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Should women be allowed to entice men in the workplace?
#148374
12/25/12 02:19 AM
12/25/12 02:19 AM
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OP
SDA Active Member 2018
Most Dedicated Member
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Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 2,264
Asia
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Should women be allowed to entice men in the workplace? Should professional women who are very good at their job be allowed to wear clothes and carry themselves in an enticing manner at work? Is this appropriate or a right of hers to dress and act as she wishes? Or does the employer have the right to insist on certain behavior and dress for a peaceful and productive work environment? A court case supporting the employer has recently passed the appellate courts. http://gma.yahoo.com/blogs/abc-blogs/den...topstories.html
Last edited by Alchemy; 12/25/12 02:31 AM.
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Re: Should women be allowed to entice men in the workplace?
[Re: Alchemy]
#148415
12/26/12 03:26 PM
12/26/12 03:26 PM
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SDA Active Member 2024
5500+ Member
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Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 6,509
Midland
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Sounds like two different questions.
One is attempt, the other is success.
But an interesting point, could men be accused of sexual harassment if women wore enticing clothes? Is it the employer's responsibility to create a safe environment so no one is unnecessarily tempted?
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Re: Should women be allowed to entice men in the workplace?
[Re: kland]
#148426
12/26/12 11:58 PM
12/26/12 11:58 PM
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FORMER-SDA Active Member 2018 Banned
Senior Member
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Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 663
Canada
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******* REMOVED AS INAPPROPRIATE CONTENT *******
Last edited by Daryl; 01/02/13 05:03 PM. Reason: Removed and a CPM Staff Notice issued.
"All that is Gold does not Glitter, Not all who Wander are Lost." (J.R.R.T.)
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Re: Should women be allowed to entice men in the workplace?
[Re: JAK]
#148431
12/27/12 01:21 AM
12/27/12 01:21 AM
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OP
SDA Active Member 2018
Most Dedicated Member
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Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 2,264
Asia
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******* QUOTED POST REMOVED AS PART OF A THREAD CLEANUP *******
Whether it's the best thing to discuss is irrelevant, is this a concern is relevant.
I personally believe that the workplace should be kept reasonably safe from people imposing on others with their dress or attitudes. I do find temptation a valid point in my Christian walk anyway.
Last edited by Daryl; 01/02/13 05:05 PM. Reason: Thread Cleanup
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Re: Should women be allowed to entice men in the workplace?
[Re: Alchemy]
#148435
12/27/12 04:46 AM
12/27/12 04:46 AM
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FORMER-SDA Active Member 2018 Banned
Senior Member
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Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 663
Canada
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******* REMOVED AS INAPPROPRIATE CONTENT *******
Last edited by Daryl; 01/02/13 05:04 PM. Reason: Removed and a CPM Staff Notice issued.
"All that is Gold does not Glitter, Not all who Wander are Lost." (J.R.R.T.)
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Re: Should women be allowed to entice men in the workplace?
[Re: JAK]
#148441
12/27/12 08:21 AM
12/27/12 08:21 AM
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SDA Active Member 2021
5500+ Member
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Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 7,003
The Orient
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I think most men are too embarrassed to admit that they have a problem with seeing immodestly-clad women. So the issue gets swept under the rug. It would not be "manly" to appear weak. Furthermore, when most of "the guys" would enjoy seeing a little "extra," most men would not wish to "make waves" or risk others' scorn for saying they had a problem with keeping their thoughts pure around such women as are immodestly-dressed.
I agree with Alchemy. It is a problem. It is, in fact, the sin of this age. Our society has become increasingly bold in matters of sensuality.
In my opinion, if it is "sexual harassment" for a man to whistle or comment on a woman's good figure, it should be sexual harassment for a woman to flaunt it. Women are turned on by such comments, and men are turned on by such views. The harassment regulations appear to have looked only at the woman's side of things. Men are disadvantaged, and are still harassed.
Blessings,
Green Cochoa.
We can receive of heaven's light only as we are willing to be emptied of self. We can discern the character of God, and accept Christ by faith, only as we consent to the bringing into captivity of every thought to the obedience of Christ. And to all who do this, the Holy Spirit is given without measure. In Christ "dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily. And ye are complete in Him." [Colossians 2:9, 10.] {GW 57.1} -- Ellen White.
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Re: Should women be allowed to entice men in the workplace?
[Re: Green Cochoa]
#148492
12/28/12 09:13 PM
12/28/12 09:13 PM
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SDA Active Member 2014 Retired Pastor
3000+ Member
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Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 3,014
Iceland
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At least the Muslims are consistent how they make their women dress in public. Is this the way we want to go?
I agree that a Christian woman needs to be modest in dress and by all means avoid being a temptress.
Do the men have no responsibility how they act? Are we following in the footsteps of Adam when he gave the woman the whole responsibility? We have Christian Churches steeped in male chauvinism where the female is mostly the guilty one and the male remains innocent whatever he does to a woman. It is his excuse that the woman enticed him with her beauty or friendliness. Is this where we want to go?
"Here is a last piece of advice. If you believe in goodness and if you value the approval of God, fix your minds on the things which are holy and right and pure and beautiful and good. Model your conduct on what you have learned from me, on what I have told you and shown you, and you will find the God of peace will be with you."
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Re: Should women be allowed to entice men in the workplace?
[Re: Johann]
#148497
12/29/12 12:37 AM
12/29/12 12:37 AM
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Ellen White had a lot to say in her time about the manner of how women should be dressed, did she not?
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Re: Should women be allowed to entice men in the workplace?
[Re: Johann]
#148501
12/29/12 05:51 AM
12/29/12 05:51 AM
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SDA Active Member 2021
5500+ Member
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Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 7,003
The Orient
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At least the Muslims are consistent how they make their women dress in public. Is this the way we want to go?
I agree that a Christian woman needs to be modest in dress and by all means avoid being a temptress.
Do the men have no responsibility how they act? Are we following in the footsteps of Adam when he gave the woman the whole responsibility? We have Christian Churches steeped in male chauvinism where the female is mostly the guilty one and the male remains innocent whatever he does to a woman. It is his excuse that the woman enticed him with her beauty or friendliness. Is this where we want to go? Perhaps it is this way in your country. Places I've been have typically been lenient on women in the sexual conduct arena. For example, when a man rapes a woman, he can expect a significant jail term. When a woman rapes a man, she gets only a slap on the wrist (and many sorry men wishing she had raped them). I was working at an Adventist institution where one of the staff ladies seduced one of the male staff. She wanted him to marry her, and she thought she would force the outcome by such an act. He didn't want to marry her. In the end, the administrator counseled them to keep separate, and they were both given a leave without pay of three months. I suppose this appeared "fair," since they both received the same treatment. But one can only imagine what might have been the situation had it been the man to force himself upon the woman. I expect it would have been handled somewhat differently then. There are definite differences between men and women in this area, not only in physiology and in attitudes and perspectives, but also in what society views as acceptable. Men are frequently treated more harshly where I've been. The harshest part for the woman is the pregnancy and the "hit-and-run" deadbeats who don't support their progeny. Interestingly, Ellen White does not make much of an issue of a man's dress. But she speaks much of ladies' dress. Is this fair? Is it fair that Mrs. White talks more about the men in other areas? I see it as fair. There are God-given differences between men and women that make these distinctions necessary. Too often people try to say that what God created as two distinct forms should be exactly the same in every respect. Blessings, Green Cochoa.
We can receive of heaven's light only as we are willing to be emptied of self. We can discern the character of God, and accept Christ by faith, only as we consent to the bringing into captivity of every thought to the obedience of Christ. And to all who do this, the Holy Spirit is given without measure. In Christ "dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily. And ye are complete in Him." [Colossians 2:9, 10.] {GW 57.1} -- Ellen White.
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Re: Should women be allowed to entice men in the workplace?
[Re: Green Cochoa]
#148504
12/29/12 12:23 PM
12/29/12 12:23 PM
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SDA Chaplain Active Member 2022
Most Dedicated Member
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Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 2,364
USA
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In my opinion, this is a complex case with several aspects which must be considered. So, I will address several of them:
1) A public business has a right to establish standards fo dress for both males and for females. I work in a Federal government institution which has standards of dress for both men and women.
2) I consider the decision of the Court to be of narrow focus. Baased upon the statements made, I consider to be be an appropriate decision. IOW, I agree with it.
3) I personally object to the title of this thread: Should women be allowed to entice men. . . That title comes across to me as sexist and unfair to women.
4) I believe that men has a responsibility that is often not given to them.
5) If I am walking down the street and an adult woman comes toward me who is either topless or naked, the responsibility is mine not to jump on her. The responsisbility is not hers as to what I do. Period. End of discussion.
6) Folks, we live in a world where exposure of human flesh is becomming more accepted. Laws are changing. About a year ago, a city near where I live passed a new law: That law prohibited total public nudity on the part of any adults. But, it allowed adults to be topless. Frankly, it was passed because it was felt that it addressed a situation that had gotten out of hand and came up with a good resolution.
NOTE: I reference the public Naked Pumpkin Run and the Naked Bicycle Race, both of which occured each year in this city. These are International events which have been well reported on the Internet if you want to see more.
7) I will say again: Men are responsible for their actions. Regardless of what the woman does, it is not appropriate to excuse the man for jumping on her.
Gregory May God's will be done.
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