HOME CHAT ROOM #1 CHAT ROOM #2 Forum Topics Within The Last 7 Days REGISTER ENTER FORUMS BIBLE SCHOOL CONTACT US

Maritime 2nd Advent Believers OnLine Christian Family Fellowship Forums
(formerly Maritime SDA OnLine)
Consisting mainly of both members and friends of the Seventh-day Adventist Church
Welcomes and invites other members and friends of the Seventh-day Adventist Church to join us!

Click Here To Read Legal Notice & Disclaimer
Suggested a One Time Yearly $20 or Higher Donation Accepted Here to Help Cover the Yearly Expenses of Operating & Upgrading. We need at least $20 X 10 yearly donations.
Donations accepted: Here
ShoutChat Box
Newest Members
Andrew, Trainor, ekoorb1030, jibb555, MBloomfield
1325 Registered Users
Forum Statistics
Forums118
Topics9,232
Posts196,214
Members1,325
Most Online5,850
Feb 29th, 2020
Seventh-day Adventist Church In Canada Links
Seventh-day Adventist Church in Canada

Newfoundland & Labrador Mission

Maritime Conference

Quebec Conference

Ontario Conference

Manitoba-Saskatchewan Conference

Alberta Conference

British Columbia Conference

7 Top Posters(30 Days)
asygo 29
Rick H 26
kland 16
November
S M T W T F S
1 2
3 4 5 6 7 8 9
10 11 12 13 14 15 16
17 18 19 20 21 22 23
24 25 26 27 28 29 30
Member Spotlight
Rick H
Rick H
Florida, USA
Posts: 3,245
Joined: January 2008
Show All Member Profiles 
Today's Birthdays
No Birthdays
Live Space Station Tracking
Here is a link to show exactly where the Space Station is over earth right now: Click Here
Last 7 Pictures From Photo Gallery Forums
He hath set an harvest for thee
Rivers Of Living Water
He Leads Us To Green Pastures
Remember What God Has Done
Remember The Sabbath
"...whiter than snow..."
A Beautiful Spring Day
Who's Online
9 registered members (dedication, daylily, TheophilusOne, Daryl, Karen Y, 4 invisible), 2,495 guests, and 6 spiders.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Rate Thread
Page 27 of 104 1 2 25 26 27 28 29 103 104
Re: Does God Punish? (Part 2) [Re: Johann] #156198
09/16/13 04:43 AM
09/16/13 04:43 AM
asygo  Offline
SDA
Active Member 2023

5500+ Member
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 5,636
California, USA
Originally Posted By: Johann
Originally Posted By: asygo
Originally Posted By: Johann
According to the laws of the nature God has created there is no life without a connection with the Life Giver.

This is so because God set things up this way. If He wanted to, almighty God is able to perpetuate the sinner's life forever, right?

And just to be clear, it is God who made it this way, not Satan, right?


Are you trying to give God the responsibility?

I'm not "trying" to do anything. I just want the truth. Is God responsible for the law of nature that there is no life apart from the Life Giver? Or is someone else responsible for making things work that way?

Are we still in agreement that God is almighty? That if He wanted to keep someone alive indefinitely, including Satan, He has the power to do it?

Last edited by asygo; 09/16/13 04:48 AM.

By God's grace,
Arnold

1 John 5:11-13
And this is the testimony, that God gave us eternal life, and this life is in his Son. Whoever has the Son has life; whoever does not have the Son of God does not have life. I write these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God, that you may know that you have eternal life.
Re: Does God Punish? (Part 2) [Re: Johann] #156199
09/16/13 04:47 AM
09/16/13 04:47 AM
asygo  Offline
SDA
Active Member 2023

5500+ Member
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 5,636
California, USA
Originally Posted By: Johann
Who is fighting against what God has created? God Himself?

Who created the law of nature that separation from the Life Giver results in lack of life? Does God work with or against that law? Does Satan want to abide by that law or does he want to defy it?


By God's grace,
Arnold

1 John 5:11-13
And this is the testimony, that God gave us eternal life, and this life is in his Son. Whoever has the Son has life; whoever does not have the Son of God does not have life. I write these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God, that you may know that you have eternal life.
Re: Does God Punish? (Part 2) [Re: asygo] #156203
09/16/13 08:23 AM
09/16/13 08:23 AM
Johann  Offline
SDA
Active Member 2014

Retired Pastor
3000+ Member
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 3,014
Iceland
Arnold, there are questions connected with the nature of God which require an almighty insight to answer. Are some of your questions approaching this old adage:

If God is almighty could He create a stone which is so heavy that He cannot lift it Himself?

Scripture teaches us that what is revealed about the nature of God is good for us to examine, but what isn´t is none of our business. I have expressed this in my own words, but you understand the meaning.

So let us see what has been revealed - in the next post.


"Here is a last piece of advice. If you believe in goodness and if you value the approval of God, fix your minds on the things which are holy and right and pure and beautiful and good. Model your conduct on what you have learned from me, on what I have told you and shown you, and you will find the God of peace will be with you."
Re: Does God Punish? (Part 2) [Re: Johann] #156206
09/16/13 09:04 AM
09/16/13 09:04 AM
Johann  Offline
SDA
Active Member 2014

Retired Pastor
3000+ Member
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 3,014
Iceland
Originally Posted By: Johann

A current can be cut off at either end; by the provider or by the receiver. Scripture makes it clear that the current of life is cut off by the receiver - and here we are clearly speaking of life eternal which is the only life that really matters according to the Gospel.

According to the laws of the nature God has created there is no life without a connection with the Life Giver.

Satan wants you to think that eternal death is a punishment and he makes God an angry revenger.

Eternity will never happen until the whole universe understands that God is not an avenger but that the sinner has separated himself from life and therefore would be unhappy to live in the kingdom of Heaven.


But aren't there many texts in Scripture which describe God as an avenger? Yes, there are.

How do you explain these text?

Personally I believe there is no better commentary or dictionary than what is given by the Son of God and His disciples.

Quote:
Matthew 5:43-48.
5:43 Ye have heard that it hath been said, Thou shalt love thy neighbour, and hate thine enemy.
5:44 But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you;
5:45 That ye may be the children of your Father which is in heaven: for he maketh his sun to rise on the evil and on the good, and sendeth rain on the just and on the unjust.
5:46 For if ye love them which love you, what reward have ye? do not even the publicans the same?
5:47 And if ye salute your brethren only, what do ye more than others? do not even the publicans so?
5:48 Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.


Here in the sermon on the mount Jesus is telling us that if we want to approach being perfect like our Heavenly Father then we must read the inspired words of Scripture in the light of the Gospel. That does not mean that we can infuse our own meaning, but it must be in accordance with the message of Jesus Christ and His apostles.

If not, we are not on the way to perfection and must seek repentance, like you have said in your sermon, Arnold.

More later. . .


"Here is a last piece of advice. If you believe in goodness and if you value the approval of God, fix your minds on the things which are holy and right and pure and beautiful and good. Model your conduct on what you have learned from me, on what I have told you and shown you, and you will find the God of peace will be with you."
Re: Does God Punish? (Part 2) [Re: Johann] #156207
09/16/13 11:45 AM
09/16/13 11:45 AM
APL  Offline
SDA
Active Member 2020

5500+ Member
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 6,368
Western, USA
Originally Posted By: asygo
If He wanted to, almighty God is able to perpetuate the sinner's life forever, right?
Question - would keeping a sinner a life forever be a violation of God's law?


Oh, that men might open their minds to know God as he is revealed in his Son! {ST, January 20, 1890}
Re: Does God Punish? (Part 2) [Re: APL] #156209
09/16/13 12:32 PM
09/16/13 12:32 PM
APL  Offline
SDA
Active Member 2020

5500+ Member
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 6,368
Western, USA
Originally Posted By: asygo
If so, then He could have prevented Christ's death if He wanted to. But Jesus definitely died. So that means that God did not want to prevent Christ's death.
Originally Posted By: EGW
The sacrificial offerings were ordained by God to be to man a perpetual reminder and a penitential acknowledgment of his sin and a confession of his faith in the promised Redeemer. They were intended to impress upon the fallen race the solemn truth that it was sin that caused death. {PP 68.1}
Could God have prevented Christ's death? Yes, BUT - what would be the implications for sinners? They would have been lost. Satan's claims would have been sustained, the questions in the great controversy would have been true. Christ demonstrated that sin causes death. Saving Jesus from death would have been a violation of His character.


Oh, that men might open their minds to know God as he is revealed in his Son! {ST, January 20, 1890}
Re: Does God Punish? (Part 2) [Re: APL] #156214
09/16/13 12:50 PM
09/16/13 12:50 PM
Green Cochoa  Offline
SDA
Active Member 2021

5500+ Member
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 7,003
The Orient
Originally Posted By: APL
Christ demonstrated that sin causes death. Saving Jesus from death would have been a violation of His character.

Those two sentences don't add up in my mind, especially seeing as God and Jesus never sinned.

Blesssings,

Green Cochoa.


We can receive of heaven's light only as we are willing to be emptied of self. We can discern the character of God, and accept Christ by faith, only as we consent to the bringing into captivity of every thought to the obedience of Christ. And to all who do this, the Holy Spirit is given without measure. In Christ "dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily. And ye are complete in Him." [Colossians 2:9, 10.] {GW 57.1} -- Ellen White.
Re: Does God Punish? (Part 2) [Re: Green Cochoa] #156215
09/16/13 12:57 PM
09/16/13 12:57 PM
Green Cochoa  Offline
SDA
Active Member 2021

5500+ Member
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 7,003
The Orient
Originally Posted By: Ellen White
We want the truth on every point. We want it unadulterated with error, and unpolluted by the maxims, customs, and opinions of the world. We want the truth with all its inconvenience. The acceptance of truth ever involves a cross. But Jesus gave his life a sacrifice for us, and shall we not give him our best affections, our holiest aspirations, our fullest service? Christ's yoke we must wear, Christ's burden we must lift; but the Majesty of heaven declares that his yoke is easy and his burden light. Shall we shun the self-denying part of religion? Shall we shun the self-sacrifice, and hesitate to give up the world with all its attractions? Shall we, for whom Christ has done so much, be hearers and not doers of his words? Shall we, by our listless, inactive lives, deny our faith, and make Jesus ashamed to call us his brethren? The ten commandments came from the highest authority, and are we obeying them? They are the will of God made known to man. It was Satan that commenced to war against them, and it is he that inspires men to keep up the warfare. {RH, August 25, 1885 par. 15}


Precious statement, that one.

Blessings,

Green Cochoa.


We can receive of heaven's light only as we are willing to be emptied of self. We can discern the character of God, and accept Christ by faith, only as we consent to the bringing into captivity of every thought to the obedience of Christ. And to all who do this, the Holy Spirit is given without measure. In Christ "dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily. And ye are complete in Him." [Colossians 2:9, 10.] {GW 57.1} -- Ellen White.
Re: Does God Punish? (Part 2) [Re: Green Cochoa] #156222
09/16/13 02:24 PM
09/16/13 02:24 PM
K
kland  Offline
SDA
Active Member 2024

5500+ Member
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 6,512
Midland
Yes, "They are the will of God made known to man".

Re: Does God Punish? (Part 2) [Re: Johann] #156231
09/16/13 03:50 PM
09/16/13 03:50 PM
asygo  Offline
SDA
Active Member 2023

5500+ Member
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 5,636
California, USA
Originally Posted By: Johann
Arnold, there are questions connected with the nature of God which require an almighty insight to answer. Are some of your questions approaching this old adage:

If God is almighty could He create a stone which is so heavy that He cannot lift it Himself?

Scripture teaches us that what is revealed about the nature of God is good for us to examine, but what isn´t is none of our business.

It's actually not that complicated or philosophical. You brought up that it is a law of nature that separation from God results in death. Did God create that law of nature? Or is it Satan who made it that way?

If Satan was the one who invented that law, can God override it? You said that God is almighty and we shouldn't even question His ability to do anything He wants to do.

So, either God made that law and He wants it that way, or Satan made that law but God does not want to change it at the moment. Either way, it is not God's will that it be any different at the moment.

We have been in agreement so far. Are you changing your mind? I have not.


By God's grace,
Arnold

1 John 5:11-13
And this is the testimony, that God gave us eternal life, and this life is in his Son. Whoever has the Son has life; whoever does not have the Son of God does not have life. I write these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God, that you may know that you have eternal life.
Page 27 of 104 1 2 25 26 27 28 29 103 104

Moderator  dedication, Rick H 

Sabbath School Lesson Study Material Link
Here is the link to this week's Sabbath School Lesson Study and Discussion Material: Click Here
Most Recent Posts From Selected Public Forums
What are the seven kings of Rev. 17:10?
by Rick H. 11/23/24 07:31 AM
No mail in Canada?
by Rick H. 11/22/24 06:45 PM
Seven Trumpets reconsidered
by Karen Y. 11/21/24 11:03 AM
Fourth quarter, 2024, The Gospel of John
by asygo. 11/20/24 02:31 AM
The 2024 Election, the Hegelian Dialectic
by ProdigalOne. 11/15/24 08:26 PM
"The Lord's Day" and Ignatius
by dedication. 11/15/24 02:19 AM
The Doctrine of the Nicolaitans
by dedication. 11/14/24 04:00 PM
Will Trump be able to lead..
by dedication. 11/13/24 07:13 PM
Is Lying Ever Permitted?
by kland. 11/13/24 05:04 PM
Global Warming Farce
by kland. 11/13/24 04:06 PM
Profiles Of Jesus In Zecharia
by dedication. 11/13/24 02:23 AM
Good and Evil of Higher Critical Bible Study
by dedication. 11/12/24 07:31 PM
The Great White Throne
by dedication. 11/12/24 06:39 PM
A god whom his fathers knew not..
by TruthinTypes. 11/05/24 12:19 AM
Understanding the Battle of Armageddon
by Rick H. 10/25/24 07:25 PM
Most Recent Posts From Selected Private Forums of MSDAOL
Perils of the Emerging Church Movement
by dedication. 11/24/24 04:13 AM
Dr Ben Carson: Church and State
by Rick H. 11/22/24 07:12 PM
Will Trump Pass The Sunday Law?
by dedication. 11/22/24 12:51 PM
Understanding the 1,260-year Prophecy
by dedication. 11/22/24 12:35 PM
Private Schools
by Rick H. 11/22/24 07:54 AM
The Church is Suing the State of Maryland
by Rick H. 11/16/24 04:43 PM
Has the Catholic Church Changed?
by TheophilusOne. 11/16/24 08:53 AM
Dr Conrad Vine Banned
by Rick H. 11/15/24 06:11 AM
Understanding the 1290 & 1335 of Daniel 12?
by dedication. 11/05/24 03:16 PM
Forum Announcements
Visitors by Country Since February 11, 2013
Flag Counter
Google Maritime SDA OnLine Public Forums Site Search & Google Translation Service
Google
 
Web www.maritime-sda-online.com

Copyright 2000-Present
Maritime 2nd Advent Believers OnLine (formerly Maritime SDA OnLine).

LEGAL NOTICE:
The views expressed in this forum are those of individuals
and do not necessarily represent those of Maritime 2nd Advent Believers OnLine,
as well as the Seventh-day Adventist Church
from the local church level to the General Conference level.

Maritime 2nd Advent Believers OnLine (formerly Maritime SDA OnLine) is also a self-supporting ministry
and is not part of, or affiliated with, or endorsed by
The General Conference of Seventh-day Adventists headquartered in Silver Spring, Maryland
or any of its subsidiaries.

"And He saith unto them, follow Me, and I will make you fishers of men." Matt. 4:19
MARITIME 2ND ADVENT BELIEVERS ONLINE (FORMERLY MARITIME SDA ONLINE) CONSISTING MAINLY OF BOTH MEMBERS & FRIENDS
OF THE SEVENTH-DAY ADVENTIST CHURCH,
INVITES OTHER MEMBERS & FRIENDS OF THE SEVENTH-DAY ADVENTIST CHURCH ANYWHERE IN THE WORLD WHO WISHES TO JOIN US!
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.1