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Re: What does God require before we are baptized?
#16932
02/11/06 08:29 PM
02/11/06 08:29 PM
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Dedicated Member
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Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 1,196
Ontario
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On the previous page Will asked: quote:
What is the difference between John the Baptist's baptism's, and the baptism's of the disciples of Jesus Christ, including the Apostle Paul?
I understand them to be 1 and the same, but its not, and I am having difficulty in figuring that out.
There is a difference between the baptism of John and the baptism of Jesus.
The baptism of John is the repentance from what "we know" to be evil and a turning away from it and doing that which "we know" to be good.
Luk 16:11 If therefore ye have not been faithful in the unrighteous mammon, who will commit to your trust the true riches?
The baptism of Jesus is the repentance and turning away from “our righteousness” (that which we understand and hold as good) to “Christ’s righteousness” (that which is good in his eyes).
The first (baptism of John) is the preparation for the second (baptism of Christ).
So we come to the true riches.
P.S. Hi everyone, I have been away a while.
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Re: What does God require before we are baptized?
#16933
02/12/06 01:35 AM
02/12/06 01:35 AM
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Active Member 2012
14500+ Member
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Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 14,795
Lawrence, Kansas
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We noticed you were gone. Glad you're back!
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Re: What does God require before we are baptized?
#16934
02/15/06 02:43 PM
02/15/06 02:43 PM
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OP
SDA
Charter Member
Active Member 2019
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Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 22,256
Southwest USA
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John, are you suggesting we need to get baptized twice - once according to John and once according to Jesus?
What about what Jesus said - baptized by water and by the Spirit?
Also, what about sins of ignorance? Can someone be baptized by the Spirit before they quit cheating on their spouse, for example? What constitutes a sin of ignorance?
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Re: What does God require before we are baptized?
#16935
02/15/06 04:17 PM
02/15/06 04:17 PM
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Active Member 2012
14500+ Member
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Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 14,795
Lawrence, Kansas
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"Baptism" simple means "immersed." To be baptized by the Spirit is to be immersed by the Spirit. The Spirit is given to those who obey God (is that Acts 5:32? probably not, but i'm too lazy too look), so that would prohibit being baptized by the Spirit while cheating on one's spouse.
A sin of ignorance is a sin one commits without knowing one is doing something wrong. It also presupposes that one is not willingly avoiding light which would illuminate the ignorance.
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Re: What does God require before we are baptized?
#16936
02/15/06 04:51 PM
02/15/06 04:51 PM
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OP
SDA
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Posts: 22,256
Southwest USA
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quote:
It also presupposes that one is not willingly avoiding light which would illuminate the ignorance.
Excellent point!
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Re: What does God require before we are baptized?
#16937
02/15/06 04:55 PM
02/15/06 04:55 PM
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OP
SDA
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quote:
A sin of ignorance is a sin one commits without knowing one is doing something wrong.
If a person is properly prepared for baptism into the SDA church, according to the commandment of Jesus and the inspired counsel of Sister White, what would constitute a sin of ignorance? What would not be pointed out before baptism?
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Re: What does God require before we are baptized?
#16938
02/15/06 05:50 PM
02/15/06 05:50 PM
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Active Member 2012
14500+ Member
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Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 14,795
Lawrence, Kansas
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Your question reminds me of a story. A Brazilian boy who was hastily being prepared for baptism was told he could not "take coffee," which, in addition to meaning not have coffer is also the Brazilian way of saying "have breakfast." So he asked, "Can I eat lunch?" No preparation for baptism could cover every possible sin which could come up. Any sin which a person would become aware of after being baptized would be an example. If you want a specific example, here's one: quote:
The Saviour longs to give us a greater blessing than we ask; and He delays the answer to our request that He may show us the evil of our own hearts, and our deep need of His grace. He desires us to renounce the selfishness that leads us to seek Him. (DA 200)
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Re: What does God require before we are baptized?
#16939
02/16/06 02:10 AM
02/16/06 02:10 AM
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Dedicated Member
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Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 1,196
Ontario
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quote:
A sin of ignorance
We can really get wound up on this; the truth is that it is a sin to insinuate sins of ignorance.
The scripture says whatsoever is not of faith is sin;
And, not whatsoever is not of perfect knowledge is sin.
Where there is faith, there is trust and peace, growth, learning and life.
Where there is doubt, there is insinuation and fear; there is an effort to find fault, resulting in destruction and death.
Shalom
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Re: What does God require before we are baptized?
#16940
02/16/06 02:36 AM
02/16/06 02:36 AM
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Dedicated Member
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Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 1,196
Ontario
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quote:
are you suggesting we need to get baptized twice - once according to John and once according to Jesus?
I do not know if three times will do. ![[Frown]](images/icons/frown.gif)
What is important is to see and understand the meaning and why. The mission and purpose of John was clearly stated both in Prophecy and by John.
Mat 3:3 For this is he that was spoken of by the prophet Esaias, saying, The voice of one crying in the wilderness, Prepare ye the way of the Lord, make his paths straight.
When they asked him what they should do; he told them nothing new but what they did not already know. He told them to stop doing what they knew was wrong and to do what they know is right. That is how the way is prepared and path made straight.
So it is that when one is true to conscience that the Lord can present new truth which can be received unto life. But if one shall not be true to that which they already know what use is there to give more knowledge. It only increases damnation.
If the baptism that one had was of the meaning of John the Baptists baptism (regardless of the phraseology of baptism) then yes, one needs to be baptized into Christ if one is ready and willing to die to self and receive His life. If not, don’t bother, it won’t work.
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Re: What does God require before we are baptized?
#16941
02/16/06 02:45 AM
02/16/06 02:45 AM
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Dedicated Member
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Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 1,196
Ontario
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Here is where many err.
By not repenting and turning away from what they know to be wrong, people hope to be saved by being baptized unto Christ, to make up for their shortcomings.
John had some comments for these:
Luk 3:7 Then said he to the multitude that came forth to be baptized of him, O generation of vipers, who hath warned you to flee from the wrath to come?
Luk 3:8 Bring forth therefore fruits worthy of repentance, …
Luk 3:9 And now also the axe is laid unto the root of the trees: every tree therefore which bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire.
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