Good points Rosangela, especially the texts from the synoptics. The quote by Ellen White is one I hadn't seen. Very good. I'll look them over.

I may eventually agree with you yet on the Passover sequence but we will likely have to disagree for now on Karaite reckoning as scriptural. I'd appreciate it if you could summarize a response to the points I've presented on that issue.

Actually Rosangela, if you could hold off on answering or summarizing on the Karaite issue, there is more I'd like to post before summarizing things. It would be better to have looked at the Passover sequence in more detail first I think and there may be other issues that surface related to Karaite reckoning as we do that.

For example, the one day variation in the AB calendar does not mean that the prior month had 31 days. It means it also has about a one day variance. The variance is zero in the middle of the eight year cycle but at the beginning of the eight year cycle and at the end it approaches one day until the two adjustment days are inserted at the end of the cycle. In other words at the beginning of the cycle the new moon is close to the conjuntion, about a day before the observed new moon, and at the end it is about a day after the observed new moon.

Rosangela, Alfred Edershsheim holds your view on the crucifixion sequence. I looked again at his reasons in his book, The Temple – Its Ministry and Services, and I followed your suggestion and also read chapter 3 of Juarez’ book and I see I may have been too quick to form a contrary opinion. At this point I am still undecided but in reviewing the statements from Ellen White, I have to agree now that apart from her statements that the sheaf was waved on the second day of Unleavened bread, overall, she strongly favours the Lord’s Supper as being Nisan 14, and not the crucifixion.

As Juarez notes in his book, this conflicts with our position in the SDA Bible Commentary. The commentary holds the crucifixion Friday as Nisan 14, and it also conflicts with Ellen White’s two statements mentioned above. I am undecided, but have to say Juarez makes a good case. I am looking into the timing of the sheaf or omer offering.

Roseangela, in Juarez’ book I noticed that he quotes one of a growing number of scholars who think that Leviticus may be based on the Jubilee Calendar. I am pointing that out because although it seems to me that the Jubilee Calendar is a corruption of the AB Calendar it is closer to the AB Calendar on some points than the Karaite or Rabbinical Calendars. So I agree with the overall trend in the scholarly community to look again at whether some other calendar was not in use in Isreal other than the Rabbinical or Karaite, but I am quite sure it was not the Jubilee Calendar.

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Furthermore, if one accepts that Leviticus is based on the Jubilees Calendar, it would seem more likely that the first sheaf was offered on Sunday (the day after the sabbath) than on Thursday (second day of the feast).

From Page 80 of Juarex’ book quoting G. J. Wenham, The New International Commentary on the Old Testament: The Book ofLeviticus (Grand Rapids, MI: Eerdmans, 1992), p. 304.

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On the same point, Juarez also cites several sources that show the Sadducees of Christ's day did not follow the Rabbinical reckoning regarding the wave sheaf. That would be consistent not only with Karaite reckoning but also could be consistent with the reckoning of the AB Calendar.

If you look at the material from Qumran, you’ll see that in this community the Feast of Unleavened bread was always celebrated on fixed dates, from Sabbath to Sabbath. Perhaps the AB Calendar, while still allowing for the use of a unique lunar calendar to determine some aspects of the feasts it, like the Jubilee Calendar, also used fixed dates for determining the celebration of Unleavened Bread. I am still looking into it.

In any event, I am not ready yet to conclude as you and Juarez have done that Ellen White is simply wrong regarding her two statements about the wave sheaf. I’ve worked with her material long enough to know that, while she is not infallible, she is rarely mistaken on issues like this. I’d encourage you both to take a second look at your position on this point and to share what you find. We need to explore all the options.

Roseangela, there is one other quote from Ellen White that does not harmonize with a late April Passover in 31 AD, which is where we place it now in the Bible commentary. She says somewhere (it is quoted earlier in the thread) that the Passover was celebrated in late March or early April. The date we put the passover at is too late to fall within that range of dates.

Mark,

The only possible Friday connected to Passover in 31 AD is that of April 27 (Julian date). Not accepting that date is disqualifying the year 31 AD as the year for Christ's death.

When you say a 'Friday Passover' you're referring to Thurday afternoon and evening which is the beginning of Friday on the Hebrew calendar right?

What if a different calendar was in use in 31AD that allowed the date of the Passover to be a few days different from the modern Jewish and Karaite calendars? (I posted some of the evidence for this a while back on the thread - not only the Qumran material, but also some information by Eusebius I think, that the Jews of Christ's day used an eight year cycle as found in the AB calendar, not the modern 19 year cycle.) If we use a different calendar the Passover could still be in 31AD but about one month earlier right?

If we put it one month earlier, it will harmonize with the 'late March to early April' statement by Ellen White.

One of the strengths of the AB calendar is it places more emphasis on creating a practical calendar than on alligning the feasts precisely with the astronomical positions of the sun and moon.

Rosangela, I was interested in the Karaite arguments published by Juarez in chapter 3 at page 81 of his book in favour of their method of calculating Penticost.

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We are commanded in Lev 23,16 “Until the morrow after the seventh Sabbath shall you count fifty days”. While the first day of Hag HaMatzot [Unleavened Bread]could theoretically be called a Sabbath, there is no way the 49th day of the Omer could be called a Sabbath, since (according to the Rabbanite theory) this day is neither a holiday nor a Sabbath. This being so, in the Rabbanite reckoning the 50th day of the Omer (=Shavuot) would NOT be on “the morrow after the seventh Sabbath” as commanded in Lev 23,16. Instead it would be on the morrow after the 7th Tuesday, Wednesday, or Thursday or whatever day it happened to fall out after (see chart). The only way for the 49th day of the Omer to be a Sabbath, thereby making the 50th day “the morrow after the Sabbath” as commanded in Lev 23,16, is if the 1st day of the Omer is on a Sunday.

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I agree with this point. But I would say the Karaites do not take their logic far enough. If the omer or sheaf is always waived Sunday of Passover week, and I agree that it is, then scripture seems to also support the idea that the first day of Passover week is not only a day of rest, but is also a seventh-day Sabbath. Have another look at Lev 23 and see if that is not a reasonable and likely meaning. That would mean that it was not mere co-incidence that the Sabbath of the crucifixion was a ‘high day’: It was probably that way year after year.

That would be consistent with a parallel passage in Daniel 9 regarding the weeks of years. Historically, these can be shown to be synchronized with the true sabbatical years so that for example, the last of the 490 years, 34AD, is known to be a sabbatical year. If the seven weeks of this prophecy and the other 63 weeks fit this pattern, the same could be true of the seven literal weeks of penticost and the 'starter week' of Unleavened Bread.

Let’s explore that possibility. This is one of the main advantages of that calendar – most, possibly all, of the holy days fall not only on the same numerical day of the month, they also fall on the same week day, year after year.

In my last post I said that the Karaite position is correct that Penticost must always be a Sunday according to scripture and then noted that this position is in agreement with the AB calendar. I should also point out that if the AB calendar is interpreted so that 30 day months are used to calculate the feast days, (and we have the record of the flood which confirms a 30 day month in Genesis) it would also harmonize with Ellen White’s statements that the wave sheaf was customarily presented on the second day of Unleavened Bread.

Think about this: Ellen White says that the sheaf was presented on the second day of the feast. The only way this statement can harmonize with Lev 23 where it says the 49th day of the omer or sheaf is a Sabbath is if the first day of the feast is also a Sabbath. So we have another evidence that the AB calendar or a calendar like it was used by the ancient Jews from the time of Moses.

Isn’t this a logical conclusion if we accept Ellen White’s statement regarding waving the sheaf the second day and the statement in Lev 23:16? In other words, the only way Ellen White’s statement can be harmonized with Lev 23:16 is for the first day of the feast to always be a seventh-day Sabbath.

I did a calculation and found that what I said in my last post works for the feasts of the seventh month as well. In that series of feasts, using the 30 day month of the AB calendar, the first, 15th and 22nd days are all seventh-day Sabbaths every year.

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23:24 Speak unto the children of Israel, saying, In the seventh month, in the first [day] of the month, shall ye have a sabbath, a memorial of blowing of trumpets, an holy convocation. . . .
23:39 Also in the fifteenth day of the seventh month, when ye have gathered in the fruit of the land, ye shall keep a feast unto the LORD seven days: on the first day [shall be] a sabbath, and on the eighth day [shall be] a sabbath. Lev 23

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