Daryl,

You may not have been deeply involved in the discussion that took place mostly between Mountain Man and Tom a few years ago, but APL represents a reincarnation of Tom's philosophies. The idea is that God can do no harm. He withdraws His protection, and all the evils happen--from a non-God source.

Unfortunately, this "world view" is fraught with errors. It is built upon castles of sand, as it were, for it begins by improper definitions. The following terms must all be interpreted improperly for this theory to gain solid acceptance:

arbitrary
evil
good
hate
judgment
justice
love
punishment
righteousness
sin
suffering
vengeance

Once all of these concepts presented above, or even a substantial quantity of them, are re-aligned from their correct perspectives and meanings, it is a simple matter to see Satan's point of view that God is not fair, not just, and not loving if He were to ever judge righteously in executing judgment. All judgment or punishment, if it comes from God directly, is looked upon as "arbitrary," just as Satan himself would like people to see it.

The people who accept this ideology then turn the facts on their face and point to those who still believe the truth as "misrepresenting the character of God." In actual fact, the reverse is true.

I believe this worldview is part of Satan's multi-fold attack upon the theology of the church and its understanding of God's truths for these last days. While other parts of Satan's multi-frontal attack are aimed at undermining or destroying beliefs in creation (evolution), Gospel order (women's ordination), God's law (modern Bible versions), true worship (spiritual formations, contemporary music, etc.), and so on, this doctrine of "God will not punish with death" comes in direct contradiction to the first thrust of the third (3rd) angel's message given in Revelation 14.

Satan knows time is short. He understands the prophecies. He knows it's almost time for that message to be proclaimed with power. This is his attempt to weaken it before it starts.

This belief that God would never hurt anybody, let alone kill anyone, has a certain attractiveness. It is appealing to the mind to think that God will always have mercy. It's almost a "second-chance" concept--because it encourages the sinner to think that no matter how much he or she sins, God will never bring those sins to judgment, but will have abundant grace to pardon. This, then, reduces the willpower to wrestle against sin, for it lessens the gravity of it.

Blessings,

Green Cochoa.

The very attributes that belonged to the character of Satan, the evil one represented as belonging to the character of God. Jesus came to teach men of the Father, to correctly represent him before the fallen children of earth.{ST, January 20, 1890 par. 6}

.....that will by no means clear the guilty; visiting the iniquity of the fathers on the children, and on the children's children, to the third and to the fourth generation.

Green again misrepresents the truth. "God will always have mercy". This is such a gross misrepresentation of the the truth and it is not my stance at all. Green knows this if he has read what I have posted here. I hope it is just forgetfulness on his part, otherwise it is a blatant misrepresentation.

What about this part?

Webster 1828 dictionary:
Arbitrary
ARBITRARY, a. [L. arbitrarious.]

1. Depending on will or discretion; not governed by any fixed rules; as, an arbitrary decision; an arbitrary punishment.

Arbitrary power is most easily established on the ruins of liberty abused to licentiousness.

2. Despotic; absolute in power; having no external control; as, an arbitrary prince or government.

Webster 2010
1. subject to individual will or judgment without restriction; contingent solely upon one's discretion: an arbitrary decision.
2. decided by a judge or arbiter rather than by a law or statute.
3. having unlimited power; uncontrolled or unrestricted by law; despotic: an arbitrary government.
4. capricious; unreasonable; unsupported: an arbitrary demand for payment.
5. Math. undetermined; not assigned a specific value: an arbitrary constant.

Their sufferings are often represented as a punishment visited upon them by the direct decree of God. It is thus that the great deceiver seeks to conceal his own work.

Satan rushes into the midst of his followers and tries to stir up the multitude to action. But fire from God out of heaven is rained upon them, and the great men, and mighty men, the noble, the poor and miserable, are all consumed together. I saw that some were quickly destroyed, while others suffered longer. They were punished according to the deeds done in the body. Some were many days consuming, and just as long as there was a portion of them unconsumed, all the sense of suffering remained. Said the angel, "The worm of life shall not die; their fire shall not be quenched as long as there is the least particle for it to prey upon." {EW 294.1}
Satan and his angels suffered long. Satan bore not only the weight and punishment of his own sins, but also of the sins of the redeemed host, which had been placed upon him; and he must also suffer for the ruin of souls which he had caused. Then I saw that Satan and all the wicked host were consumed, and the justice of God was satisfied; and all the angelic host, and all the redeemed saints, with a loud voice said, "Amen!" {EW 294.2}

The post below by Green Cochoa that was posted on page 1 of this thread contains Bible references and quotes that clearly tells me that God does punish, which at times he does directly Himself and which at other times He impresses others to do the actual punishing.

In the case of the end of the 1,000 years in which He resurrect those who rejected Him from their graves, etc., He will directly punish them by raining down fire from the sky upon them that will utterly consume them, leaving neither root nor branch in reference to the fact that there isn't any return to life from that 2nd death experience.