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Re: The Battle of the Bibles by Walter Veith [Re: kland] #159676
12/27/13 11:27 PM
12/27/13 11:27 PM
Daryl  Online Canadian
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Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 25,132
Nova Scotia, Canada
I think it can be referring to both, however, when you add to, remove, or change something in the Bible to fit your meaning, that is worse than simply giving a wrong meaning to it.


In His Love, Mercy & Grace,

Daryl smile

John 8:32 And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.

http://www.christians-discuss.com/forum/index.php
Re: The Battle of the Bibles by Walter Veith [Re: Daryl] #159681
12/28/13 12:17 AM
12/28/13 12:17 AM
Daryl  Online Canadian
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Posts: 25,132
Nova Scotia, Canada
Take a look at this file attachment, which is taken from Veith's video presentation.

Notice that he refers to the Received Text as villainous.

Attached Files Hort & Received Text.jpg

In His Love, Mercy & Grace,

Daryl smile

John 8:32 And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.

http://www.christians-discuss.com/forum/index.php
Re: The Battle of the Bibles by Walter Veith [Re: Daryl] #159682
12/28/13 12:24 AM
12/28/13 12:24 AM
Daryl  Online Canadian
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Nova Scotia, Canada
Also take a look at this.

Attached Files Hort & Westcott Greek Editing.jpg

In His Love, Mercy & Grace,

Daryl smile

John 8:32 And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.

http://www.christians-discuss.com/forum/index.php
Re: The Battle of the Bibles by Walter Veith [Re: Daryl] #159683
12/28/13 12:39 AM
12/28/13 12:39 AM
Daryl  Online Canadian
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Posts: 25,132
Nova Scotia, Canada
Then there is this one from the video presentation.

Attached Files Hort & Westcott - Atonement.jpg

In His Love, Mercy & Grace,

Daryl smile

John 8:32 And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.

http://www.christians-discuss.com/forum/index.php
Re: The Battle of the Bibles by Walter Veith [Re: Daryl] #159684
12/28/13 12:44 AM
12/28/13 12:44 AM
Daryl  Online Canadian
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Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 25,132
Nova Scotia, Canada
Read this one about Hort in regards to revising the Bible.

Attached Files Hort & Revising the Bible.jpg

In His Love, Mercy & Grace,

Daryl smile

John 8:32 And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.

http://www.christians-discuss.com/forum/index.php
Re: The Battle of the Bibles by Walter Veith [Re: Daryl] #159685
12/28/13 12:50 AM
12/28/13 12:50 AM
Daryl  Online Canadian
OP
Site Administrator
23000+ Member
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 25,132
Nova Scotia, Canada
We are gods?????

Or, we are God?????

Attached Files Hort to Westcott - We Are Gods.jpg

In His Love, Mercy & Grace,

Daryl smile

John 8:32 And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.

http://www.christians-discuss.com/forum/index.php
Re: The Battle of the Bibles by Walter Veith [Re: kland] #159691
12/28/13 04:42 AM
12/28/13 04:42 AM
dedication  Online Content
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Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 6,706
Canada
My point was not based on EGW's statement. Rather it is looking at the history of the Bible and seeing the battle over the truth taking place. I never quoted EGW in the first place. Just agreed with Green that history shows that the Waldenses had the unadulterated Bible.

Corrupted manuscripts were written by gnostic/philosophical minded in Christianity prior to Constantine's time -- then an Origin/Eusebius version was sanctioned and reproduced by the command of Constantine, and these became the foundation of the Catholic Latin Vulgate Bible which the Catholic church holds as the "true" Bible.

Compare this with the scriptures the early missionaries carried all over Europe which the Waldensies had in the spoken language in Italy at the time-- Roman old latin. These are in agreement with the "Received Text" with hundreds of manuscripts still in existance that show they all come from the same "family".
These herald back to the true.

The Reformation brought this Bible to the people.
But immediately the Vatican first tried to destroy it, then worked to produce their own common language bible --the Douay Rheims Bible -- based on the Vulgate to combat the protestant's Bible.

Let's just look at one verse:
Luke 2:33
Who is Jesus' Father?
Was his a virgin birth or not?


BIBLES BASED ON Constantine's manuscripts and the Vulgate:
Douay Rheims
33 And his father and mother were wondering at those things which were spoken concerning him.
ASV
33 And his father and his mother were marvelling at the things which were spoken concerning him;
NIV
33 The child’s father and mother marveled at what was said about him

BIBLES BASED ON THE RECEIVED TEXT
KJV
33 And Joseph and his mother marvelled at those things which were spoken of him.
Geneva Bible 1588
33 And Joseph and his mother marveled at those things, which were spoken touching him.
Young's Literal Translation
33 And Joseph and his mother were wondering at the things spoken concerning him


Re: The Battle of the Bibles by Walter Veith [Re: dedication] #159758
12/29/13 07:43 PM
12/29/13 07:43 PM
Rosangela  Offline
5500+ Member
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 6,154
Brazil
The differences between the manuscripts are minimal, and I don't see how they could affect the Bible message.

As a child and youth, Jesus worked with his father Joseph... {RH, March 13, 1900 par. 9}

Re: The Battle of the Bibles by Walter Veith [Re: Rosangela] #159768
12/30/13 12:40 AM
12/30/13 12:40 AM
Green Cochoa  Offline
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Active Member 2021

5500+ Member
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 7,003
The Orient
Originally Posted By: Rosangela
The differences between the manuscripts are minimal, and I don't see how they could affect the Bible message.

As a child and youth, Jesus worked with his father Joseph... {RH, March 13, 1900 par. 9}

Perhaps you have not been following the Bible version threads here. I've posted some differences which are far from "minimal."

In the case of the example you just gave, English does not have a special grammar in which to denote the possibility of more than one father--generally speaking, one can have but one father. If we were to speak of brothers, however, we have a grammatical indicator.

For example:

1. Stephen went to town with his brother Matthew to buy oil.
2. Stephen went to town with his brother, Matthew, to buy oil.

The above two sentences tell us something about how many brothers Stephen had. In the first sentence, Stephen may well have other brothers besides Matthew. In the second sentence, Matthew is his only brother.

Mrs. White is not saying Joseph is Jesus' only father. Neither is she saying that Joseph is only one of Jesus' fathers--because there is simply no English grammar to indicate this in the case of persons who are naturally singular. The little comma convention does not apply in this case.

The Bible in places specifies that Joseph was Jesus' father. But it also indicates in places that he wasn't. Having both of these truths is important to understanding Christ's divinity. But the modern versions remove the portions which set Joseph in his proper place.

There is nothing wrong with saying "Jesus' father and mother" in one sense. The wrong is the omission of the indication that Joseph was not Jesus real father. This factors into our understanding of the later verse which says "Wist ye not that I must be about my father's business?" Who is the child's father here?

Blessings,

Green Cochoa.


We can receive of heaven's light only as we are willing to be emptied of self. We can discern the character of God, and accept Christ by faith, only as we consent to the bringing into captivity of every thought to the obedience of Christ. And to all who do this, the Holy Spirit is given without measure. In Christ "dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily. And ye are complete in Him." [Colossians 2:9, 10.] {GW 57.1} -- Ellen White.
Re: The Battle of the Bibles by Walter Veith [Re: Green Cochoa] #159771
12/30/13 05:05 AM
12/30/13 05:05 AM
APL  Offline
SDA
Active Member 2020

5500+ Member
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 6,368
Western, USA
Originally Posted By: green
For example:

1. Stephen went to town with his brother Matthew to buy oil.
2. Stephen went to town with his brother, Matthew, to buy oil.

The above two sentences tell us something about how many brothers Stephen had. In the first sentence, Stephen may well have other brothers besides Matthew. In the second sentence, Matthew is his only brother.

Huh? Neither sentence tells us the total number Stephen had. Both sentences tell us exactly the same thing. Is this your best example???


Oh, that men might open their minds to know God as he is revealed in his Son! {ST, January 20, 1890}
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