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Re: No Prophetic Time after 1844
[Re: Mountain Man]
#136935
10/18/11 06:22 PM
10/18/11 06:22 PM
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Global Moderator Supporting Member 2022
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Dedication, how do you understand the following sentence - "While the cloud was passing from the Holiest to the east which took a number of days"? To me the expression simply means its describing time from the point when Christ leaves heaven till He is visibly seen coming over the eastern horizon by people of earth . Matt. 24:27 For as the lightning cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be. His leaving the holiest in this sentence is not the same moment as His leaving the mediatorial work before the ark. For the paragraph clearly outlines the time of trouble taking place BEFORE. Look at the sentence again -- While the cloud was passing from the Holiest to the east which took a number of days the Synagogue of Satan worshiped at the saints feet. Q. What was taking place during those days while the cloud with Christ was traveling? A. The synagogue of Satan worshiped at the saints' feet. Now ask -- when do the wicked recognize and ACKNOWLEDGE the persecuted people ARE actually God's saints? Answer: Not till after God delivers His saints from the murderous designs of the wicked by a mighty revelation in the skies showing His commands and pronouncing His blessing and announcing the day of Christ's coming. An event that takes place during the SEVENTH plague. I saw the time of trouble, such as never was,--Jesus told me it was the time of Jacob's trouble, and that we should be delivered out of it by the voice of God. Just before we entered it, (1)we all received the seal of the living God. Then I saw the (2)four Angels cease to hold the four winds. And I saw famine, pestilence and sword, nation rose against nation, and (3)the whole world was in confusion. Then we (4)cried to God for deliverance day and night till we began to hear the bells on Jesus' garment. And I saw Jesus rise up in the Holiest, and as he came out we heard the tinkling of bells, and knew our High Priest was coming out. Then (5)we heard the voice of God which shook the heavens and earth, and gave the 144,000 the day and hour of Jesus' coming. Then the (6)saints were free, united and full of the glory of God, for he had turned their captivity. And I saw (7)a flaming cloud come where Jesus stood and he laid off his priestly garment and put on his kingly robe, took his place on the cloud which carried him to the (8)east where it first appeared to the saints on earth, a small black cloud, which was the sign of the Son of Man. While the cloud was passing from the Holiest to the east which took a number of days, the Synagogue of Satan worshiped at the saints feet. Ellen G. Harmon {DS, March 14, 1846 par. 2}
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Re: No Prophetic Time after 1844
[Re: kland]
#136942
10/19/11 02:24 PM
10/19/11 02:24 PM
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SDA Charter Member Active Member 2019
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Posts: 22,256
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Dedication, thank you for answering my question. However, the following quotes come to mind: Then I saw that after Jesus leaves the sanctuary the plagues will be poured out. Said the angel, It is the wrath of God and the Lamb that causes the destruction or death of the wicked. I saw that at the voice of God the saints will be mighty and terrible as an army with banners, but they will not then execute the judgment written. {12MR 248.2}
When Christ shall cease His work as mediator in man's behalf, then this time of trouble will begin. --PP 201 (1890). {LDE 253.1}
When Jesus leaves the most holy His restraining Spirit is withdrawn from rulers and people. --1T 204 (1859). {LDE 255.1}
I saw that the four angels would hold the four winds until Jesus' work was done in the sanctuary, and then will come the seven last plagues. --EW 36 (1851). {LDE 256.2}
When He leaves the sanctuary, darkness covers the inhabitants of the earth. In that fearful time the righteous must live in the sight of a holy God without an intercessor. --GC 613, 614 (1911). {LDE 265.6} The sequence is: 1. The holy angels finish sealing and marking mankind. 2. Probation closes. 3. Jesus ceases mediating. 4. He dons His most kingly garments. 5. He leaves the sanctuary bound for the East. 6. The holy angels begin pouring out the plagues. 7. The great time of trouble begins. 8. A "number of days" later Jesus appears in the East.
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Re: No Prophetic Time after 1844
[Re: Mountain Man]
#136950
10/20/11 02:39 AM
10/20/11 02:39 AM
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But you have cut and pasted quotes from all over put them together, and then assigned a PARTIAL sentence with the words "a number of days" to cover all the "cut and pasted" quotes. The paragraph in question says: I saw the time of trouble, such as never was,--Jesus told me it was the time of Jacob's trouble, and that we should be delivered out of it by the voice of God. Just before we entered it, (1)we all received the seal of the living God. Then I saw the (2)four Angels cease to hold the four winds. And I saw famine, pestilence and sword, nation rose against nation, and (3)the whole world was in confusion. Then we (4)cried to God for deliverance day and night till we began to hear the bells on Jesus' garment. And I saw Jesus rise up in the Holiest, and as he came out we heard the tinkling of bells, and knew our High Priest was coming out. Then (5)we heard the voice of God which shook the heavens and earth, and gave the 144,000 the day and hour of Jesus' coming. Then the (6)saints were free, united and full of the glory of God, for he had turned their captivity. And I saw (7)a flaming cloud come where Jesus stood and he laid off his priestly garment and put on his kingly robe, took his place on the cloud which carried him to the (8)east where it first appeared to the saints on earth, a small black cloud, which was the sign of the Son of Man. While the cloud was passing from the Holiest to the east which took a number of days, the Synagogue of Satan worshiped at the saints feet. Ellen G. Harmon {DS, March 14, 1846 par. 2} " While the cloud was passing from the Holiest to the east which took a number of days, the Synagogue of Satan worshiped at the saints feet.What, according to that sentence, was taking place WHILE the cloud was in transit?
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Re: No Prophetic Time after 1844
[Re: Mountain Man]
#136962
10/21/11 03:23 PM
10/21/11 03:23 PM
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Besides presenting to us other, "number of days", how would you expect her to say it if it did indeed take a number of days, oh, say over 1335 days? I suspect she would have referred to a time period encompassing more than three years with an expression like "several years". In the only place you quoted her saying "a number of days" “Some of the poor were zealous to attend every conference, taking their whole families with them, consuming a number of days to get to the place of meeting . . . {LS80 264.1}
does she intend "a number of days" to mean a short time or a long time? It seems clear to me that you intend that when Jesus leaves the sanctuary as mediator and therefore withdraws His restraining Spirit which causes the four winds to blow allowing the plagues to be poured out, He is immediately on his way to earth. Is that supported?
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Re: No Prophetic Time after 1844
[Re: kland]
#136976
10/22/11 12:25 AM
10/22/11 12:25 AM
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SDA Charter Member Active Member 2019
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"While the cloud was passing from the Holiest to the east which took a number of days, the Synagogue of Satan worshiped at the saints feet." What, according to that sentence, was taking place WHILE the cloud was in transit? She wrote - "the Synagogue of Satan worshiped at the saints feet." Are we to assume nothing else will happen during that period of time?
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Re: No Prophetic Time after 1844
[Re: Mountain Man]
#136977
10/22/11 12:27 AM
10/22/11 12:27 AM
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SDA Charter Member Active Member 2019
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It seems clear to me that you intend that when Jesus leaves the sanctuary as mediator and therefore withdraws His restraining Spirit which causes the four winds to blow allowing the plagues to be poured out, He is immediately on his way to earth. Is that supported? Yes. Please see quotes posted above.
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Re: No Prophetic Time after 1844
[Re: Mountain Man]
#136997
10/22/11 08:41 PM
10/22/11 08:41 PM
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"While the cloud was passing from the Holiest to the east which took a number of days, the Synagogue of Satan worshiped at the saints feet." What, according to that sentence, was taking place WHILE the cloud was in transit? She wrote - "the Synagogue of Satan worshiped at the saints feet." Are we to assume nothing else will happen during that period of time? Yes, -- it's WHILE the cloud travels that the synagogue of Satan worshiped at the saints feet. They most certainly were NOT acknowledging the saints as God's people during the time of trouble prior to God's dramatic deliverance and announcement.
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Re: No Prophetic Time after 1844
[Re: dedication]
#137009
10/23/11 12:43 AM
10/23/11 12:43 AM
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SDA Charter Member Active Member 2019
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Dedication, I cannot help concluding the other quotes I posted above make it clear the "number of days" begins the moment Jesus leaves the sanctuary.
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Re: No Prophetic Time after 1844
[Re: Mountain Man]
#137030
10/24/11 05:01 AM
10/24/11 05:01 AM
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Global Moderator Supporting Member 2022
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So I guess we must agree to disagree.
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Re: No Prophetic Time after 1844
[Re: Mountain Man]
#137031
10/24/11 12:13 PM
10/24/11 12:13 PM
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It seems clear to me that you intend that when Jesus leaves the sanctuary as mediator and therefore withdraws His restraining Spirit which causes the four winds to blow allowing the plagues to be poured out, He is immediately on his way to earth. Is that supported? Yes. Please see quotes posted above. I must be dense. I read them again and I cannot find where it says He is immediately on his way to earth when he leaves the sanctuary. Could you please point it out?
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