Pardon me for saying this, green, but the advise you are giving others is just what you do not do yourself, as far as I can see.

When God separates Himself from the wicked, they will experience not only the penalty or the wages for sin, but the ultimate judgment of eternal death.

only? What is God's wrath in Romans 1? Translate that to after the close of probation. WHO causes all the calamities after the close? God? Is that what you are saying? No, it is Satan. God's wrath is the same as Romans 1. The angels of Revelation 7 have power to hurt the earth. How do they hurt the earth? Exactly the same way as Romans 1.

The SDABC states it quite clearly. Here is the entry for Romans 1:18

For. Here the main argument of the epistle begins. Paul first seek to show that all men, Gentiles and Jews alike, need the righteousness that is revealed in the gospel. For all men are sinners and therefore exposed to the wrath of God, whether Gentiles (Romans 1:13-32) or Jews (Romans 2:1-29; Romans 3:1-20).

The wrath of God. That is, the divine displeasure against sin, resulting ultimately in the abandonment of man to the judgment of death (see Romans 6:23; John 3:36). The wrath of the infinite God must not be compared to human passion. God is love (1 John 4:8), and though He hates sin, He loves the sinner (SC-54). However, God does not force His love upon those who are unwilling to receive His mercy (see DA-22; DA-466; DA-759). Thus, God’s wrath against sin is exercised in the withdrawal of His presence and life-giving power from those who choose to remain in sin and thus share in its inevitable consequences (see Genesis 6:3; cf. DA-107; DA-763; DA-764; SC-17; SC-18).

This is illustrated by the terrible experience of the Jews after their rejection of Christ. Since they had become confirmed in their stubborn impenitence and had refused the last offers of mercy, “God withdrew His protection from them and removed His restraining power from Satan and his angels, and the nation was left to the control of the leader she had chosen” (GC-28).

When God’s wrath against sin fell upon Christ as our substitute, it was the separation from His Father that caused Him such great anguish. “This agony He must not exert His divine power to escape. As man He must suffer the consequence of man’s sin. As man He must endure the wrath of God against transgression” (DA-686). Finally, on the cross, “the wrath of God against sin, the terrible manifestation of His displeasure because of iniquity, filled the soul of His Son with consternation. … The withdrawal of the divine countenance from the Saviour in this hour of supreme anguish pierced His heart with a sorrow that can never be fully understood by man” (DA-753).

Thus, as Paul explains in Romans 1:24; Romans 1:26; Romans 1:28, God reveals His wrath by turning impenitent men over to the inevitable results of their rebellion. This persistent resistance of God’s love and mercy culminates in the final revelation of God’s wrath on that day when the Spirit of God is at last withdrawn. Unsheltered by divine grace, the wicked have no protection from the evil one. “As the angels of God cease to hold in check the fierce winds of human passion, all the elements of strife will be let loose” (GC-614). Then fire comes down from God out of heaven, and sin and sinners are forever destroyed (Revelation 20:9; cf. Malachi 4:1; 2 Peter 3:10).

But even this final revelation of God’s wrath in the destruction of the wicked is not an act of arbitrary power. “God is the fountain of life; and when one chooses the service of sin, he separates from God, and thus cuts himself off from life” (DA-764). God gives men existence for a time so that they may develop their characters. When this has been accomplished, they receive the results of their own choice. “By a life of rebellion, Satan and all who unite with him place themselves so out of harmony with God that His very presence is to them a consuming fire” (ibid.; cf. GC-543).

Revealed. Or, “is being revealed” (see Romans 1:17). The full manifestation of the wrath of God will be seen at the end of the world (Romans 2:5; 1 Thessalonians 1:10; 2 Thessalonians 1:7-9; Revelation 6:16-17). But God’s displeasure against sin is also being revealed in the condition of mankind. The debasing vices and deliberate wickedness to which the sinner is given over (Romans 1:24-32), prove God’s condemnation and punishment of sin. Paul’s preaching of the righteousness of God revealed in the gospel (Romans 1:17) also serves to reveal the wrath of God more clearly than ever before.

From heaven. The revelation of divine wrath comes as a message of warning from God’s throne.

Ungodliness. Gr. asebeia, “lack of reverence for God,” “irreligion” (see Romans 1:21).

Unrighteousness. Gr. adikia, “lack of right conduct,” “injustice” (see Romans 1:29).

Hold. Gr. katechō, “to possess,” “to hold fast,” “to hold back,” “to hinder,” “to suppress.” The context here shows that the meaning “hold back” is to be preferred. Compare similar uses of the word in Luke 4:42; 2 Thessalonians 2:6-7.

The truth. This refers particularly to knowledge concerning God (see Romans 1:19; Romans 1:25; see on John 8:32).

In unrighteousness. In and by their wickedness men were holding back and suppressing the truth about God. In their determination to practice iniquity men were unwilling to retain the knowledge of a pure and holy God who they knew was opposed to such deeds and would punish them. By so doing they were not only suppressing the truth in their own hearts but also concealing the truth from others.

APL,

Except for volume 7A, which contains Mrs. White's own comments, I have no special regard for the SDABC. I think we have discussed this before. If you wish to address my views, there's not point in pushing upon me something that I do not accept.

For example, they say...



They are wrong, as I see it. God loves them whether they want Him to love them or not. Or, are you saying that God does not love people if they don't want Him to? In either case, I am sure, even after reviewing those pages from the Desire of Ages that Mrs. White does not teach this concept. Her concept is similar, but sufficiently distinct as to be altogether different.

Let's stick with inspiration.

Blessings,

Green Cochoa.

I bring up the SDABC because it shows that what I am saying is not unique to me. This entry definitely goes against your view.

Now - take you comment and see how misconstrued it is. The commentary states that "God does not force His love upon those who are unwilling to receive His mercy". You then totally twist this to say that this comment that God's love is conditional. What? God loves everyone, unconditionally. But God does not force Himself on anyone. The commentary is absolutely correct, and your comment is in reply is wide off the mark. You obviously did not read the EGW quotes used in support of the commentary, for if you had, you would have read: How about that! God does not force His love on anyone. No compulsion, no external force is employed. This commentary entry is confirmed! Wow! Again the commentary's statement is confirmed!

If you read on, on the same page we find:Amazing! Christ was suffering under the weight of Sin, and the Father was not touching Him. The Father was not torturing Him. The Father was not executing Him. God's wrath, is His withdrawal, His letting God, His giving up, just as Romans 1 says it is.

Green - this is inspiration speaking. Harden not your heart.

APL,

You are not nearly as precise in your studies as what I personally would need to satisfy me. Perhaps this is why you are unable to persuade me.

For example, the following:



Where in the quote is love mentioned? You leverage that quote to address something that Mrs. White did not support there.

I further take issue with the fact that "God does not force His love on anyone" in the sense of hell. When God reveals His character fully, causing the death of the wicked, His love will most certainly be a part of that picture which they are forced to see.

Note the following passage from Mrs. White.



She says they were "forced to see that [Jesus] was the Son of God." Forced?

Blessings,

Green Cochoa.

[quote=green]Where in the quote is love mentioned? You leverage that quote to address something that Mrs. White did not support there.[quote]The plan of redemption is not love? You really are unbelieveable.

Seeing does not equal receiving, and they were still blind! The people were not compelled to accept him.

I think if we look at the story of Pharoah and the plagues its plain to see how God works.

Could you give something a little more challenging?

Here's one:
http://www.maritime-sda-online.com/forum...true#Post155442
Be sure to read the following posts and note the lack of response from Green and then the


Well, you've been asked to give the distinction between the two, but you have not. Why not?

Can you? Are you able to give a distinction between killing and murder so that even an 8th grader can look at and review a situation and be able to determine the difference?

GREEN - is black and white.


See! Green is black and white. EGW sayd, in the work of redemption, there is no compulsion. This confirming a quote I provided earily showing that God will not force His love on any one. To wit, Green says, where is love mentioned?

Redemption is the work of God, for God so LOVED the world... If the word love was in my EGW quote, that would be very white for Green. Since the word love is not in the quote, then love can't possibly be in implied. The word love is not in the quote, so it is black. Green - you are the one that sees only black or white.