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Re: Does God Punish? (Part 3)
[Re: Daryl]
#164447
04/20/14 03:03 AM
04/20/14 03:03 AM
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SDA
Active Member 2014
Retired Pastor
3000+ Member
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Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 3,014
Iceland
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Christ's Object Lessons, 84.4
"Here is a last piece of advice. If you believe in goodness and if you value the approval of God, fix your minds on the things which are holy and right and pure and beautiful and good. Model your conduct on what you have learned from me, on what I have told you and shown you, and you will find the God of peace will be with you."
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Re: Does God Punish? (Part 3)
[Re: APL]
#164450
04/20/14 04:53 AM
04/20/14 04:53 AM
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Ellen White writes:
I was shown that the judgments of God would not come directly out from the Lord upon them, but in this way: They place themselves beyond His protection. He warns, corrects, reproves, and points out the only path of safety; then if those who have been the objects of His special care will follow their own course independent of the Spirit of God, after repeated warnings, if they choose their own way, then He does not commission His angels to prevent Satan's decided attacks upon them.
God destroys no man. Everyone who is destroyed will have destroyed himself. Everyone who stifles the admonitions of conscience is sowing the seeds of unbelief, and these will produce a sure harvest.
It is God that shields His creatures and hedges them in from the power of the destroyer.
We have seen these statements quoted out of context from you many times. They have their proper place. Hell is not the place. Not a one of those statements of Mrs. White referring to God's removal of protection and permitting of destruction to occur refers to either the last plagues or to the fires of hell. They refer to events occurring in probationary time, not to post-probationary events. If you find that the statement saying "I was shown that the judgments of God would not come directly out from the Lord upon them" applies to hell, then please explain how both it and the one saying "fire was breathed from God upon them and consumed them" can be true at one and the same time. I find the two statements to be mutually exclusive with regard to the same event. They must, therefore, refer to separate events or times. Blessings, Green Cochoa.
We can receive of heaven's light only as we are willing to be emptied of self. We can discern the character of God, and accept Christ by faith, only as we consent to the bringing into captivity of every thought to the obedience of Christ. And to all who do this, the Holy Spirit is given without measure. In Christ "dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily. And ye are complete in Him." [Colossians 2:9, 10.] {GW 57.1} -- Ellen White.
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Re: Does God Punish? (Part 3)
[Re: Johann]
#164451
04/20/14 04:59 AM
04/20/14 04:59 AM
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SDA
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Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 7,003
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Christ's Object Lessons, 84.4 Thank you. This statement refers to the destruction of one's character by his or her own free choices. It accompanies the text of Gal. 6:7. God does not force us to sow "wild oats." It is our own choice to destroy ourselves thus. The statement does not, however, address the destruction of the soul and body to take place in hell following the destruction of one's character during probationary time. We may choose whether or not to destroy our characters. God does not do this. Far from it, He wishes to build up and to restore our characters to His likeness. But if we destroy ourselves, He will be forced to destroy our soul and body in hell. Blessings, Green Cochoa.
We can receive of heaven's light only as we are willing to be emptied of self. We can discern the character of God, and accept Christ by faith, only as we consent to the bringing into captivity of every thought to the obedience of Christ. And to all who do this, the Holy Spirit is given without measure. In Christ "dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily. And ye are complete in Him." [Colossians 2:9, 10.] {GW 57.1} -- Ellen White.
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Re: Does God Punish? (Part 3)
[Re: Daryl]
#164455
04/20/14 12:33 PM
04/20/14 12:33 PM
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SDA
Active Member 2020
5500+ Member
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Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 6,368
Western, USA
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Oh that's right, when EGW says, " God does not stand toward the sinner as an executioner of the sentence against transgression;", you would say, yes He is the executioner, is that correct? It's all out of contect. What is the sentence against transgression, death. When is that administered? Some recommended studies: HERE and HERE
Oh, that men might open their minds to know God as he is revealed in his Son! {ST, January 20, 1890}
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Re: Does God Punish? (Part 3)
[Re: Daryl]
#164457
04/20/14 01:50 PM
04/20/14 01:50 PM
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SDA
Active Member 2021
5500+ Member
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Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 7,003
The Orient
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APL,
Maybe some day you will understand what "stand toward" means. It will open your eyes.
Blessings,
Green Cochoa.
We can receive of heaven's light only as we are willing to be emptied of self. We can discern the character of God, and accept Christ by faith, only as we consent to the bringing into captivity of every thought to the obedience of Christ. And to all who do this, the Holy Spirit is given without measure. In Christ "dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily. And ye are complete in Him." [Colossians 2:9, 10.] {GW 57.1} -- Ellen White.
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Re: Does God Punish? (Part 3)
[Re: Daryl]
#164458
04/20/14 02:17 PM
04/20/14 02:17 PM
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SDA
Active Member 2020
5500+ Member
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Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 6,368
Western, USA
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That's right! God IS the executioner, but he does not stand, perhaps he sits? But if we destroy ourselves, He will be forced to destroy our soul and body in hell. Maybe someday, you will understand who it is the destroys the body and soul in the grave, and when you do, perhaps, maybe, it will open your eyes. Your paradigm has God being the executioner. He is not.
Oh, that men might open their minds to know God as he is revealed in his Son! {ST, January 20, 1890}
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Re: Does God Punish? (Part 3)
[Re: Daryl]
#164460
04/20/14 02:38 PM
04/20/14 02:38 PM
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SDA
Active Member 2021
5500+ Member
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Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 7,003
The Orient
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APL, Who can kill the soul? And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell. And who is NOT able to kill the soul? Blessings, Green Cochoa.
We can receive of heaven's light only as we are willing to be emptied of self. We can discern the character of God, and accept Christ by faith, only as we consent to the bringing into captivity of every thought to the obedience of Christ. And to all who do this, the Holy Spirit is given without measure. In Christ "dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily. And ye are complete in Him." [Colossians 2:9, 10.] {GW 57.1} -- Ellen White.
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Re: Does God Punish? (Part 3)
[Re: Green Cochoa]
#164463
04/20/14 03:53 PM
04/20/14 03:53 PM
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SDA
Active Member 2020
5500+ Member
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Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 6,368
Western, USA
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APL, Who can kill the soul? And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell. And who is NOT able to kill the soul? Blessings, Green Cochoa. Answer: Do I Have To Believe In Hell?
Oh, that men might open their minds to know God as he is revealed in his Son! {ST, January 20, 1890}
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Re: Does God Punish? (Part 3)
[Re: Mountain Man]
#164465
04/20/14 05:10 PM
04/20/14 05:10 PM
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SDA
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Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 22,256
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APL, this is the third time I've reposted this. APL: Does the death of Christ say anything to you about the death of a sinner? It does not to MM, what about you? Thou shalt not bear false witness. You are lying about me.
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Re: Does God Punish? (Part 3)
[Re: Mountain Man]
#164466
04/20/14 05:22 PM
04/20/14 05:22 PM
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SDA
Active Member 2020
5500+ Member
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Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 6,368
Western, USA
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APL, this is the third time I've reposted this. APL: Does the death of Christ say anything to you about the death of a sinner? It does not to MM, what about you? Thou shalt not bear false witness. You are lying about me. Yep - and I think I have responded each time. Shalom.
Oh, that men might open their minds to know God as he is revealed in his Son! {ST, January 20, 1890}
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Here is the link to this week's Sabbath School Lesson Study and Discussion Material: Click Here
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