Is the Remnant Church ready to proclaim the 3AM? Most members believe overcoming as Jesus overcame is impossible. How can they share "this gospel" when they believe "another gospel"?

Who has the correct gospel?
Those who believe they HAVE over come at conversion, or those who know they must daily, hourly cling to Jesus, walking with Him in humble obedience knowing that of themselves they will fall.

When the Sunday crises arises, it will be only those secularly anchored in Christ who will stand. Those depending on their own "established" righteousness, and sense of having "all the fruits" will, like Peter deny the Lord they promised they would never deny.

quoting His child
1) Barack Obama is identified as the man that sets up the abomination of desolation: National Sunday laws

Not really -- the text says the beast with lamb like horns (USA) is "saying to them that dwell on the earth, that they should make an image to the beast, which had the wound by a sword, and did live". It doesn't mention any president.
Then he gives power to this "image" so it could speak (laws of enforcement, ultimately having the penalty of death)
Then it speaks of the "mark" needed to buy and sell.

It appears from the text that it will be the people that dwell on the earth that actually set it up, while the government gives it power.



What is that saying?
The RELIGIOUS POWER gains control of the USA government -- the wall separating church and state is broken down, and the CHURCH (represented by the first beast and people of the earth-- apostate protestants) will use the State to accomplish her ends.
And this will be brought about by the SUPPORT of the people.

quoting His child
2) The Mark of the Beast is exactly what it is said to be: compulsory control over buying and selling.

No, that is not the "mark of the beast", the mark of the beast is the beast's sign that it has supposed authority over and above the law of God.
The mark stands in exact opposition to the "seal of God" which is placed in the very center of God's law and bears His name, and authority as Creator of all things.

The mark is compliance to the Sunday law and discarding the true Sabbath.

The restriction on buying and selling will be used to enforce the "mark".




-quote His Child-
3)God's command is DO NOT RECEIVE THE MARK OF THE BEAST IN THE HAND OR FOREHEAD

While I agree that we should not "confederate" with the world, for to do so will make it extremely difficult to refuse the "mark of the beast" yet having a social security number, or a bank account, or any other money transaction device that is part of our system IS NOT THE MARK OF THE BEAST. The mark of the beast is a direct challenge to the commandments of God. -- ie "keep Sunday to bring the nation back to God, rather than obey God's commandment concerning the Sabbath."

quote His child
4) To rationalize that Obama is not the beast or that accepting his monetary controls is not the MARK OF THE BEAST is to believe that it is ok to receive it in the forehead.

This is simply accepting the popular interpretations of those who don't want to see Sunday keeping as the MARK OF THE BEAST.

Firstly, a "beast" is not a president,
A symbolic beast in prophecy represents a nation-- a major political power in the world.
God gave Daniel a dream of four beasts, then an angel tells him the four beasts represent kingdoms.
--The fourth beast shall be the fourth kingdom upon earth-- (7:23) It represents Rome out of which rose the little horn -- the Roman papacy.

This "fourth beast" in it's little horn stage is represented in Rev. 13 as the leopard like beast that carries characteristics of all Daniel 7's beasts for it is the end result of all the beasts of Dan. 7.

The second beast in Rev. 13 represents the USA, and does not have all Daniel seven beasts in it at all.

So I see trying put Daniel 7 beasts into the second beast of Rev. 13 as pure rationalization, not logical biblical interpretation at all.


quote His child
5)An individual that buys into Obama's monetary system can't opt out when it is suddenly linked to Sunday keeping any more than Eve could uneat the forbidden fruit.

Seems to me that anyone who refuses the government money system can't buy or sell anything even today.
Are you saying everyone who isn't using strictly cash already has the "mark"?
Are you basically saying everyone already has the mark of the beast who is buying and selling anything via credit card or electronic money sending methods, so everyone is already lost.

Now I agree we need to be careful how tied in we get in the money situation. Debt, for instance, should be avoided. I would be very leery of any electronic devices put under the skin etc. for indeed it can be used as a leverage to make obedience to God's commandments extremely difficult.

Yet none of those devices are the actual "mark of the beast". With no clear command as to what money situation change is actually the "mark" how would anyone even know what to avoid? It would all be speculation.

But that isn't the case --
It's clear that the mark and the seal concern either defiance of God's LAW, or obedience to God's law --
Worshipping the CREATOR WHO made heaven and earth
or worshipping the beast who thought to change God's time and law.


-quote His Child-
6) When the final confrontation with God's people links the MARK OF THE BEAST (Sunday sacredness with buying and selling), those who bought into the monetary change by rationalizing that it was not the mark of the beast are lost.


Only if they forsake the Sabbath in order to continue buying and selling.

"When the early church became corrupted by departing from the simplicity of the gospel, and accepting heathen rites and customs, she lost the Spirit and power of God; and in order to control the consciences of the people she sought the support of the secular power. The result was the papacy, a church that controlled the power of the State, and employed it to further her own ends, especially for the punishment of “heresy.” In order for the United States to form an image of the beast, the religious power must so control the civil government that the authority of the State will also be employed by the church to accomplish her own ends." {GC88 443.2}

Apostasy in the church (in Protestantism) will prepare the way for the image to the beast (Protestantism acting like papal church).
Today flagrant disregard for morality and God's ways is running rampant in the United States. The churches have lost their spiritual power to do anything about it and are lobbying for government to correct everything.
It is largely due to their hostility to the Seventh-day Sabbath that these churches have taught that God's commandments are nailed to the cross and no longer binding on the Christian. Thus if obedience to the fourth commandment is described by these religious teachers as "frustrating God's grace" and "putting oneself under the curse" the reasoning naturally follows that any decision to obey the rest of the ten is also "frustrating Gods' grace".

Sowing to the wind, reaps a whirlwind, and to stop the whirlwind the churches will take over government.

"Satan will work “with all power and signs and lying wonders, and with all deceivableness of unrighteousness.” And all that “received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved,” will be left to accept “strong delusion, that they should believe a lie.” [2 Thessalonians 2:9-11.] When this state of ungodliness shall be reached, the same results will follow as in the first centuries. {GC88 443.4}

Satan is working BOTH sides of the coin here; signs and wonders as if he were God, and all deceivableness of unrighteousness to create chaos and invoke in people the desire to FORCE a return to "worship" -- only it will be a worship of his counterfeits, not of the true God.
In this he is working to achieve his greatest desire -- to divert the worship due to God to himself.
He is also working to establish a state that is extremely capable to enforce; orchestrating contrasting elements all to one powerful end point.

Protestantism, though retaining its outward forms will unite into one powerful unit in an attempt to counter the spreading lawlessness with it's devastations in the land.

There is right now a very "strong and growing sentiment in favor of a union based upon common points of doctrine. To secure such a union, the discussion of subjects upon which all were not agreed—however important they might be from a Bible standpoint—must necessarily be waived. {GC88 444.1}


“The beast [that is worshipped] mentioned in this message, [Rev. 13] whose worship is enforced by the two-horned beast, [USA] is the first, or leopard-like beast of Revelation 13,—the papacy. The “image to the beast” represents that form of apostate Protestantism which will be developed when the Protestant churches shall seek the aid of the civil power for the enforcement of their dogmas.
"And since it causes all to worship the beast this indicates that the authority of this nation is to be exercised in enforcing some observance which shall be an act of homage to the papacy." GC

The Roman church itself acknowledges that “the observance of Sunday by the Protestants is an homage they pay, in spite of themselves, to the authority of the [Catholic] Church.


"Those who, understanding the claims of the fourth commandment, choose to observe the false instead of the true Sabbath; are thereby paying homage to that power by which alone it is commanded. But in the very act of enforcing a religious duty by secular power, the churches would themselves form an image to the beast; hence the enforcement of Sunday-keeping in the United States would be an enforcement of the worship of the beast and his image. {GC88 448.4}

"As people then reject the institution which God has declared to be the sign of his authority, and honor in its stead that which Rome has chosen as the token of her supremacy, they will thereby accept the sign of allegiance to Rome—“the mark of the beast.” {GC88 449.1}

Ouch. That hurt - especially coming from you.

I'm sorry, I didn't mean it to "hurt" in any personal way. I don't think you are trusting in "self-righteousness".
However, I do believe there are genuinely converted Christians who have not yet been convicted by the Holy Spirit concerning the Sabbath.
They are submitting to the Spirit of the Lord as far as He has led them. I do believe it incorrect to teach that all our unrighteous ways are specifically and fully revealed and repented of at conversion. It does imply that there are no more sins in a converted persons life, left to be repented of, thus engendering a sense of "righteousness" in one's self.

Repentance at conversion is a more general, yet deeply earnest desire to forsake all sin. The Spirit then leads us step by step. The important thing is to have it in the heart and in our commitment to follow.
But that is the subject of another thread.

It is well known that SDA misinterpret scripture. And here is a typical example.

Jesus said, "And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come." (Mat. 24:14)

Well, what is "this gospel of the kingdom"? In Luke 21:31, Jesus said, "So likewise ye, when ye see these things come to pass, know ye that the kingdom of God is nigh at hand." It is obvious then that the gospel of the kingdom is the good news of salvation (of a new heaven and earth to come wherein righteousness dwells) through the sacrifice of Jesus Christ. That is the everlasting gospel to be preached to every nation, kindred tongue and people. Jesus NEVER authorized anyone to prophesy saying, "Sunday laws are coming! Sunday laws are coming!" Instead, the entire body of Christianity is to preach saying, "Jesus Christ is returning! In power and great glory! Repent and believe the good news!"

Paul himself said, "If ye continue in the faith grounded and settled, and be not moved away from the hope of the gospel, which ye have heard, and which was (to be) preached to every creature which is under heaven; whereof I Paul am made a minister." (Col. 1:23)

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When Obama was elected president the Still Small voice spoke to my heart and repeated "For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape." from 1 Thessalonians 5:3 just as He did in the dream He gave me about the wall in Jerusalem before it was built.

http://whentheycrypeaceandsafety.blogspot.com/2011/12/i-dreamed-of-massive-wall.html

But God did not tell me that Obama will be the one in office when Jesus comes back. It is possible and could be that way, but God never said it as such to me.

But we do know that the death decree comes from the mouth of the president.

"I saw that the two-horned beast had a dragon’s mouth, and that his power was in his head, and that the decree would go out of his mouth. Then I saw the Mother of Harlots; that the mother was not the daughters, but separate and distinct from them. She has had her day, and it is past, and her daughters, the Protestant sects, were the next to come on the stage and act out the same mind that the mother had when she persecuted the saints. I saw that as the mother has been declining in power, the daughters had been growing, and soon they will exercise the power once exercised by the mother."{SpM 1.4}

Ten minutes after I heard the voice of God repeat 1 Thessalonians 5:3, President elect Obama then said "to those who would tear the world down: We will defeat you. To those who seek peace and security; We support you." and this was a sign that God was behind sharing those words ten minutes earlier, and it was definitely a clue that God has impressed on my heart to look for the conclusion, but He never said that this president has to be in office for Jesus to come. It could be that President Obama opens the door for the image to the beast and another enforces it. I have not been shown that at all. But look at what is happening in this presidency! No one here should deny that there are huge strides heading for the image to the beast being established!

What God has told me is that we are in the last generation, that Pope Francis is the eighth king of Rev 17 who leads the world to perdition, and that the issue of peace in the middle east is connected to the cry of "peace and safety" which this pope has made very prevalent in his attempts to organize world peace. Everything God has shown me is coming true. I don't know why the election of President Obama would be connected to the "peace and safety" of 1 Thess 5 but it is. It just hasn't been revealed how yet.

There is another man named Jack Darnall who was an Adventist who many people sent his email around years ago saying that he was shown a vision by God that a black president will be in office when Jesus comes back.

Someone in church heard what I was sharing, and mentioned his dream to me after I shared what God told me the day of Obama's election, and it was thrilling. All I could find was this quote online to verify that my friend wasn't making it up.



So I hope those advocating Obama being president when the Mark of the beast is enforced are not basing that solely off my dreams and visions.

When searching for this quote again just now to include it here I was surprised and I had never read that Mr Darnall also believed that Pope Benedict would be the last pope.

Revelation 17 has a funny twist about it that confused me also. When I was speaking to my Friend Michelle Irwin while we were searching for the truth of the seven heads of Rev 17, before I had ever thought anything about this, (still thinking the modern 7 heads theory being kingdoms was true) she said "some people believe the seven kings are the seven last popes" and the Holy Spirit illuminated what she said like gold engraved on my soul by lightning. But the confusing part was the "eighth". I questioned God, "if the seven are the last then how can their be an eighth"? Then He said "the eighth is Satan appearing as an angel of light". That was so clear I will never deny it. But the scripture includes the same seemingly contradictory issue, there are seven kings, then seemingly unattached there is an eighth from "out of" the seven... Unattached (The Jesuit's were unattached then brought back) There is so much information in that confusing point that I will not go into it here. (See http://eighthking.blogspot.com/2011/12/whos-is-anti-christ-eighth-king-of-rev.html for more info) But Mrs White was shown a "stately fair person that the whole world looked up to in reverence" and the angel told her "it is Satan...Appearing as an angel of light" who is leading the world "with lightning speed to Perdition". So there are three parts to that. A stately fair man looked up to in reverence (Pope), appearing as an angel of light, who is Satan. So many prophetic images connect in the eighth king, who by the way the scripture says leads the world to "perdition" just like the stately fair person.

So it appears that Mr Darnall was given the same kind of inspiration that God gave me about this issue. His unfinished comprehension is similar to how God inspired me to the conclusions which were clues to understanding how this all is fulfilled. (Does that make sense to anyone?)

It is possible but not probable that it could all happen in little more than two years. We will see, but please do not look at what God told me to support your theories that it will happen before the next presidential election.

But who knows, maybe the dream of Brother Darnall was accurate, and president Obama becomes a dictator, enforcing the extention of his claim to the office of president under extraordinary circumstances? Could be, but God didn't tell me that.

From the context, that is heaven's interpretation to Daniel as noted from 7:16 "I came near unto one of them that stood by, and asked him the truth of all this. So he told me, and made me know the interpretation of the things."

Heaven's interpretation is specifically for the endtime.





At the beginning of the end time (1798-1844) the 4 sea-beasts in Daniel 7 were the 4-kingdoms (Babylon to Rome) that sealed Daniel's vision with God's authority.

But the seal of God's authority that was understood in the 4th century AD through 1798 is not the meaning that is to be unsealed when Daniel stands in his lot, bearing the testimony which was to be understood at the end of the days.

From Bible study, the sea-beasts were identified as ancient kingdoms. That is truth.



But truth is progressive. We must follow the light of truth as it moves from light to greater light. Daniel 7 begins with sea-beast, but Heaven gives the meaning of the endtime earth-beasts. Sea and earth are different. Revelation 10 makes that clear in the context of the little book of Daniel being opened in 1844 during the great disappointment when the angel has his left foot on the earth and his right foot on the sea.

The sea-beast of Daniel 7:2-3 are not the earth-beast of Daniel 7:17 ( "These great beasts, which are four, are four kings, which shall arise out of the earth.")that heaven is explaining that pertain to the endtime when Daniel is opened. The earth is identified:



Since Heaven is explaining the endtime meaning of Daniel's vision the understanding of Daniel 7:17 the earth kings (American Presidents) can be inserted into the vision to learn the endtime meaning.

The lion president was followed by a bear president then a leopard president and a president with no description except that he had iron teeth. And then Heaven added that he had brass nails: a feature not mentioned in the vision. Thus as ancient Rome was in two phases (pagan and papal) the forth American President is in two phases: 2 men.



The horn is a pope. The beast that is slain is the last American President that is destroyed by the burning flames. Christ's Second Coming will be as a consuming fire to the wicked.



The rest of the beasts are the three American Presidents (the lion, bear, and leopard) that were before the 4th. They had their dominion taken away but they were alive for a season and a time. A prophetic year has 360-days. A season is 1/4 of a year or 90-days. A day is a year in Bible prophecy = 90-days. And a time is already a year = total 91-years.

There is no beginning or end date indicated in this portion of Daniel that is opened in the endtime. But we are told that by their fulfillment, Daniel and Revelation will explain themselves.

President Reagan was 90-years old 2/6/01. Thus in his 91st year 9/11/01 devastated the US. In Reagan's 91st year, he was out of office, as were Bush I, and Clinton. And ALL three of them were alive. The 91-years, 3 of them alive, and out of office fits the prophecy. It also establishes Pope John-Paul II as the only pope that they knew while they were in office thus he had to be the horn speaking great things.

Revelation explains Daniel. The lion, bear and leopard features of Daniel 7 are seen in Revelation 13. in the context:



John-Paul II almost died from a would-be assassination in 1981. He was healed and he bonded with Reagan, Bush I, and Clinton.



The date established in Daniel 7:11 when the season and time ended is 9/11/01. Sept is almost gone so counting 42-months:
____Oct, Nov, Dec. 2001 = 3
________________2002 = 12
________________2003 = 12
________________2004 = 12
____Jan, Feb, Mar. 2005 = 3
______________________42



you can read the entire passage, but 13:4-5 are clearly linked to John-Paul II.



What pope was like J-P II? Communism fell at his bidding without firing a shot. And he lived 42- months after 9/11/01.

As Daniel is standing in his lot today and Daniel and Revelation are explaining themselves, the first beast in Revelation 13 is the post 1929 papacy. It looks like Reagan, Bush I, and Clinton as they bonded with John-Paul II.

The 7 heads are the solo popes from 1929 when Mussolini restored the kingdom to Pius XI (Pius XI & XII, John XXIII, Paul VI,John-Paul I & II, and Benedict XVI). The crowned horns that bonded with these popes are the American Presidents from Truman who rained fire from the sky on Japan in WWII to Clinton who bonded with the popes by having meetings with them. The crowns indicate that they were in office. Truman did not meet with Pius XII until he left office in 1950, but the Jesuits claim to have put him in office and every American President after Truman met with one or more of these popes.



Light moves to greater light. Those that do not follow it will be left in darkness when it moves away from them as sure as were the Jews in Christ's day who failed to see Him as the fulfillment of prophecy.

If you don't see Obama as the last President, you cannot understand how the papal beast transitions to the earth beast with the 2 horns in Revelation 13. A horn is a king cf Daniel 8:20-21.

When the first beast with 10 horns (Truman to Clinton) transitions to the last beast that is to wage war against God's people (America) its two horns are Bush II and Obama.

The image-beast looks like the current papacy: they both have a retire leader (Benedict & GW) and a sitting leader (Francis & Obama). The only thing that remains for the image-beast to complete its formation is the national Sunday Law.

[I understand that it will come from the people though I did not spell out all of the details in my earlier post.]

I can only tell you what I know from Bible study. It is up to you to study to show yourself approved of God a workwoman that will not be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.

I could do the same with every objection that you raised to my original post. But this reply on 1 point is so long, I'll not attempt to go into detail on all of the points covered. I can recommend a great book on the subject that goes over this material step by step. And if you get your copy before it goes to press, you may make it more accurate and complete with your keen understanding of Bible history and prophecy.

It was the devil who was whispering in your ears. To show it, consider that you have not spoken the truth at all. Obama is a white President. His mother is 100% Caucasian. Don't you know even that?

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