. It can no more be explained than can the movements of the wind. A person may not be able to tell the exact time or place, or to trace all the circumstances in the process of conversion; but this does not prove him to be unconverted. By an agency as unseen as the wind, Christ is constantly working upon the heart. Little by little, perhaps unconsciously to the receiver, impressions are made that tend to draw the soul to Christ. These may be received through meditating upon Him, through reading the Scriptures, or through hearing the word from the living preacher. Suddenly, as the Spirit comes with more direct appeal, the soul gladly surrenders itself to Jesus. By many this is called sudden conversion; but it is the result of long wooing by the Spirit of God,--a patient, protracted process. {DA 172.3}

SC 28, 29
We may have flattered ourselves, as did Nicodemus, that our life has been upright, that our moral character is correct, and think that we need not humble the heart before God, like the common sinner: but when the light from Christ shines into our souls, we shall see how impure we are; we shall discern the selfishness of motive, the enmity against God, that has defiled every act of life. Then we shall know that our own righteousness is indeed as filthy rags, and that the blood of Christ alone can cleanse us from the defilement of sin, and renew our hearts in His own likeness. {SC 28.3}

One ray of the glory of God, one gleam of the purity of Christ, penetrating the soul, makes every spot of defilement painfully distinct, and lays bare the deformity and defects of the human character. It makes apparent the unhallowed desires, the infidelity of the heart, the impurity of the lips. The sinner's acts of disloyalty in making void the law of God, are exposed to his sight, and his spirit is stricken and afflicted under the searching influence of the Spirit of God. He loathes himself as he views the pure, spotless character of Christ. {SC 29.1}

SC 34
Even one wrong trait of character, one sinful desire, persistently cherished, will eventually neutralize all the power of the gospel. Every sinful indulgence strengthens the soul's aversion to God. The man who manifests an infidel hardihood, or a stolid indifference to divine truth, is but reaping the harvest of that which he has himself sown. In all the Bible there is not a more fearful warning against trifling with evil than the words of the wise man that the sinner "shall be holden with the cords of his sins." Proverbs 5:22. {SC 34.1}

Christ is ready to set us free from sin, but He does not force the will; and if by persistent transgression the will itself is wholly bent on evil, and we do not desire to be set free, if we will not accept His grace, what more can He do? We have destroyed ourselves by our determined rejection of His love. "Behold, now is the accepted time; behold, now is the day of salvation." "Today if ye will hear His voice, harden not your hearts." 2 Corinthians 6:2; Hebrews 3:7, 8. {SC 34.2}

Mike: Tom, if the holy angels rejoice when God punishes and destroys unsaved sinners, who are we to question it? People who deny, or downplay, the wrath of God, the day of vengeance, are either unaware of the truth, or they are willfully ignorant of the truth. "For this they willingly are ignorant." Yes, God is slow to anger, and is not willing that any should perish. He doesn't want to lose one single soul. However, God is not ashamed to punish and destroy sinners who reject or neglect "so great salvation".

Tom: Those who reject God will die a terrible death. What this death looks like is plainly shown in the death of Christ. It is a death of feeling utterly abandoned by God, of feeling condemnation, of utter darkness, of "gnasing of teeth" as Jesus described it, a death compared to being cast in a lake of fire -- that's how awful it is. To recognize this fact is not to downplay God's wrath, but to recognize the hideoousness of sin. Sin is an awful thing, and God longs to rescue us from it, but if we refuse to allow Him to rescue us, we will die a hideous death. This is God's wrath.

Mike: Here's what the Bible says about the wrath and vengeance of God:

Romans
3:5 But if our unrighteousness commend the righteousness of God, what shall we say? [Is] God unrighteous who taketh vengeance? (I speak as a man)
3:6 God forbid: for then how shall God judge the world?

Tom: The previous verses set the context for these. God is on trial, and though every man prove to be a liar, God will prove to be true. The context of the passage, and Romans as a whole, is the righteousness of God, which was revealed in Jesus Christ. God judges the world, and takes vengence, by revealing truth.

In Romans 1, the wrath of God is shown to be His giving up the wicked to the result of their choice. Three times is speaks of God "giving them up." Paul is speaking here of God's wrath, just a short time after Romans 1, the same way he was a little bit previously.

Mike:

Romans
11:22 Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, severity; but toward thee, goodness, if thou continue in [his] goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be cut off.

Tom: This is the same priciple I have been enunciating. Those who reject God's grace will suffer the consequences of that choice, which is to be given up. This is the severity of God. The first chapter of "The Great Controversy" goes into this theme in great detail.

Jesus said that those who believe not are condemned. They are condemned because they have not believed, and as a consequence do not like to go to the light, lest their deeds be exposed. The principle here is that the unrepentent are uncomfortable around God. We know this by personal experience, and there are many examples in Scripture. Adam and Eve ran and hid from God. The children of Israel couldn't even bare to look at Moses' face. The wicked when Christ comes call for the mountaints to fall on them rather than to look at the face of He who died to redeem them.

The light of the glory of God, which gives life to the righteous, slays the wicked. This is the wrath of God.

To sin, whereever it is found, God is a consuming fire. For those who repent of sin, that fire works in a way which leads to healing. For those who refuse to respond to God's love, that fire works to destruction. It's the same fire, but the response of the individual causes a different result.

As the Spirit of Prophesy puts it, those who refuse God's mercy form characters which are so out of harmony with God's character that His presence is to them a consuming fire.

This is God's wrath.

Mike:

Romans
12:19 Dearly beloved, avenge not yourselves, but [rather] give place unto wrath: for it is written, Vengeance [is] mine; I will repay, saith the Lord.

Tom: This text also brings out the point I've been making. Here's the next two verses:

0Therefore if thine enemy hunger, feed him; if he thirst, give him drink: for in so doing thou shalt heap coals of fire on his head.

21Be not overcome of evil, but overcome evil with good.

These verses bring out how God repays -- by overcoming evil with good.

Mike:

2 Thessalonians
1:6 Seeing [it is] a righteous thing with God to recompense tribulation to them that trouble you;
1:7 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels,
1:8 In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:
1:9 Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power;
1:10 When he shall come to be glorified in his saints, and to be admired in all them that believe (because our testimony among you was believed) in that day.

Tom: Right, the light of the glory of God, which gives life to the righteous, destroys the wicked.

Mike:

Hebrews
2:2 For if the word spoken by angels was stedfast, and every transgression and disobedience received a just recompense of reward;
2:3 How shall we escape, if we neglect so great salvation; which at the first began to be spoken by the Lord, and was confirmed unto us by them that heard [him];

Tom: How shall we escape indeed. God has gone to great lenghts to demonstrate the truth about Himself, which is that He is gracious, kind, generous, and a respector of freedom. He is not cruel, arbitrary or harsh, as the enemy has portrayed Him to be. He does not torture or kill His children in the end because they reject His overtures of love, but if they refuse to be reconciled to Him, they will die a terrible death, as Christ's death on the cross demonstrated.

I'm going to stop here. I've gone through quite a fer Scriptures here. I'm sure the principles of the others would be the same as those I've discovered. If you want me to consider one or two of the texts I've skipped here, I'm happy to do this.

You have not dealt with any of the Scripture texts or Spirit of Prophesy texts I cited. These texts demonstrate that God's wrath is His giving those who reject Him over to the result of their choice. I went over one of them, the one from Deuteronomy, in detail.

Here's the formula presented in the Scriptures I presented:

1) Because sin is chosen
2) God withdraws
3) Which equals His wrath
4) and results in trouble.

Throwing Satan into the mix, we see that when God's protection is rejected, Satan is given free reign over those who have rejected God, and that he favors some and destroys others. When he destroys, he leads men to view his destructive work as something which God has done, and indeed many ignorantly view things that way. (see e.g. GC 35, 36)

I'd be interested in your comments regarding the Scripture texts and the Spirit of Prophesy texts I presented.

Tom, as I have posted before, you have clearly stated one aspect of the wrath of God. Yes, God gives people over, if they refuse to accept Jesus as their personal Saviour, to reap the consequences of their sinful choices. I agree with you. But, exactly how those consequences have played out has varied throughout the history of God's wrath. How it will play out in the end is something, I suspect, we will never agree on. In time we will both know the truth.

DA 324
When the soul surrenders itself to Christ, a new power takes possession of the new heart. A change is wrought which man can never accomplish for himself. It is a supernatural work, bringing a supernatural element into human nature. The soul that is yielded to Christ becomes His own fortress, which He holds in a revolted world, and He intends that no authority shall be known in it but His own. A soul thus kept in possession by the heavenly agencies is impregnable to the assaults of Satan. But unless we do yield ourselves to the control of Christ, we shall be dominated by the wicked one. We must inevitably be under the control of the one or the other of the two great powers that are contending for the supremacy of the world.

It is not necessary for us deliberately to choose the service of the kingdom of darkness in order to come under its dominion. We have only to neglect to ally ourselves with the kingdom of light. If we do not co-operate with the heavenly agencies, Satan will take possession of the heart, and will make it his abiding place. The only defense against evil is the indwelling of Christ in the heart through faith in His righteousness. Unless we become vitally connected with God, we can never resist the unhallowed effects of self-love, self-indulgence, and temptation to sin. We may leave off many bad habits, for the time we may part company with Satan; but without a vital connection with God, through the surrender of ourselves to Him moment by moment, we shall be overcome. Without a personal acquaintance with Christ, and a continual communion, we are at the mercy of the enemy, and shall do his bidding in the end. {DA 324.1}

DA 827
All who consecrate soul, body, and spirit to God will be constantly receiving a new endowment of physical and mental power. The inexhaustible supplies of heaven are at their command. Christ gives them the breath of His own spirit, the life of His own life. The Holy Spirit puts forth its highest energies to work in heart and mind. The grace of God enlarges and multiplies their faculties, and every perfection of the divine nature comes to their assistance in the work of saving souls. Through co-operation with Christ they are complete in Him, and in their human weakness they are enabled to do the deeds of Omnipotence. {DA 827.3}