It is also difficult to find a junk food so "corrupt" as cannot provide some nutrition.

What is the point of finding the truth through the most erroneous sources?

I'll be the first to agree that truth can be found in any Bible. It's really not the truth that is the problem, but the error.

Blessings,

Green Cochoa.

It can never be hidden completely unless you take out whole chapters or books such as Daniel and Revelation, but for those just learning, a few changes can make it difficult. Look at the struggle within the Adventist church on the issue of the GodHead/Trinity, and you see my point. For one who has the benefit of SOP and true text to compare versus deleted or changed text, its much easier to know the context or what was meant such as when Christ tells the Thief on the cross that he will be in heaven. But for new Christians or those struggling with truth, it can be a unnecessary burden to deal with. Better to start out with the truest text than one filled with deletions and changes, that is my personal view.

Amen...

True, but where do you find a Bible where that comma has been placed in the right spot? (With the exception of a Bible translated by a SDA scholar - and the one by the Watchtower). Then we should disregard all Bibles, treating them as "junk food"?

Again Green, you should only read the Hebrew and Greek.

Kland,

If you were able to read the Hebrew and Greek you might realize where the real issue lies here. It starts with the Hebrew and Greek alright, but reading them might still land you with a corrupt version. You see, the corruptions were made in the Hebrew and Greek before they were translated to our modern versions in English.

Again, reading a particular language does not solve the problem. I can read the Bible in Korean or Chinese and still be reading from the corrupted manuscripts. In fact, I am not aware of a correct translation in Chinese. This might explain why we have so few Christians among the Chinese speakers, and why the majority of true, solid Christians in south-east Asia speak English.

I've probably shared before how an Asian with broken English understood the KJV better than the Bible in her own language. That was because the translation is so poor in her language. Our church desperately needs to train people for the ministry of translation. We desperately need new and improved translations, even of the Bible, in many languages.

Blessings,

Green Cochoa.

Thats why we must use the power of discernment through the Holy Spirit which God gives his children.

The struggle to keep the corrupted text out was a constant one, but the Christian believers strived hard when it came to this matter. Jerome was a true believer and when he wrote the Vulgate tried to use only the original Hebrew text (or Masoretic Text) or Greek text from the Textus Receptus (Majority Text) but the Roman church leaders forced the Apocrypha and some text from the Septuagint which was really from the Alexandrian codices which were in Greek, but its source was well hidden. Jerome spent the rest of his life exiled from Rome, defending his use of the true text and indirectly condeming the corrupted text or non Canon, the Apocrypha forced on him. So the Vulgate allowed some of the partial corruption of the Alexandrian codices and of course the non Canon of the Apocrypha, and you see how the Roman Catholic church used it to allow many false beliefs and doctrines including idol worship.

As Jerome completed his translations of each book of the Bible, he recorded his observations and comments in an extensive correspondence with other scholars; and these letters were subsequently collected and appended as prologues to the Vulgate text for those books where they survived. In these letters, Jerome described those books or portions of books in the Septuagint that were not found in the Hebrew as being non-canonical: he identified them as apocrypha which infuriated the Roman church leaders. Jerome's views did not, however, prevail; and all complete manuscripts and editions of the Vulgate include some or all these books which he clearly tried to keep out. He knew the true text from the corrupted ones, and fought to keep only the true text, it was important to him as it should be to us, and history shows us if we just take the time to uncover it.

Here is the line of the various versions which followed the reading of the Textus Receptus and you can see why the Waldensians were persecuted and their Bibles and manuscripts burned as they showed that the Roman church was not following the truth.

These versions include: The Pesh*tta Version (AD 150), The Italic Bible (AD 157), The Waldensian (AD 120 & onwards), The Gallic Bible (Southern France) (AD177), The Gothic Bible (AD 330-350), The Old Syriac Bible (AD 400), The Armenian Bible (AD 400 There are 1244 copies of this version still in existence.), The Palestinian Syriac (AD 450), The French Bible of Oliveton (AD 1535), The Czech Bible (AD 1602), The Italian Bible of Diodati (AD 1606), The Greek Orthodox Bible (Used from Apostolic times to the present day by the Greek Orthodox Church). [Bible Versions, D.B. Loughran]
http://home.sprynet.com/~eagreen/kjv-3.htm

THE OLD TESTAMENT

The Masoretic Text

1524-25 Bomberg Edition of the Masoretic Text also known as the Ben Chayyim Text

THE NEW TESTAMENT

All dates are Anno Domini (A.D.)

30-95------------Original Autographs
95-150----------Greek Vulgate (Copy of Originals)
120---------------The Waldensian Bible
150---------------The Pesh*tta (Syrian Copy)
150-400--------Papyrus Readings of the Receptus
157--------------The Italic Bible - From the Old Latin Vulgate used in Northern Italy
157--------------The Old Latin Vulgate
177--------------The Gallic Bible
310--------------The Gothic Version of Ulfilas
350-400-------The Textus Receptus is Dominant Text
400--------------Augustine favors Textus Receptus
400--------------The Armenian Bible (Translated by Mesrob)
400--------------The Old Syriac
450--------------The Palestinian Syriac Version
450-1450------Byzantine Text Dominant (Textus Receptus)
508--------------Philoxenian - by Chorepiscopos Polycarp, who commissioned by Philoxenos of Mabbug
500-1500------Uncial Readings of Receptus (Codices)
616--------------Harclean Syriac (Translated by Thomas of Harqel - Revision of 508 Philoxenian)
864--------------Slavonic
1100-1300----The Latin Bible of the Waldensians (History goes back as far as the 2nd century as people of the Vaudoix Valley)
1160------------The Romaunt Version (Waldensian)
1300-1500----The Latin Bible of the Albigenses
1382-1550----The Latin Bible of the Lollards
1384------------The Wycliffe Bible
1516------------Erasmus's First Edition Greek New Testament
1522------------Erasmus's Third Edition Published
1522-1534----Martin Luther's German Bible (1)
1525------------Tyndale Version
1534------------Tyndale's Amended Version
1534------------Colinaeus' Receptus
1535------------Coverdale Version
1535------------Lefevre's French Bible
1537------------Olivetan's French Bible
1537------------Matthew's Bible (John Rogers Printer)
1539------------The Great Bible
1541------------Swedish Upsala Bible by Laurentius
1550------------Stephanus Receptus (St. Stephen's Text)
1550------------Danish Christian III Bible
1558------------Biestken's Dutch Work
1560------------The Geneva Bible
1565------------Theodore Beza's Receptus
1568------------The Bishop's Bible
1569------------Spanish Translation by Cassiodoro de Reyna
1598------------Theodore Beza's Text
1602------------Czech Version
1607------------Diodati Italian Version
1611------------The King James Bible with Apocrypha between Old and New Testament
1613------------The King James Bible (Apocrypha Removed) (2)


The Vaudois (Waldenses) the Albigenses, the Reformers (Luther, Calvin and Knox) all held to the Received Text as the Textus Receptus was called. It was a struggle but Gods Word was protected through all those years, and those Christians knew the critical importance of sticking to the true text, and it still applies today.

Here are a few things I came across on the Waldensians....

John Wesley has this to say about the Vaudois or Waldenses: "It is a vulgar mistake, that the Waldenses were so called from Peter Waldo of Lyons. They were much more ancient than him; and their true name was Vallenses or Vaudois from their inhabiting the valleys of Lucerne and Agrogne. This name, Vallenses, after Waldo appeared about the year 1160, was changed by the Papists into Waldenses, on purpose to represent them as of modern original." (Notes on the Revelation of John, Revelation, Chapter 13, Verse 6, p. 936.)

Here is an important fact cited by Jonathan Edwards: "Some of the popish writers themselves own, that this people never submitted to the church of Rome. One of the popish writers, speaking of the Waldenses, says, The heresy of the Waldenses is the oldest heresy in the world. It is supposed that they first betook themselves to this place among the mountains, to hide themselves from the severity of the heathen persecutions which existed before Constantine the Great [272-337 AD]. And thus the woman fled into the wilderness from the face of the serpent" (The Works of Jonathan Edwards Vol. 4, Work of Redemption., Period 3 - From Christ's Resurrection to the End Of the World, Part 4, p. 229.)

Here is some history..."There is abundant evidence that the history of the Waldenses dates back to the time of the apostles. It is their claim that their religion passed to them from the apostles and in fact even the writings of their enemies give credence to this. (Note that the Waldenses were called by several different names: Leonists, Vallenses, Valsenses, Vaudois and others.)

Reinerius Sasso was a well informed Inquisitor of the thirteenth century. He had once been a pastor among the Waldenses but had apostatized and become their persecutor. The book The History of the Ancient Vallenses and Albigenses by George Faber gives a translation of this testimony on page 272. His testimony described the Leonists (Waldenses) as being the most ‘pernicious’ of the sects of heretics for three reasons. The first reason was because of their longer continuance, for they had lasted from the time of Pope Sylvester or even from the Apostles. Secondly, because there was scarcely a land where they did not exist. And the third reason being because they lived justly before all men and blasphemed only against the Roman church and clergy while maintaining every point concerning the Deity and the articles of faith which made their doctrine appeal to the populous. He also writes that they were simple, modest people who instructed their children first in the Decalogue of the law, the Ten Commandments. (See Truth Triumphant, 254.)

Faber also shares the testimony of Pilichdorf, also of the thirteenth century, who writes that the Valdenses claimed to have existed from the time of Pope Sylvester. Claude Scyssel, the Archbishop of Turin, who lived in the neighborhood of the Waldenses in the fifteenth and sixteenth centuries tells us that the Valdenses of Piedmont were followers of a person named Leo. In the time of Emperor Constantine, Leo, on account of the avarice of Pope Sylvester and the excesses of the Roman Church, seceded from that communion, and drew after him all those who entertained right sentiments concerning the Christian Religion. (See The History of the Ancient Vallenses and Albigenses, 276.).."


James A. Wylie (1808-1890) describes the "apostolicity of the Churches of the Waldensian valleys" with the observation that "Rome manifestly was the schismatic," while the Vaudois or Waldenses deserved the "valid title of the True Church," and even the Waldenses' "greatest enemies, Claude Seyssel of Turin (1517), and Reynerius the Inquisitor (1250), have admitted their antiquity, and stigmatized them as 'the most dangerous of all heretics, because the most ancient'" (excerpted from "The History of Protestantism" Volume 1, Book 1, Chapter 6 "The Waldenses - Their Valleys" ---New Window [1878] by James A. Wylie). Since the Byzantine Manuscripts commonly accessible to Desiderius Erasmus (1466-1536) were used in his production of the Greek New Testament, which formed the Textus Receptus (1516, 1519, 1522, 1527, 1535), their use demonstrated a continuity with the Vaudois. The Vaudois Christians had likewise used and preserved the ancient Byzantine manuscripts of Antioch in the form of Latin Scripture; and, their survival.. from the time of the Early Church until the sola scriptura ("Scripture alone") of the Protestant Reformation (1521) is testament that the True Church and the True Word of God did continuously testify against the False Church and False Scriptures ..of Rome.

...The Vaudois rendezvous with the Protestant Reformation represents a Divine Approval of the Reformation, in that the Ancient Christian Church of the Vaudois attested to the Truth of the Reformers, and specifically to the validity of the Scriptures of the Reformers, which were used to translate the Textus Receptus Bibles of the Reformation, i.e., the Spanish Reina-Valera (1569), the Italian Diodati (1603), the Coverdale Bible (1535), the Tyndale New Testament (1536), the Great Bible (1539), the Bishops Bible (1568), the Geneva Bible (1560-1599), and, of course, the King James Bible (1611). "For by wise counsel thou shalt make thy war: and in multitude of counsellors there is safety" (Proverbs 24:6). Significantly, men of God, such as John Wesley (1703-1791) and Jonathan Edwards (1703-1758), have attested to the accuracy of understanding that the Vaudois Christians were not merely a more recent vintage of Protestant reaction to the Church of Rome, coming upon the scene through Peter Waldo in twelfth century France (1171 AD), but that the Vaudois were ancient Christians, who preserved their Christianity along with the Scriptures-- separate from the Church of Rome-- as far back as the early second century AD.

So there really are only 2 streams of Bible versions, those which used the true text of the Textus Receptus (Majority Text) or those which picked up the Alexandrian manuscripts (Minority Text).So the Vulgate allowed some of the partial corruption of the Alexandrian codices and of course the non Canon of the Apocrypha, and you see how the Roman Catholic church persecuted those who had the true text and burned their writings and manuscritps, and for good reason as it showed their corrupted codices and manuscripts they were using. So if it says Textus Receptus (Majority Text) it is true to the many manuscripts that Christians used over the centuries, if it has Vulgate, Septuagint, Wescott and Hort (or its many variants such as Nestle-Aland text, editions of Tischendorf, critical editions of the Greek text, etc..), then it uses the Minority Text or allows partial text from it, which comes from the corrupted Alexandrian manuscripts.

Complete Bibles.....................
Bible -English variant -Date -Source

American Standard Version -Modern English 1901 Masoretic Text, Westcott and Hort 1881 and Tregelles 1857

American King James Version -Modern English 1999 Revision of the King James Version

Amplified Bible -Modern English 1965 Revision of the American Standard Version
An American Translation -Modern English 1935 Masoretic Text, various Greek texts.

ArtScroll Tanakh (Old Testament)-Modern English 1996 Masoretic Text

An American Translation -Modern English 1976 Masoretic Text, various[which?] Greek texts.

Berkeley Version -Modern English 1958

Bible in English -Modern English 1949

The Bible in Living English -Modern English 1972

Bishops' Bible -Early Modern English 1568 Masoretic Text, Textus Receptus

Catholic Public Domain Version -Modern English 2009 Sixtus V and Clement VIII Latin Vulgate by Ronald L. Conte Jr., in the public domain

Children's King James Version -Modern English 1962 Revision of the King James Version. by Jay P. Green

Christian Community Bible, English version -Modern English 1986 Hebrew and Greek

Clear Word Bible -Modern English 1994

Complete Jewish Bible -Modern English 1998 Paraphrase of the Jewish Publication Society of America Version (Old Testament), and from the original Greek (New Testament).

Contemporary English Version -Modern English 1995

Concordant Literal Version -Modern English Restored Greek syntax. A concordance of every form of every Greek word was made and systematized and turned into English. The whole Greek vocabulary was analyzed and translated, using a standard English equivalent for each Greek element.

A Conservative Version =Modern English 2005

Coverdale Bible -Early Modern English 1535 Masoretic Text, the Greek New Testament of Erasmus, Vulgate, and German and Swiss-German Bibles (Luther Bible, Zürich Bible and Leo Jud's Bible) First complete Bible printed in English (Early Modern English)

Darby Bible -Modern English 1890 Masoretic Text, various critical editions of the Greek text (i.a. Tregelles, Tischendorf, Westcott and Hort)

Douay-Rheims Bible -Early Modern English 1582 (New Testament)1609–1610 (Old Testament) Latin, Greek and Hebrew manuscripts Old Testament completed in 1582, released in two parts in 1609 and 1610

Douay-Rheims Bible (Challoner Revision) -Modern English 1752 Clementine Vulgate

EasyEnglish Bible-Modern English 2001 Wycliffe Associates (UK)

Easy-to-Read Version -Modern English 1989 Textus Receptus, United Bible Society (UBS) Greek text, Nestle-Aland Text

Emphasized Bible -Modern English 1902 Translated by Joseph Bryant Rotherham based on The New Testament in the Original Greek and Christian David Ginsburg's Massoretico-critical edition of the Hebrew Bible (1894) Uses various methods, such as "emphatic idiom" and special diacritical marks, to bring out nuances of the underlying Greek, Hebrew, and Aramaic texts.

English Jubilee 2000 Bible -Modern English 2000 Reina-Valera (1602 Edition)

English Standard Version -Modern English 2001 Revision of the Revised Standard Version. (Westcott-Hort, Weiss, Tischendorf Greek texts)

Ferrar Fenton Bible -Modern English 1853 Masoretic Text and the Westcott and Hort Greek text

Geneva Bible -Early Modern English 1557 (New Testament)
1560 (complete Bible) Masoretic Text, Textus Receptus
First English Bible with whole of Old Testament translated direct from Hebrew texts

God's Word -Modern English 1995

Good News Bible -Modern English 1976 United Bible Society (UBS) Greek text Formerly known as Today's English Version

Great Bible -Early Modern English 1539 Masoretic Text, Greek New Testament of Erasmus, the Vulgate, and the Luther Bible.

Holman Christian Standard Bible -Modern English 2004 Masoretic Text, Nestle-Aland Text.

The Inclusive Bible -Modern English 2007 From the original Hebrew, Aramaic, and Greek

International Standard Version -Modern English 2011

Jerusalem Bible -Modern English 1966 From the original Hebrew, Aramaic, and Greek, with influence from the French La Bible de Jérusalem.

Jesus' Disciples Bible -Early Modern English 2012 Masoretic Text, Textus Receptus, Tyndale 1526 NT, some Erasmus manuscripts, and Bezae 1598 TR.

Jewish Publication Society of America Version Tanakh (Old Testament)-Modern English 1917 Masoretic Text

Judaica Press Tanakh (Old Testament).-Modern English 1963 Masoretic Text

Julia E. Smith Parker Translation -Modern English 1876 Masoretic Text, Textus Receptus

King James 2000 Version -Modern English 2000 Revision of the King James Version.

King James Easy Reading Version =Modern English 2010 Revision of the King James Version. The Received Text. King's Word Press. GEM Publishing.[3]

King James Version -Early Modern English 1611 Masoretic Text, Textus Receptus, Tyndale 1526 NT, some Erasmus manuscripts, and Bezae 1598 TR.

King James II Version -Modern English 1971 Masoretic Text, Textus Receptus by Jay P. Green, Sr.

Knox's Translation of the Vulgate -Modern English 1955 Vulgate, with influence from the original Hebrew, Aramaic, and Greek.

Lamsa Bible -Modern English 1933 Syriac Peshitta

A Literal Translation of the Bible =Modern English 1985 Masoretic Text, Textus Receptus (Estienne 1550) by Jay P. Green, Sr.

Leeser Bible, Tanakh (Old Testament)-Modern English 1994 Masoretic Text

The Living Bible -Modern English 1971 American Standard Version (paraphrase)

The Living Torah and The Living Nach. Tanakh (Old Testament)-Modern English 1994 Masoretic Text

Matthew's Bible -Early Modern English 1537 Masoretic Text, the Greek New Testament of Erasmus, the Vulgate, the Luther Bible, and a French version[which?].

The Message =Modern English 2002

Modern King James Version -Modern English 1990 Masoretic Text, Textus Receptus by Jay P. Green, Sr.

Modern Language Bible =Modern English 1969 Also called "The New Berkeley Version"

Moffatt, New Translation =Modern English 1926

James Murdock's Translation of the Syriac Peshitta=Modern English Syriac Peshitta

New American Bible=Modern English 1970

New American Standard Bible =Modern English 1971 Masoretic Text, Nestle-Aland Text

New Century Version =Modern English 1991

New English Bible -Modern English 1970 Masoretic Text, Greek New Testament

New English Translation (NET Bible)-Modern English 2005 Masoretic Text, Nestle-Aland/United Bible Society Greek New Testament

New International Reader's Version -Modern English 1998 New International Version (simplified syntax, but loss of conjunctions obscures meanings)

New International Version Inclusive Language Edition
-Modern English 1996 Revision of the New International Version.

New International Version -Modern English 1978 Masoretic Text, Nestle-Aland Greek New Testament (based on Westcott-Hort, Weiss and Tischendorf, 1862).

New Jerusalem Bible -Modern English 1985 From the original Hebrew, Aramaic, and Greek, with influence from the French La Bible de Jérusalem.

New Jewish Publication Society of America Version. Tanakh (Old Testament)-Modern English 1985 Masoretic Text

New King James Version -Modern English 1982 Masoretic Text (Biblia Hebraica Stuttgartensia, 1983), Majority text (Hodges-Farstad, 1982)

New Life Version -Modern English 1986

New Living Translation -Modern English 1996

New Revised Standard Version-Modern English 1989 Revision of the Revised Standard Version.

New World Translation of the Holy Scriptures- Modern English 1950 (New Testament)
1960 (single volume complete Bible)
1984 (reference edition with footnotes) Westcott and Hort's Greek New Testament, Nestle-Aland Greek New Testament, Hebrew J documents, as well as various other families of Hebrew and Greek manuscripts

The Orthodox Study Bible -Modern English 2008 Adds a new translation of the LXX Septuagint to an existing translation of the NKJV in a single volume.

Quaker Bible -Modern English 1764 Masoretic Text, Textus Receptus

Recovery Version of the Bible-Modern English 1985 Revision of the American Standard Version and Darby Bible.

Revised Version -Modern English 1885 Revision of the King James Version, but with a critical New Testament text: Westcott and Hort 1881 and Tregelles 1857

Revised Standard Version =Modern English 1952 Masoretic Text, Nestle-Aland Greek New Testament.

Revised Standard Version Catholic Edition=Modern English 1966 Revision of the Revised Standard Version.

Revised English Bible -Modern English 1987 Revision of the New English Bible.

The Scriptures -Modern English & Hebrew (Divine Names) 1993, revised 1998 & revised 2009 Masoretic Text (Biblia Hebraica), Textus Receptus Greek text Popular Messianic Translation by the Institute for Scripture Research
Simplified English Bible
Modern English.

The Story Bible=Modern English 1971 A summary/paraphrase, by Pearl S. Buck

Taverner's Bible=Early Modern English 1539 Minor revision of Matthew's Bible

Thomson's Translation-Modern English 1808 Codex Vaticanus (according to the introduction in the reprint edition by S. F. Pells) of the Septuagint (but excluding the Apocrypha) and of the New Testament

Today's New International Version =Modern English 2005 Masoretic Text (Biblia Hebraica Stuttgartensia, 1983), Nestle-Aland Greek text Revision of the New International Version.

Third Millennium Bible =Modern English 1998 Revision of the King James Version.

Tyndale Bible Early -Modern English 1526 (New Testament)
1530 (Pentateuch) Masoretic Text, Erasmus' third NT edition (1522), Martin Luther's 1522 German Bible.Incomplete translation. Tyndale's other Old Testament work went into the Matthew's Bible (1537).

Updated King James Version -Modern English 2004

A Voice In The Wilderness Holy Scriptures -Modern English 2003 Masoretic Text, Textus Receptus

Webster's Revision -Modern English 1833 Revision of the King James Version.

Westminster Bible -Modern English 1936 Greek and Hebrew

The Work of God's Children Illustrated Bible[4]-Modern English 2010 Revision of the Challoner Revision of the Douay-Rheims Bible.

Wycliffe's Bible (1380) -Middle English 1380 Latin Vulgate

Wycliffe's Bible (1388) -Middle English 1388 Latin Vulgate

Young's Literal Translation=Modern English 1862 Masoretic Text, Textus Receptus

A recurring theme of Jerome's writing in the Old Testament prologues is Jerome's preference for the Hebraica veritas (i.e., Hebrew truth) to the Septuagint, a preference which he defended from his detractors. He stated that the Hebrew text more clearly prefigures Christ than the Greek of the Septuagint. The Latin Biblical texts in use before the Latin Vulgate of Jerome are usually referred to collectively as the Vetus Latina, or "Old Latin Bible", or occasionally the "Old Latin Vulgate". (Here "Old Latin" means that they are older than the Vulgate and written in Latin, not that they are written in Old Latin.) The translations in the Vetus Latina had accumulated piecemeal over a century or more in a haphazard manner; they were not translated by a single person or institution, nor uniformly edited so there was no standard as in the original Hebrew and Greek text of the Masoretic Text, and Textus Receptus. The individual books of that Vetus Latina varied in quality of translation and style, and different manuscripts witnessed wide variations in readings or did not agree with each other. Jerome, in his preface to the Vulgate gospels, commented that there were "as many [translations] as there are manuscripts". The reason can be found in that the Old Testament books of the Vetus Latina were translated from the Greek Septuagint which came from the Alexandrian codices, not from the Hebrew text of the Masoretic Text, and Textus Receptus.

Jerome's earliest efforts in translation, his revision of the four Gospels, was written under official sanction, but his version had little or no official recognition. Jerome's translated texts had to make their way on their own merits. The Old Latin versions or Vetus Latina continued to be copied and used alongside the Vulgate versions. Nevertheless, the superior quality of Jerome’s translation from the original Hebrew of the Vulgate texts led to their increasingly superseding the Old Latin/Vetus Latina; although the loss of familiar phrases and expressions aroused hostility in congregations; and, especially in North Africa and Spain where the Alexandrian text had spread and been picked up in the Old Latin/Vetus Latina. Jerome knew which text was corrupt because he had access to and had seen the true text in Hebrew and the corresponding Greek translation as he had spent years in Jerusalem.

So it really is not that hard to find which are the ones with the true text of the the Textus Receptus (Majority Text) if one just digs a little and opens their eyes and ears.