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Re: Jesus denied self just like a born-again believer.
[Re: Mountain Man]
#169624
11/06/14 12:45 AM
11/06/14 12:45 AM
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SDA Active Member 2020
5500+ Member
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Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 6,368
Western, USA
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Sinful flesh tempts us from within because that's how it works. Sinless flesh will encourage us to do right because that's how it will work. Jesus designed things that way. Are you telling me that Jesus designed SINFUL flesh????
Oh, that men might open their minds to know God as he is revealed in his Son! {ST, January 20, 1890}
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Re: Jesus denied self just like a born-again believer.
[Re: Mountain Man]
#169634
11/06/14 12:44 PM
11/06/14 12:44 PM
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OP
SDA Charter Member Active Member 2019
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Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 22,256
Southwest USA
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He created us in a way that made sinful flesh possible. Sinless flesh and sinful flesh serve the same function - to encourage us to make lifestyle choices. Sinful flesh, as you know, is the result of the fall of A&E.
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Re: Jesus denied self just like a born-again believer.
[Re: Mountain Man]
#169636
11/06/14 12:53 PM
11/06/14 12:53 PM
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SDA Active Member 2020
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Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 6,368
Western, USA
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He created us in a way that made sinful flesh possible. Sinless flesh and sinful flesh serve the same function - to encourage us to make lifestyle choices. Sinful flesh, as you know, is the result of the fall of A&E. OK - then is sinful flesh something that is real and physical? If so, what is in it that tempts us? If not, what then is it?
Oh, that men might open their minds to know God as he is revealed in his Son! {ST, January 20, 1890}
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Re: Jesus denied self just like a born-again believer.
[Re: Mountain Man]
#169646
11/06/14 02:21 PM
11/06/14 02:21 PM
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OP
SDA Charter Member Active Member 2019
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Posts: 22,256
Southwest USA
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You can ask similar questions about the mind, the conscience, the spirit, and the character. We may not be able to perfectly explain how and why certain aspects of human nature work the way they do. But we can know from experience sinful flesh is that part of our human nature that tempts us from within to act out our innocent and legitimate appetites and passions in sinful ways. We can also know by experience, thank you Jesus, that partaking of the divine nature empowers us to resist the unholy clamorings of sinful flesh and to grow in grace daily maturing in the fruits of the Spirit.
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Re: Jesus denied self just like a born-again believer.
[Re: Mountain Man]
#169647
11/06/14 02:22 PM
11/06/14 02:22 PM
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OP
SDA Charter Member Active Member 2019
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The lower passions have their seat in the body and work through it. The words "flesh" or "fleshly" or "carnal lusts" embrace the lower, corrupt nature; the flesh of itself cannot act contrary to the will of God. We are commanded to crucify the flesh, with the affections and lusts. How shall we do it? Shall we inflict pain on the body? No; but put to death the temptation to sin. The corrupt thought is to be expelled. Every thought is to be brought into captivity to Jesus Christ. All animal propensities are to be subjected to the higher powers of the soul. The love of God must reign supreme; Christ must occupy an undivided throne. Our bodies are to be regarded as His purchased possession. The members of the body are to become the instruments of righteousness. {AH 127.2}
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Re: Jesus denied self just like a born-again believer.
[Re: Mountain Man]
#169652
11/06/14 04:18 PM
11/06/14 04:18 PM
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SDA Active Member 2020
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Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 6,368
Western, USA
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AMEN to EGW's quotation.
I agree, we may not be able to fully explain a lot about us, but that does not mean we no nothing. We know that if we use certain substances, such as alcohol, some temptations can become nearly impossible to resist. This is a real and physical process. We have real neurotransmitters and real neuroreceptors in the brain which can tempt us. It is real and physical, and alcohol can destroy our will to resist temptations. Sinful flesh is flesh (flesh is real and physical) that has been changed from the original. Changed by what? SIN. Can we know what sin it? I say YES.
Oh, that men might open their minds to know God as he is revealed in his Son! {ST, January 20, 1890}
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Re: Jesus denied self just like a born-again believer.
[Re: Mountain Man]
#169660
11/06/14 10:14 PM
11/06/14 10:14 PM
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OP
SDA Charter Member Active Member 2019
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Posts: 22,256
Southwest USA
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We are born with the clamorings, promptings, affections, lusts of sinful flesh. We nurture, strengthen it as we act out its unholy promptings. The results are physical in that grey matter is physically altered. However, just like character is not a physical organ, so too, sinful flesh is not a physical organ.
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Re: Jesus denied self just like a born-again believer.
[Re: Mountain Man]
#169674
11/07/14 04:53 AM
11/07/14 04:53 AM
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SDA Active Member 2020
5500+ Member
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Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 6,368
Western, USA
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sinful flesh is not a physical organ. Then WHAT is it????
Oh, that men might open their minds to know God as he is revealed in his Son! {ST, January 20, 1890}
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Re: Jesus denied self just like a born-again believer.
[Re: Mountain Man]
#169678
11/07/14 01:25 PM
11/07/14 01:25 PM
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OP
SDA Charter Member Active Member 2019
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Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 22,256
Southwest USA
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It is like any other function of the brain - mind, character, personalty, etc. None of these attributes of the brain are physical organs. They are part of the essence of being human. A surgeon cannot surgically remove them like they can an organ. They can, however, alter them by destroying related parts in the grey matter. Again, sinful flesh is that part of the essence of human nature that tempts us from within to indulge innocent and legitimate needs in sinful ways.
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Re: Jesus denied self just like a born-again believer.
[Re: Mountain Man]
#169685
11/07/14 02:26 PM
11/07/14 02:26 PM
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OP
SDA Charter Member Active Member 2019
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Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 22,256
Southwest USA
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A: If not for Christ's covering grace, our past sins would kill us today.
M: True. If Jesus was not the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world Adam and Eve would have perished and none of us would have been born. Jesus cannot cover unpardoned sins or willful sinning. Jesus does not have to cover the clamouring of sinful flesh.
A: I could agree with that if I believed that sinful flesh did not clamor for sinful things. But I don't. Sinful flesh is not a sentient being. It does not have a conscience. It cannot form character. It cannot sin. It does not need a Saviour. It will not be judged. It can only tempt us from within to be unlike Jesus. It is not a sin to be tempted. Which is how and why Jesus possessed the likeness of sinful flesh.
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