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Re: 2nd Quarter 2014 Christ and His Law [Re: Green Cochoa] #165816
06/09/14 08:54 AM
06/09/14 08:54 AM
Johann  Offline
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Retired Pastor
3000+ Member
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 3,014
Iceland
Originally Posted By: Green Cochoa


Now, getting closer to the point of this discussion, our faith is shown in our effort to obey--which then unlocks heaven's storehouse of blessing and strength to help us obey more perfectly.

Blessings,

Green Cochoa.


Quote:
"The religious services, the prayers, the praise, the penitent confession of sin ascend from true believers as incense to the heavenly sanctuary; but passing through the corrupt channels of humanity, they are so defiled that unless purified by blood, they can never be of value with God. They ascend not in spotless purity, and unless the Intercessor who is at God’s right hand presents and purifies all by His righteousness, it is not acceptable to God. All incense from earthly tabernacles must be moist with the cleansing drops of the blood of Christ. He holds before the Father the censer of His own merits, in which there is no taint of earthly corruption. He gathers into this censer the prayers, the praise, and the confessions of His people, and with these He puts His own spotless righteousness. Then, perfumed with the merits of Christ’s propitiation, the incense comes up before God wholly and entirely acceptable", sda bible commentary 6:1078... {1SM 344.2}


Even our prayers need to be cleansed before they are acceptable.

Passing through our corrupt humanity everything we do is defiled.


"Here is a last piece of advice. If you believe in goodness and if you value the approval of God, fix your minds on the things which are holy and right and pure and beautiful and good. Model your conduct on what you have learned from me, on what I have told you and shown you, and you will find the God of peace will be with you."
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Re: 2nd Quarter 2014 Christ and His Law [Re: dedication] #165817
06/09/14 11:30 AM
06/09/14 11:30 AM
Green Cochoa  Offline
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Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 7,003
The Orient
Originally Posted By: Ellen White
The pastor who fulfills his high commission must give his people faithful instruction on every point of the Christian faith, showing them what they must be and do in order to stand perfect in the day of God. He only who is a faithful teacher of the truth will at the close of his work be able to say with Paul, "I am pure from the blood of all men." {AA 393.4}


We are not forced to keep the character we have now. On the contrary, it is our privilege to see our character progress until we "should come into the full noontide of a perfect gospel faith."

Originally Posted By: Ellen White
The Corinthian believers needed a deeper experience in the things of God. They did not know fully what it meant to behold His glory and to be changed from character to character. They had seen but the first rays of the early dawn of that glory. Paul's desire for them was that they might be filled with all the fullness of God, following on to know Him whose going forth is prepared as the morning, and continuing to learn of Him until they should come into the full noontide of a perfect gospel faith. {AA 307.2}


Blessings,

Green Cochoa.


We can receive of heaven's light only as we are willing to be emptied of self. We can discern the character of God, and accept Christ by faith, only as we consent to the bringing into captivity of every thought to the obedience of Christ. And to all who do this, the Holy Spirit is given without measure. In Christ "dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily. And ye are complete in Him." [Colossians 2:9, 10.] {GW 57.1} -- Ellen White.
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Re: 2nd Quarter 2014 Christ and His Law [Re: dedication] #165828
06/09/14 02:49 PM
06/09/14 02:49 PM
asygo  Offline
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Joined: Feb 2006
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California, USA
Is perfect obedience a requirement of the New Covenant or a promise? If it is a requirement, from whom is it required? If it is a promise, by whom and to whom is it promised?


By God's grace,
Arnold

1 John 5:11-13
And this is the testimony, that God gave us eternal life, and this life is in his Son. Whoever has the Son has life; whoever does not have the Son of God does not have life. I write these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God, that you may know that you have eternal life.
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Re: 2nd Quarter 2014 Christ and His Law [Re: asygo] #165830
06/09/14 03:35 PM
06/09/14 03:35 PM
Green Cochoa  Offline
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Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 7,003
The Orient
Originally Posted By: asygo
Is perfect obedience a requirement of the New Covenant or a promise? If it is a requirement, from whom is it required? If it is a promise, by whom and to whom is it promised?

It is both a requirement and a promise. Look at the Ten Commandments. They are part of this covenant. Are they a requirement or a promise? I say both.

When we love God, we will not do those things that are forbidden by the law, and we will do those things which are commanded. "If ye love me, keep my commandments." We love Him because He first loved us--by our own choice. In the same manner, obedience by choice becomes our character in time. We choose to obey, and God gives us strength to follow through on that choice. He has promised to strengthen us.

The promise is God's promise given to us. We accept it by faith, which in turn is made faith through our obedience in response to our belief. Faith equals belief plus obedience. Without faith it is impossible to please God. The promise is conditional upon our obedience.

Blessings,

Green Cochoa.


We can receive of heaven's light only as we are willing to be emptied of self. We can discern the character of God, and accept Christ by faith, only as we consent to the bringing into captivity of every thought to the obedience of Christ. And to all who do this, the Holy Spirit is given without measure. In Christ "dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily. And ye are complete in Him." [Colossians 2:9, 10.] {GW 57.1} -- Ellen White.
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Re: 2nd Quarter 2014 Christ and His Law [Re: dedication] #165832
06/09/14 05:13 PM
06/09/14 05:13 PM
APL  Offline
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Posts: 6,368
Western, USA
Green - you speak Old Covenant, where the people promised to keep the law, and our promises are ropes of sand.


Oh, that men might open their minds to know God as he is revealed in his Son! {ST, January 20, 1890}
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Re: 2nd Quarter 2014 Christ and His Law [Re: Johann] #165834
06/09/14 05:25 PM
06/09/14 05:25 PM
Mountain Man  Offline
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Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 22,256
Southwest USA
Originally Posted By: Johann
Even our prayers need to be cleansed before they are acceptable. Passing through our corrupt humanity everything we do is defiled.

Pastor, a few people have been advocating a similar view. Where in the Bible does it say so? That is, where in the Bible does it say the fruit of abiding in Jesus, the fruit of partaking of the divine nature is defiled and unacceptable? I believe the SOP is harmony with the Bible.

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Re: 2nd Quarter 2014 Christ and His Law [Re: asygo] #165839
06/09/14 09:53 PM
06/09/14 09:53 PM
J
James Peterson  Offline
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Active Member 2019

Dedicated Member
Joined: Jul 2013
Posts: 1,195
Canada
Originally Posted By: asygo
1. Is perfect obedience a requirement of the New Covenant or a promise?
2. If it is a requirement, from whom is it required?
3. If it is a promise, by whom and to whom is it promised?

1. A promise. It was premised on genuine love. "IF YOU LOVE ME," Jesus said, "keep my commandments." Love was going to impel obedience. It was going to be the motivation for pleasing God. And indeed, genuine love reconciles and heals and strengthens.

2. See #1

3. By Jesus Christ, to every believer.

///

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Re: 2nd Quarter 2014 Christ and His Law [Re: Johann] #165840
06/09/14 10:47 PM
06/09/14 10:47 PM
J
James Peterson  Offline
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Active Member 2019

Dedicated Member
Joined: Jul 2013
Posts: 1,195
Canada
Originally Posted By: Johann
Even our prayers need to be cleansed before they are acceptable. Passing through our corrupt humanity everything we do is defiled.

Do you say to your children, "until you are perfect, don't speak to me"? How then is it written, "if you then, being evil, know how to give good gifts to your children, HOW MUCH MORE will your Father who is in heaven give good things to those who ask Him"? (Mat. 7:11)

See, even before we ask, he answers. For it is also written, "that you may be sons of your Father in heaven; for He makes His sun rise on the evil and on the good, and sends rain on the just and on the unjust." (Mat. 5:45)

Perfection and perfect obedience is NOT the key that opens the door of God's heart, but humility: repentance and love. "on this one will I look, " He says, "on him who is poor and of a contrite spirit, and who trembles at My word." (Is. 66:2)

///

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Re: 2nd Quarter 2014 Christ and His Law [Re: APL] #165844
06/10/14 02:02 AM
06/10/14 02:02 AM
Green Cochoa  Offline
SDA
Active Member 2021

5500+ Member
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 7,003
The Orient
Originally Posted By: APL
Green - you speak Old Covenant, where the people promised to keep the law, and our promises are ropes of sand.


I am speaking of the New Covenant, APL. The Ten Commandments are part of it.

Originally Posted By: Ellen White
The new-covenant promise is, "I will put My laws into their hearts, and in their minds will I write them." Hebrews 10:16. While the system of types which pointed to Christ as the Lamb of God that should take away the sin of the world was to pass away at His death, the principles of righteousness embodied in the Decalogue are as immutable as the eternal throne. Not one command has been annulled, not a jot or tittle has been changed. Those principles that were made known to man in Paradise as the great law of life will exist unchanged in Paradise restored. When Eden shall bloom on earth again, God's law of love will be obeyed by all beneath the sun. {MB 50.2}


Blessings,

Green Cochoa.


We can receive of heaven's light only as we are willing to be emptied of self. We can discern the character of God, and accept Christ by faith, only as we consent to the bringing into captivity of every thought to the obedience of Christ. And to all who do this, the Holy Spirit is given without measure. In Christ "dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily. And ye are complete in Him." [Colossians 2:9, 10.] {GW 57.1} -- Ellen White.
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Re: 2nd Quarter 2014 Christ and His Law [Re: dedication] #165847
06/10/14 03:14 AM
06/10/14 03:14 AM
Johann  Offline
SDA
Active Member 2014

Retired Pastor
3000+ Member
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 3,014
Iceland
I was repeating the thoughts of Ellen G White, based on Scripture. Not many people today accept fully Ellen. They replace her with new interpretations by powerful TV speakers and adjust their doctrines accordingly.

Back in the days when we still had the faith which Jesus predicts will almost disappear by the time He returns, my mother held me on her knees as we went through these truths, reading both in the writings of EGW and Scripture.


"Here is a last piece of advice. If you believe in goodness and if you value the approval of God, fix your minds on the things which are holy and right and pure and beautiful and good. Model your conduct on what you have learned from me, on what I have told you and shown you, and you will find the God of peace will be with you."
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