The facts are:
1) there are 42 literal full months from 9/11/01 to 4/2/05.
2) There were 1260-days from 9/11/01 to 2/22/05 in which Pope John-Paul II was heading both church and state. After 2/22/05 Pope John-Paul II was in the dying process.



From the word of God, my witness is that the endtime meaning of Daniel and Revelation relating to Pope John-Paul II have been fulfilled. They have explained themselves. This is Truth which every one should understand but in spite of prophecy being fulfilled, Christ's Advent will come as an overwhelming surprise to the world and many in the church who claim to be waiting for Him.

And now that the prophecy has been fulfilled, the 42-months of revelation 13:5 were fulfilled as 42 + 2 months to the very day on the Hebrew calendar. Since that is how it happened, that is how Daniel and Revelation have explained themselves.

Is God arbitrary in His reckoning of time?

How many months are in a year? Is it a solar year or a lunar year (some have 12 and some have 13)?

"But my covenant will I establish with Isaac, which Sarah shall bear unto thee at this set time in the next year" (Genesis 17:21) Was Sarah's pregnancy 12 months instead of the customary 9? That is not indicated to be the case in the text.

The answer is not arbitrary, it is understanding the context of the statement instead of fitting the statement into our understanding.




That conclusion can only be reached when all the facts are not known or considered. Daniel 7 clearly identifies 9/11/01 in the context of Reagan, Bush 1, and Clinton being alive and out of office on that date. And Pope John-Paul II being the little horn that charmed them with his charisma while he spoke great things and blasphemes.

When Daniel and Revelation are prayerfully studied and compared to prophecy fulfilled, there is nothing arbitrary about it.



What Scripture states that the 1260-days has to be the 42-months exactly? Because we know 30-days hath a month and 42 x 30 = 1260, we have a formula for explaining bible prophecy fulfilled in the past. 42-literal months have sufficient time to cover 1260-days. They can start on the same day and end on different days.

Bible study is not one size fits all. Scripture explains Scripture and context is important.

No, which makes finagling the numbers suspect.

The text is not talking about the length of time of the pregnancy. What the text said was true. I would not even think that this text applies to the length of a pregnancy...

Yes, 30 days/month, works. You have a problem with JP-2 as it was 1299 days, not 1260, unless you want to finagle the data to attempt to make it work.

And that's clear to whom?

Let's see...

But why do you say about this and that rather than what the scripture says?

Well, er, 13:3 does. Agreed.

Well, er, no.
No she doesn't.

She says: " We looked upon the bust of Pius VI. The marble statue beneath the bust contained the heart of the pope. This is the pope specified in prophecy, which received the deadly wound."

She's clearly saying that Pius VI was pope of the kingdom when it received the deadly wound.

Does use the English term, "head". But not quite the same as Daniel does.

Da 2:37 "You, O king, are a king of kings. For the God of heaven has given you a kingdom, power, strength, and glory;
Da 2:38 "and wherever the children of men dwell, or the beasts of the field and the birds of the heaven, He has given them into your hand, and has made you ruler over them all-you are this head of gold.
Da 2:39 "But after you shall arise another kingdom inferior to yours; then another, a third kingdom of bronze, which shall rule over all the earth.


Only if you reject the kingdom sequence of Babylon, Medo-Persia, Greece, Rome can you say that Nebuchadnezzar specifically and individually was the head of gold rather than his kingdom.

The Bible is clear. Ellen White is clear.

And that you have done.

By using fuzzy math, and fuzzy logic, you add confusion and a "thus saith me" to scripture.

I believe it is the kind of attitude expressed here that several have been objecting to. No matter what is pointed out or what happens, you say everything fits perfectly. And that is what several are suspecting when Obama leaves office. You will say, it's all predicted and fits perfectly. Math doesn't matter, facts don't matter. Kind of reminds me of the global warmists. If it's record warm, it's global warming. If it's record cold, it's global warming. If there are more hurricanes, it's global warming. If there are hardly any hurricanes, it's global warming, etc., etc.

If Ratzinger is pope, he's the last pope.
If Francis is pope, he's the last pope.
If Bush is president, he's the last president.
If Obama is president, he's the last president.
If the math doesn't come out, it's close enough.

But if Obama's term is up and we have the next president, nothing has changed, it's business as usual and he's the last president. It's all in scripture and completely clear to yourself. No need to question it because it is self-explanatory.

Remove the aside explaining "The marble statue beneath the bust contained the heart of the pope."

This is what she said: "We looked upon the bust of Pius VI... This is the pope specified in prophecy, which received the deadly wound."

There is no mention of KINGDOM. But you are reading it as if it is saying "that Pius VI was pope of the kingdom when it received the deadly wound."

That is sufficient to answer Jesus' question, "How readest thou?" That is between you and the Holy Spirit.

That is clearly not how I read it. And based on my reading, the Holy Spirit enlightened me to the fact that Pope Benedict would not be pope after the Spring of 2013. He left office 28 Feb 2013, which aligns my reading with the prophecy.



I must agree that as Moses appointed the "rulers" heads over the people: God used a symbolic "head" to depict Nebuchadnezzar as the ruler over them.



The word kingdom that you cite here is not kingdom anywhere else in the Bible. In fact the same word kingdom when it appears in Daniel 5:20 is kingly, 6:3 realm, 6:28 reign.

So since the translators believed that the prophecy was fulfilled when the 1612 KJV was translated (230-years before Daniel was opened and unsealed) you apparently believe that they were correct in their translation.

They could have translated Da 2:39 "But after you shall arise another reign inferior to yours; then another, a third reign of bronze, which shall rule over all the earth.[/i]

That would have been more consistent with Da 2:44 "And in the days of these kings shall the God of heaven set up a kingdom <04437>, which shall never be destroyed: and the kingdom <04437> shall not be left to other people, but it shall break in pieces and consume all these kingdoms <04437>, and it shall stand for ever."

When the facts are studied carefully: the translators are making Daniel speak of kingdoms (rather than the reigns of kings which harmonizes with the word Daniel actually wrote), and when Daniel concludes the matter; he clearly states in the days of these kings (not in the days of these kingdoms).

And when Heaven explains Daniel 7 that is an expanded view of Daniel 2, Heaven interprets the vision: Da 7:17 "These great beasts, which are four, are four kings, which shall arise out of the earth." Heaven does not say that they are 4 kingdoms as did the translators.

The kingdom view sealed the authenticity of Daniel's visions, but they are not the meaning that was sealed, closed, and shut up until the time of the end (cf Da 12:4 & 9)



Nonsense: An assumption.

I believe that the 4-kingdoms sealed the validity of Daniel's prophecy as being inspired of God as the Present Truth in past ages. But that meaning was not closed until the endtime. It was was understood in the 4 century A. D., by Luther in the 1500's, and Newton in the 1600's long before Daniel was unsealed and opened. Thus to confuse the seal of authenticity that God placed on Daniel's prophecy with the meaning that was sealed until the the time of the end is confusion: it is not of God.

The Bible is clear. Ellen White is clear that more light will come before Christ comes, but not all will find it or follow it.

Did she or anyone identify this before the fact?

Yes, she did. And what is to be the final message to the world? That we know who the last president is or who the last pope is? Nope. See Christ's Object Lessons page 415 for the real last message to the world. And I have not heard you speak of this at all. Why?

That's not true. The Book of Daniel was accessible and understood by the first century readers. Jesus said so (Mat. 24:15). The fall of Jerusalem was the the time of the end for the people of Daniel, i.e. the Jews. Heb. 1:1 says so. "God, who at various times and in various ways spoke in time past to the fathers by the prophets, has in these last days spoken to us by His Son ...."

Again I say, and again I repeat: SDA, having buried their heads in the sand of false prophecy, are unable to see the light of truth. They cannot, though it be noon above; neither do they have any understanding of the things to befall them.

///

I'm sorry. I must not have made myself clear as evidenced by your response.

I believe as you stated: "The Book of Daniel was accessible and understood by the first century readers." Yes and it was understood in the 4th century and by Luther (1500's) and by Newton in the 1600's. All of those folks understood Daniel. But Daniel was sealed with these words:

"But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book, even to the time of the end: many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased." (Daniel 12:4).

And these words:

" And he said, Go thy way, Daniel: for the words are closed up and sealed till the time of the end." (Daniel 12:9)

"The Book of Daniel was accessible and understood by the first century readers." But was their understanding the understanding that was "closed up and sealed till the time of the end"?
Was their understanding the understanding that was
"shut up...and seal[ed]...even to the time of the end: many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased?



That is all true. I believe it. But in those "last days" were "many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased"?

From Abraham to the days of Christ and His Disciples, did they run to and fro any differently than in Daniel's day? How do those days compare with the mid-1800's when the steam engine was put into use on trains and boats?

And there is even a bigger difference from how "many ran to and fro" in the mid-1800's and how we do it today.

And the promise that sealed Daniel: "many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased" is being realized today more than in any other time in history because we are running to and fro more than ever before and knowledge is being increased now faster than in any other time.

So when the promise is fulfilled "many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased" the book of Daniel is unsealed. Thus those having access to the book of Daniel in past ages (before the time specified for it to be unsealed) cannot be as knowledgeable of its endtime meaning as those who live when its meaning is unsealed and knowledge is increased.



Beware not to paint your canvas with to wide a brush. Lest the fine details get missed.

Even Jesus warned us: John 7:24 "Judge not according to the appearance, but judge righteous judgment."

Is your point that EGW recognized Bible prophecy when it was fulfilled?











So when the word of God declares that President Obama is the man who will be leading America when it enforces the mark of the beast and forms the "image to the beast;" why would you not want to know that? Why would you not want to give that warning to others with your means and influence? Why would you rise up against learning everything that God has revealed about endtime events to prepare for the last conflict? We must beware how we treat the light.