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Re: Salvation of the wicked !!!
#14060
06/20/05 04:53 AM
06/20/05 04:53 AM
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Active Member 2012
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Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 14,795
Lawrence, Kansas
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So basically by refusing to pardon the fellow who was in debt to him, he was returning the pardong which God had given to him. That is, we cannot receive (believe) the forgiveness of God if refuse to forgive those who have trespassed against us. It's not an arbitrary quid pro pro reaction on the part of God, but an inability of the one being pardoned to receive the pardong being given. quote:
"But if ye forgive not men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses." Matt. 6:15. Nothing can justify an unforgiving spirit. He who is unmerciful toward others shows that he himself is not a partaker of God's pardoning grace. In God's forgiveness the heart of the erring one is drawn close to the great heart of Infinite Love. The tide of divine compassion flows into the sinner's soul, and from him to the souls of others. The tenderness and mercy that Christ has revealed in His own precious life will be seen in those who become sharers of His grace. But "if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of His." Rom. 8:9. He is alienated from God, fitted only for eternal separation from Him.
It is true that he may once have received forgiveness; but his unmerciful spirit shows that he now rejects God's pardoning love. He has separated himself from God, and is in the same condition as before he was forgiven. He has denied his repentance,and his sins are upon him as if he had not repented. (COL 251)
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Re: Salvation of the wicked !!!
#14061
06/21/05 02:29 AM
06/21/05 02:29 AM
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SDA
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Southwest USA
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quote:
How can we then accuse God of a justice outside of his spirit?
According to Tom's quote above the servant not only incurred more debt by not forgiving the debt of his fellow servant, but he also became responsible for the original debt again. Does that make God an "indian giver"? Is it just for God to forgive one moment and then change His mind the next?
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Re: Salvation of the wicked !!!
#14062
06/21/05 02:47 AM
06/21/05 02:47 AM
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OP
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Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 1,196
Ontario
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Did God change his mind, or did the servant refuse to receive the forgiveness? Did he not offer him so great a salvation?
If it is not received into the heart, then it is not received.
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Re: Salvation of the wicked !!!
#14063
06/21/05 02:51 AM
06/21/05 02:51 AM
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Active Member 2012
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Posts: 14,795
Lawrence, Kansas
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That wasn't the point at all MM. The point was that God does not require forgiveness on our part in order to forgive us, but that if we do not forgive others that is proof that we do not have the pardoning love of God in our heart. IOW, our refusing to forgive is evidence of the fact that we have not been forgiven.
It's not talking about debt. Debt's not the issue. It's just a means to an end to explain a truth, which is simply that if we are forgiven we will manifest that same spirit to others.
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Re: Salvation of the wicked !!!
#14064
06/20/05 07:07 PM
06/20/05 07:07 PM
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SDA
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quote:
If it is not received into the heart, then it is not received.
You mean, once saved always saved? That is, if we were truly saved in the first place we wouldn't end up lost? we would demonstrate the fruit of forgiving others? And, what about God taking back His forgiveness?
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Re: Salvation of the wicked !!!
#14065
06/20/05 10:13 PM
06/20/05 10:13 PM
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OP
Dedicated Member
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Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 1,196
Ontario
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No, I mean if it is not received into the heart, then it is not received.
The things of God do not work salvation in us until we accept/receive it into our being. Therefore it is by faith; by faith we receive his judgment over ours and are able to live thereby. Any other belief will not save us from sin.
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Re: Salvation of the wicked !!!
#14066
06/20/05 10:16 PM
06/20/05 10:16 PM
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Active Member 2012
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Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 14,795
Lawrence, Kansas
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God doesn't take back His forgiveness. The receiver of said forgiveness refuses to continue to receive it. God continues to give it.
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Re: Salvation of the wicked !!!
#14067
06/21/05 04:26 AM
06/21/05 04:26 AM
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SDA
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But according to the SDA view of judgment the backslidden, unsaved person will end up dying with all of his sins. Doesn't that mean his forgiven sins are placed back upon him?
Hebrews
10:26 For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,
10:27 But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.
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Re: Salvation of the wicked !!!
#14068
06/21/05 04:59 AM
06/21/05 04:59 AM
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Active Member 2012
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Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 14,795
Lawrence, Kansas
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Sin is not a "thing" which can be placed upon someone. Sin resides in the mind. It is something from which we must be healed. It is a part of our experience.
When we enter into a personal relationship with God by faith in Christ, we begin to experience life eternal, which is knowing God. Our healing begins, and we are set right with God. As long as we continue in faith, we are kept right. We are transformed into His image, and the healing continues. We form characters in harmony with the principles of His government, and are "safe to save."
If we repent of our repentance, then our former sin, which still form a part of our experience, remains with us. The dog returns to the vomit, as the Scriptures say (Prov. 26:11).
It's not that God punishes us by placing our sins upon us because we have acted in unbelief, but our unbelief makes it impossible for Him to heal us from our sin. To be saved from sin, we must be right with God. There's no other way.
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Re: Salvation of the wicked !!!
#14069
06/21/05 01:53 PM
06/21/05 01:53 PM
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SDA
Charter Member
Active Member 2019
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Southwest USA
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I like that, Tom, thank you. I guess that is why we must believe we are forgiven in order for forgiveness to set us free. People who refuse to believe they are forgiven fail to experience the joy of forgiveness. It's truly a sad thing when people, especially loved ones, do not believe they are forgiven. Oh, how they suffer. But it's equally as sad when people believe they are forgiven when they have no right to it. It's amazing to me that they seem to be able to experience the joy of forgiveness as if they are truly forgiven. What's up with that?
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