these are the issues that God motivates me to address here.
1. Was Jesus Born again?
2. Did Jesus have "sin in His sinful flesh"?
Show me the quotes that say these things directly and I will stop saying this is herecy. If you cannot produce then answer this, has God given anyone here a mission to add to the Testimonies?

Is Jesus, who is the creator, greater than His creatures? You answer that. To say He was born again is like saying the copy of a master piece is as great as the original. Was the earthly temple as great as the heavenly? He was the fullness of the Godhead embodied in human flesh. This is why you will never find any inspired writing addressing Him like what is being attempted here, and the depravity and boldness of the attempt is what I am motivated to challenge. If the Spirit of prophecy does not say those things then do you think you are more inspired?
That is all.

Daryl, I'm sorry. I promise to stop goading.

As Christ was without sin in His humanity/flesh from birth, why would He need to be born again? I, therefore, say "No" to both questions #1 and #2.

What is the definition of "sinful flesh"? Flesh that does not have sin in it????? Sinful = full of sin.

If logic and language mean anything . . .

James, it would be helpful if you answered the questions posted above. Also, answer the question - Why did Jesus get baptized?

PS - You have not posted inspired passages supporting the idea Jesus was not tempted like born-again believers are tempted. Bear in mind all temptations begin as an unholy thought and feeling.

Yes, I believe Jesus bore the sins of the world in His body in sinful flesh from the womb to the tomb. Listen:


Please answer the following questions:

1) "The weight of the sins of the world was pressing His soul, and His countenance expressed unutterable sorrow, a depth of anguish that fallen man had never realized." When and where did this happen?

2) "He felt the overwhelming tide of woe that deluged the world." How and why was this possible?

3) "He realized the strength of indulged appetite and unholy passion which controlled the world and had brought upon man inexpressible suffering." How and why was this possible?

jsot and others here claim that that sins of the world were only placed on Christ in Gethsemane and/or the cross. EGW is very clear and is the Bible, that this is not the case. He was encumbered with them from His birth.

Heavenly Father please open their eyes. In the name of your Son, through His righteous life amen.

As we have previously seen, Jesus was born with the Holy Spirit. Do you believe this?

When Jesus came to John to be baptized, John said "no way, I need to be baptized from you" and Jesus said "suffer it to be so for it is right for me to fulfill all righteousness." Did He need it for Himself?

"John could not understand why Jesus, who came not with confession to repentance, should need the rite of baptism when he had no sins to wash away. He refused to baptize Jesus because that he felt that he was better than himself. With firm and gentle authority, Jesus waives the refusal of John and his plea of unworthiness, by these words both of command and solicitation. “Suffer it to be so now; for thus it becometh us to fulfill all righteousness.”{YI January 1, 1874, par. 8}
Christ came to receive baptism, not with confession of sins to repentance, for he was without the taint of sin. He marked the way for the sinner by his own example in taking the steps the sinner is required to take. He pointed out distinctly the way of salvation for the repenting, believing sinner. It was not Christ that had broken the law of God, but sinful man. It was man that had forfeited all right to divine favor by transgression of the Father’s law, and had separated himself from God by his disobedience." {YI January 1, 1874, par. 9}

Then the Holy Spirit came on Him like a dove, correct? Does this mean Jesus didn't have the Holy Spirit before? No, there are varying degrees of Spirit filled living.

For instance, Jesus called the disciples and they were baptized and He sent them to do miracles. Judas was one of them doing miracles. But some things they were not prepared to do. Then later He breathed on them the Holy Spirit and they could do more, then the Day of Pentecost came when the number was complete and then they could RESURRECT THE DEAD in the name of the Lord! Correct?

Jesus was the example. Everything He did He said "you will do greater things" not because He couldn't do them, but because the world was not ready to see what He could do.

So Jesus was born with the Holy Spirit, never sinful, but in the likeness of sinful flesh. The bible never says that Jesus had sin in His flesh, it says He was in the LIKENESS of sinful flesh...totally different. But let me stay on this point.

After Jesus was matured, and the full realization of who He was set in, then there was an advancement of Spiritual discernment. When He turned 30 years old He received the Holy Spirit like a DOVE for the first time and He entered into His perfect ministry. He had a fallen human body but after receiving the Holy Spirit He could be tested to prove He was God in the flesh without using His divinity to overcome temptation. This is the second phase of His life. He went 40 days in the desert without food or water, proving He had never sinned. Death is the result of sin. His mortal body would have been translated and taken to heaven if He had to endure any more, because He was perfectly untouched by sin. He endured every temptation in those forty days. The most mind melting temptations beyond what every person has gone through all at once.

THEN at the end of His ministry He went to the next phase. Because He had lived the perfect life and overcame every temptation of the flesh, now as the perfect sacrifice He took the sins of the world on His head in Gethsemane and at the same time was tempted on a level that only the 144,000 will even come close to. He stood before the wrath of God while the devil tried to convince Him that He was eternally cut off from the Father because He had taken our sins upon His own record. This is beyond temptation of the flesh. It is a temptation of the Spirit. Satan spent three days trying to convict Jesus that He was in fact Satan. Everything that happened to Christ from Gethsemane to the cross was a Spiritual temptation and only those who stand before the Father after probation ends will ever have to endure anything like it. (they are not sin bearers, they only stand at the end of probation while the plagues fall) The 144,000 will in a very small degree know what Jesus went through from Gethsemane to the cross, thus they get to sing the song of the lamb.

But what was it that helped Jesus endure this demonically galactic temptation with the sins of billions of people on His head?

The second baptism. The baptism of Blood. When Jesus was covered, baptized in blood from His head to His toes (Baptizmos) after He took our sins and went through the darkest hour in Gethsemane, that is when the second sign of the Dove rested upon Him.

"No traces of His recent agony were visible as Jesus stepped forth to meet His betrayer. Standing in advance of His disciples He said, “Whom seek ye?” They answered, “Jesus of Nazareth.” Jesus replied, “I am He.” As these words were spoken, the angel who had lately ministered to Jesus moved between Him and the mob. A divine light illuminated the Saviour’s face, and a dovelike form overshadowed Him. In the presence of this divine glory, the murderous throng could not stand for a moment. They staggered back. Priests, elders, soldiers, and even Judas, fell as dead men to the ground.{DA 694.5}

Matthew 3:11 I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance. but he that cometh after me is mightier than I, whose shoes I am not worthy to bear: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost, and with fire:

This is when He could endure standing before the Wrath of the Father and endure the deepest heartache. The Holy Angels were there for Him to strengthen Him, but the Father was silent. He was "cut off but not for Himself".

Do you see the three degrees of Holy Spirit that Jesus had in His life?

Did Jesus endure this His whole life? I need to goad you in this. It is for a divine purpose because you think you are so knowledgeable and act like a teacher when in truth it is so blatantly obvious to me that you are searching without light to guide you on these eternally powerful elements of faith.

Do you want to know more or are you going to close your ears? I will endure it, but you are not going to like the outcome I guarantee it, in the name of Christ.

I agree 100% with you Daryl.

To be "born in sin and shaped in iniquity" means to be born in poverty, poverty of the knowledge and experience of God. But Jesus was different from any one of us, even from Adam. John the Baptist spoke of him this way, "He that cometh from above is above all: he that is of the earth is earthly, and speaketh of the earth: he that cometh from heaven is above all." (John 3:31)

It is much like if Prince George, of William and Kate of England, were born in Haiti, in its poorest slum. I tell you, the full power of the British crown would be behind him though for a while he was living amidst squalor. He would have the best private tutor and be surrounded by the bravest of men. And who would say nay? For he would be destined for the Throne of the Commonwealth.

Jesus bore the hallmarks of heaven because he was of heaven and was brought up with an education befitting one who was destined for heavenly glory. As John the Baptist said, "For he whom God hath sent speaketh the words of God: for God giveth not the Spirit by measure unto him." (John 3:34) And as Jesus himself said, at the tender age of 12, when they found him in the Temple:

47 And all that heard him were astonished at his understanding and answers.
48 And when they saw him, they were amazed: and his mother said unto him, Son, why hast thou thus dealt with us? behold, thy father and I have sought thee sorrowing.
49 And he said unto them, How is it that ye sought me? wist ye not that I must be about my Father's business?
50 And they understood not the saying which he spake unto them.

Luke 2

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