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Re: Is the Hell Doctrine depicted in the TYPE (Laws of Moses)?
[Re: Elle]
#135777
08/27/11 04:05 PM
08/27/11 04:05 PM
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Active Member 2013
Full Member
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Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 215
Florida, USA
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I am afraid you aren't reading what I am reading. "Whosoever believeth" means IF you believe. IF you don't believe, you don't get life everlasting.
Harold T.
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Re: Is the Hell Doctrine depicted in the TYPE (Laws of Moses)?
[Re: Harold Fair]
#135778
08/27/11 04:32 PM
08/27/11 04:32 PM
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OP
Active Member 2019
Died February 12, 2019
2500+ Member
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Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 2,536
Canada
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I am afraid you aren't reading what I am reading. "Whosoever believeth" means IF you believe. IF you don't believe, you don't get life everlasting. I am afraid you do not know/understand God's power and that's why you hear and read an "IF" that is not there. That text is a statement not a condition. It is because you do not believe that God is able to bring us all into belief as He has vowed in Is 45:23-25 and many other texts you need to add an "IF" there to make some sense out of it. You(and most of us, including I-- who has just discovered this recently) do not know/understand the plan of salvation depicted in the 3 Feasts in the Law. A lot of the scriptures in the NT talk about the firstfruits. But there are two other harvests. The 3 harvests are ALL Harvested. Also the law of Jubilee is a major one to understand that explains redemption, forgiveness and mercy according to God's mind and His intention in His plan. All these laws combined is what brings True Divine Justice according to God’s Law and not according to man’s interpretation of justice.
Blessings
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Re: Is the Hell Doctrine depicted in the TYPE (Laws of Moses)?
[Re: Elle]
#135779
08/27/11 05:29 PM
08/27/11 05:29 PM
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5500+ Member
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Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 6,154
Brazil
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The law makes justice the first priority with the purpose (1) to correct the sinner What happens when the sinner is an incorrigible one? ???? You do not believe in God’s power and His abilities in bringing “ all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth. ” 1 Tim 2:4 As He has vowed in AV Isa 45:23 “ I have sworn by myself, the word is gone out of my mouth [in] righteousness, and shall not return, That unto me every knee shall bow, every tongue shall swear…25 ... all the seed of Israel be justified, and shall glory ”. This vow God has made is a promise of what He will Accomplish . It is not dependable on our abilities or what we will do, but on God’s abilities and what He will do and He will bring us all into glorification as He has vowed. To say what you said above implies the following : (1)God is not capable to fulfill His vow (2)Thus God is a liar (3)God’s love has no power to influence us and convert us. (4)God did a lousy job in creating us for His design is not capable to respond to God’s love. God is able, is not a liar, His love has power and what He has created is able to respond to Him. No problem there. The real problem is we are finite beings and have come to wrong interpretations of the Bible because we do not understand the LAW. Let’s look what the law says first and try to see where and what we have mist out. Elle, 1) There was the death penalty in the law of Moses for incorrigible sinners. 2) God's love respects our free will. Satan and His angels are incorrigible sinners; why isn't God able to save them? Jesus said in no unclear terms that there would be those to whom He would have to say: "Depart from Me, you cursed, into the everlasting fire prepared for the devil and his angels" (Matt. 25:41).
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Re: Is the Hell Doctrine depicted in the TYPE (Laws of Moses)?
[Re: Rosangela]
#135781
08/27/11 08:12 PM
08/27/11 08:12 PM
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OP
Active Member 2019
Died February 12, 2019
2500+ Member
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Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 2,536
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1) There was the death penalty in the law of Moses for incorrigible sinners.
2) God's love respects our free will. Satan and His angels are incorrigible sinners; why isn't God able to save them? Jesus said in no unclear terms that there would be those to whom He would have to say: "Depart from Me, you cursed, into the everlasting fire prepared for the devil and his angels" (Matt. 25:41). 1) To be specific, it was the stoning that brought death. Now this brings two questions that relates to this topic. a) Why does some law's verdict a define restitution, whereas some others laws the verdict is stoning to death? Isn’t only breaking one little law, the same as breaking all of them? James 2:10 b)The letter of the law says “stoning” to death which is important for us to know. However, we need to go beyond the literal surface reading and seek to also know the spirit of the law which is God’s intent and perspective. What is the spiritual meaning of stoning? As I have already ask in the “ Is the Hell Doctrine depicted in the Law of Moses this question that maybe you would care to answer it here. Only by answering this question, might lead to shed some light to what is the meaning of death here. 2)Freewill is another man-made mis-conception that is not biblical and I have expanded quite broadly in this discussion . Concerning Mat 25:41 to properly understand what Jesus is talking about there’s two words that needs to be biblically define : a) fire—could be the same as in the lake of fire and b) everlasting (eonian in NT and Olam in OT).
Blessings
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Re: Is the Hell Doctrine depicted in the TYPE (Laws of Moses)?
[Re: Elle]
#135782
08/27/11 09:28 PM
08/27/11 09:28 PM
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Elle,
I am not certain what you are saying in your posts.
Are you saying that everybody will be saved and that nobody will be lost?
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Re: Is the Hell Doctrine depicted in the TYPE (Laws of Moses)?
[Re: Daryl]
#135783
08/27/11 09:43 PM
08/27/11 09:43 PM
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OP
Active Member 2019
Died February 12, 2019
2500+ Member
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Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 2,536
Canada
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Elle,
I am not certain what you are saying in your posts.
Are you saying that everybody will be saved and that nobody will be lost? Daryl, I have said and implied this many times in other threads. Via my personal studies this past 1.5 year this is what I understand. However, what I think I know and what I say has no weight. Let's all look what the Law of Moses says.
Blessings
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Re: Is the Hell Doctrine depicted in the TYPE (Laws of Moses)?
[Re: Elle]
#135784
08/27/11 09:53 PM
08/27/11 09:53 PM
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5500+ Member
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Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 6,154
Brazil
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a) Why does some law's verdict a define restitution, whereas some others laws the verdict is stoning to death? Isn’t only breaking one little law, the same as breaking all of them? James 2:10 I believe the main factor here is motivation - the death penalty was for willful, premeditated sins. b)The letter of the law says “stoning” to death which is important for us to know. However, we need to go beyond the literal surface reading and seek to also know the spirit of the law which is God’s intent and perspective. The way the sinner died does not matter. Not always was stoning used. Sometimes God ordered the sword to be used (Ex 32:27) - not to mention that sometimes God Himself did the killing (like in the case of Nadab and Abihu). Freewill is another man-made mis-conception that is not biblical and I have expanded quite broadly in this discussion . Concerning Mat 25:41 to properly understand what Jesus is talking about there’s two words that needs to be biblically define :
a) fire—could be the same as in the lake of fire and
b) everlasting (eonian in NT and Olam in OT). What Jesus is talking about is that some men, in the same way as the devil and his angels, won't be saved.
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Re: Is the Hell Doctrine depicted in the TYPE (Laws of Moses)?
[Re: Elle]
#135785
08/27/11 09:59 PM
08/27/11 09:59 PM
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What specifically are you referring to as the Law of Moses?
In other words, can you break it down and tell me/us what all is considered to be a part of as in contained in the Law of Moses?
Are the Ten Commandments separate from the Law of Moses?
I hope you understand my questions.
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Re: Is the Hell Doctrine depicted in the TYPE (Laws of Moses)?
[Re: Daryl]
#135790
08/28/11 05:41 PM
08/28/11 05:41 PM
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As it doesn't seem I am going to receive an answer to my questions, I need to see if I can find my own answer, therefore, I will do some research and come back to this thread later.
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