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Re: Some signs will happen again?
[Re: Godsloveandlaw]
#161349
02/06/14 05:59 AM
02/06/14 05:59 AM
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The original title of Elder Smith's book, Thoughts on Daniel and The Revelation, avows him as undesigning and above-board in writing the book. The word, "thoughts," denoting an idea, a theory, not an absolute truth, shows that he simply commended the book to its readers for whatever its contents might be worth to them.
This he did, of course, with the implicit understanding that at the time of the "unrolling of the scroll" (Testimonies, Vol.6, p.17), when the writings of Daniel and of John the Revelator would be illuminated, the reader should exchange his "thoughts," if erroneous, for the truth, as the humble follower of Christ ever does.
However, going beyond this modest intention of the author, the denomination omitted from the later editions of the book the word "thoughts," the first word of the original title. And now some of the leading men try to make us believe that Sister White was shown that an angel was guiding Elder Smith's hand while he was resetting the theories of uninspired men!
Hence it is very evident that though large portions of the book impair the finality of the Scriptures, yet the book's champions will have the errors at all costs -- even at the expense of truth! Indeed, their thus exalting the fabrications of men, and stamping them as bearing the seal of Inspiration, while depreciating the precision of The Revelation, show that Satan is the one who has led them into this rationalizing.
Then, again, while on one hand these commentators profess to know more about John's vision than did John himself, on the other hand these champions of Uriah Smith's writings act as though they know more about his experience with Inspiration than did he himself, for he never claimed to be inspired, whereas they aver he was.
Any last lingering doubt that Sister White did not say and could not have said that the book Thoughts on Daniel and The Revelation is inspired, is completely dissipated by Elder Arthur L. White in the following letter:
"Among our older workers there are a number who have thought that Mrs. White had written words to the effect that she had seen in vision an angel standing by the side of Elder Uriah Smith helping him as he wrote the book above referred to. However, a careful search of her manuscript files has failed to disclose such a statement among her writings, and we believe that there is no such statement in print.... Elder A.C. Bordeau, some years ago made the following statement:
" 'Many years ago, when the late Elder Uriah Smith was writing "Thoughts on Daniel and the Revelation," while Elder James White and Ellen G. White were at my house in Enosburg, Vt., they received by mail a roll of printed proof-sheets on "Thoughts on Revelation" that Brother Smith had sent to them. Brother White read portions of these to the company, and expressed much pleasure and satisfaction because they were so concisely and clearly written. Then Sister White stated what she had been shown, as follows: --
" ' "The Lord is inspiring Brother Smith -- leading his mind by His Spirit, and an angel is guiding his hand in writing these 'Thoughts on Daniel and the Revelation.' "
" 'I was present when these words were spoken.
" '(Signed) A.C. Bordeau.' "
"In estimating the accuracy of the words attributed to Mrs. White by Elder Bordeau," continues Elder Arthur White, in regard to Elder Bordeau's statement, "one must bear in mind that a number of years had elapsed between the incident related and its recital. We cannot consistently believe that she intended to convey the idea that Elder Smith was inspired to such a degree that his writings were inerrant."
That not only, though, was Elder Smith uninspired, but also that his teachings are in direct opposition to what Sister White was shown in vision, is witnessed by the following statement from an early S.D.A. publication:
"I saw," says Sister White, "all that 'would not receive the mark of the Beast, and of his Image, in their foreheads or in their hands,' could not buy or sell [Rev. 13:15-17]. I saw that the number (666) of the Image Beast [the two-horned beast of verse 11] was made up; and that it was the beast [the ten-horned beast of verse 1] that changed the Sabbath, and the Image Beast [the two-horned beast] had followed on after, and kept the Pope's and not God's Sabbath." -- A Word to the Little Flock, p. 19.
Contradicting this heaven-given view Thoughts on Daniel and The Revelation applies the number "666" to the pope.
From this we see that Elder Smith did not share in the same Inspiration which guided Sister White. Though as her follower he was influenced by her yet his book shows that he was also influenced by the writings of uninspired authors. Containing doctrines from her writings as well as from theirs, the book, consequently, is an admixture of truth and error.
But the most inexcusable part of the whole thing is that the leading brethren have entirely disregarded the inspired vision concerning the number 666 (Rev. 13:18), and in its place have almost unanimously accepted these traditions and theories of men. The sad result is that they have become blind to the light, rebellious against the Spirit of Christ, and consequently untrustworthy servants, unfit and disqualified as leaders of His people.
And yet, withal, they go on the while complacently assuring themselves that they are the "men of experience," who alone are capable of investigation and deciding whether or not the messages that come to the people are from God! An arrogation of authority which no one has a right to make unto himself, it is the despotic spawn of egotism and Glaring Inconsistency.
Will post on the Trumpets next week.
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Re: Some signs will happen again?
[Re: jamesonofthunder]
#161363
02/06/14 02:35 PM
02/06/14 02:35 PM
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SDA Active Member 2024
5500+ Member
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Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 6,512
Midland
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Jesus never went where He wasn't needed by men, Satan does. You are not wanted here because you are only here to try to confuse the brethren like Satan would.
What denomination are you Mr Peterson? Are you a hateful Catholic looking for revenge? What would possess you to come here?
Are you casting contempt? Criminal harassment has it's own rewards. God is watching you. Do you think He will eventually set him on fire?
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Re: Some signs will happen again?
[Re: kland]
#161368
02/06/14 05:30 PM
02/06/14 05:30 PM
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NON-SDA Active Member 2019
Dedicated Member
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Joined: Jul 2013
Posts: 1,195
Canada
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This he did, of course, with the implicit understanding that at the time of the "unrolling of the scroll" (Testimonies, Vol.6, p.17), when the writings of Daniel and of John the Revelator would be illuminated, the reader should exchange his "thoughts," if erroneous, for the truth, as the humble follower of Christ ever does. That's a strange thing to say. The book of Daniel was understood well among the leaders of the Apostolic Church. It says so in Mat. 23:15 ("When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand)") and in 2 Thes. 2:3 ("Let no man deceive you by any means:for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition"). Why, in heaven's name, do SDA fill themselves up with lies; instead of reading the Bible for themselves? ///
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Re: Some signs will happen again?
[Re: APL]
#161378
02/06/14 08:03 PM
02/06/14 08:03 PM
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Banned SDA Active Member 2015
3500+ Member
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Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 3,613
USA
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So you support the work of Mr Peterson APL? Someone who is not a Seventh Day Adventist spending all his time trying to disuade people from our faith, you see no harm in this?
If you don't think God is watching us then you are very messed up.
This is the perfect exemple of how you twist things to suit your own interpretation.
God is watching you too. He has mercy, but He is also a jeaolous God. He hates nothing more than men like you trying to do harm to the church. So you just keep on sealing your fate...
"Nothing else in this world is so dear to God as His church. Nothing is guarded by Him with such jealous care. Nothing so offends God as an act that injures the influence of those who are doing His service. He will call to account all who aid Satan in his work of criticizing and discouraging.449 {CCh 248.5}
I say this with all impunity in the name of Jesus, APL and Mr Peterson, you have offended the mighty Jehovah. You should be very affraid right now.
Search me oh God and know my heart, test me and know my anxious thoughts, see if there is any offensive way in me and lead me to the way everlasting. Amen
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Re: Some signs will happen again?
[Re: Godsloveandlaw]
#161380
02/06/14 11:52 PM
02/06/14 11:52 PM
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SDA Charter Member Active Member 2020
4500+ Member
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Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 4,583
USA
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Godslove, the reason Miller's and his associates' interpretations are basically sound (and Smith followed their lead fairly closely on the trumpets) is they stuck to the rules of prophetic interpretation and interpreted the text as literally as possible. For example gunfire from riders on horseback does look something like fire coming from the horses mouths and is the closest literal approximation to the vision for that time. Applying it today though, we have modern weapons that match the description well – armed military UAV's or drones that can fly in precise formation yet be controlled remotely, armed with weapons, including nuclear weapons, that can deploy forward (from their heads) or backwards (from their tails). Scorpion stings and exposure to high levels of nuclear radiation produces some of the same symptoms. Over-exposure to radiation results in a lingering death. The horse-like appearance of the "locusts", crowns, men's faces and women's hair doesn't fit well with most current drones designs but we don't know what the next generation will be like. Israel, for example has a VTOL craft that is rectangular with no visible wings.
Another possibility is that the locusts are genetically modified (GMO) locusts. That would be very literal.
If the Lord used the original interpretation to confirm the credibility of the day for year principle, we should not be quick to dismiss the other parts of the Millerite interpretation – for example the meaning of the smoke of Islamic doctrine being the force behind it's followers blind and barbaric militancy.
That said, there is also a more literal interpretation for the smoke – that the smoke is smoke. Volcanoes have block out the sun and moon in the past. If an earth threatening eruption occurs, when the nations become desperate for survival, conflict of every kind is likely as food supplies suddenly evaporate due to global crop failures, spawning drone warfare on an unprecedented scale.
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Re: Some signs will happen again?
[Re: jamesonofthunder]
#161381
02/07/14 01:41 AM
02/07/14 01:41 AM
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NON-SDA Active Member 2019
Dedicated Member
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Joined: Jul 2013
Posts: 1,195
Canada
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I say this with all impunity in the name of Jesus, APL and Mr Peterson, you have offended the mighty Jehovah. You should be very affraid right now. I thank God always that I know how to spell properly, and that I have the Testimony of Jesus Christ (the last book of the Holy Bible ONLY) and that I keep His commandments. Therefore I know that God is watching over me. He has mercy, but He is also a jealous God. He hates nothing more than men like a certain screaming baby trying to do harm to me. So it can just keep on sealing it's fate ... ///
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Re: Some signs will happen again?
[Re: James Peterson]
#161382
02/07/14 02:55 AM
02/07/14 02:55 AM
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James, as many now know, you being a "Non-SDA", it really is useless for us to correspond with you. We speak different languages spiritually speaking. I further suggest you go to a non- SDA site , this way people will know more of where you are coming from. I for one will no longer address your comments.
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Re: Some signs will happen again?
[Re: Godsloveandlaw]
#161399
02/07/14 08:13 AM
02/07/14 08:13 AM
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NON-SDA Active Member 2019
Dedicated Member
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Joined: Jul 2013
Posts: 1,195
Canada
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James, as many now know, you being a "Non-SDA", it really is useless for us to correspond with you. We speak different languages spiritually speaking. I further suggest you go to a non- SDA site , this way people will know more of where you are coming from. I for one will no longer address your comments. It strikes me as odd that SDA have become Roman Catholics except in name, when they so vehemently condemn them for having THEIR magisterium above the Bible, a practice no different from what has now possessed SDA. What does it matter whether I am SDA or not? Is the truth not the truth, according to the Holy Scriptures, anymore? Is the Bible not allowed to express itself anymore in the denomination? Do men go around in the dark saying, "Shhh, be silent. We have a lesser light and it will now speak graciously to us"? This is no different from the age of Christ when the Scribes and Pharisees were condemning Jesus of Nazareth because "he was not one of them." I tell you, truly, history must needs be repeated. Consider the word of The Lord (John 7): "14 Now about the midst of the feast Jesus went up into the temple, and taught. 15 And the Jews marvelled, saying, How knoweth this man letters, having never learned? 16 Jesus answered them, and said, My doctrine is not mine, but his that sent me. 17 If any man will do his will, he shall know of the doctrine, whether it be of God, or whether I speak of myself. 18 He that speaketh of himself seeketh his own glory:but he that seeketh his glory that sent him, the same is true, and no unrighteousness is in him. 19 Did not Moses give you the law, and yet none of you keepeth the law? Why go ye about to kill me? 20 The people answered and said, Thou hast a devil:who goeth about to kill thee?" ///
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Re: Some signs will happen again?
[Re: Godsloveandlaw]
#161400
02/07/14 08:15 AM
02/07/14 08:15 AM
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Banned SDA Active Member 2015
3500+ Member
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Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 3,613
USA
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Amen Godslove.
Mr Peterson, you must be a very sad and lonely erson to spend all your time trying to alter any church but your own.
Is it the oath they made you take that compels you to come here day after day? Since you openly admit that you are here to convert people to your own understanding I am quite certain you are here to harass us.
Search me oh God and know my heart, test me and know my anxious thoughts, see if there is any offensive way in me and lead me to the way everlasting. Amen
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Re: Some signs will happen again?
[Re: James Peterson]
#161402
02/07/14 08:27 AM
02/07/14 08:27 AM
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Banned SDA Active Member 2015
3500+ Member
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Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 3,613
USA
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I say this with all impunity in the name of Jesus, APL and Mr Peterson, you have offended the mighty Jehovah. You should be very affraid right now. I thank God always that I know how to spell properly, and that I have the Testimony of Jesus Christ (the last book of the Holy Bible ONLY) and that I keep His commandments. Therefore I know that God is watching over me. He has mercy, but He is also a jealous God. He hates nothing more than men like a certain screaming baby trying to do harm to me. So it can just keep on sealing it's fate ... /// What a hateful person you really are, and you say you are here in the name of Lord are you? I misspell one word in that sentence and you openly rebuke me for it while using the name of the Lord?
Search me oh God and know my heart, test me and know my anxious thoughts, see if there is any offensive way in me and lead me to the way everlasting. Amen
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