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Re: Identifying the Kings of the North and South - Daniel 11
[Re: Johann]
#174593
06/24/15 03:32 PM
06/24/15 03:32 PM
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We do not see the papacy as the great enemy now because the Muslim powers are doing the killing. A former pope predicted the unification of the muslims with the papacy in the future. If you mean not now but in the future, I would agree. But who does the actual killing doesn't mean someone else isn't the enemy.
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Re: Identifying the Kings of the North and South - Daniel 11
[Re: kland]
#174594
06/24/15 03:32 PM
06/24/15 03:32 PM
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[fearfulness about proclaiming what the word of God means before it happens]
Could you show where in the Bible it says the Supreme Court of the U.S. declares independence from God in June 2015? When a nation fills its cup to overflowing with rebellion against God, judgment follows (see my previous post). My prophetic discernment understands that when the Supreme Court legislates gay marriage as the law of the entire United States, the court will have placed an abomination that makes desolate (because it destroys its adherents) above the law of God. Thus God will remove His divine protection from the US. From studying Daniel 11:43 "But he shall have power over the treasures of gold and of silver, and over all the precious things of Egypt: and the Libyans and the Ethiopians shall be at his steps" I have seen that fulfilled in the 2011 Arab Spring. Egypt jailed its dictator. Libya killed theirs. And the one in Ethiopia died of natural causes: in that very sequence. Then tidings out of the east (Syria & ISIL) and out of the North (Russia and the Ukraine) have trouble Obama. (Dan 11:44) I further understand that Daniel's narration of 11:30-39 is chronological. And 11:40-44 (& maybe 45) is a caveat that explains the details that Daniel skipped over in the narration. After Daniel narrated he explains what led up to Daniel 11:30. Thus the ships from Chittim (Iran, king of the South) are about to move against the King of the North (Obama) and Obama will move against the COVENANT (America's Constitution) and God's Covenant (ten commandments). That would mean Sunday Law!
"All the members of the church, if they are sons and daughters of God, will have to undergo a process of discipline before they can be lights in the world. God will not make men and women channels of light while they are in darkness and are content to remain so, making no special efforts to connect with the Source of light. Those who feel their own need, and arouse themselves to the deepest thought and the most earnest, persevering prayer and action, will receive divine aid. There is much for each to unlearn with respect to himself, as well as much to learn. Old habits and customs must be shaken off, and it is only by earnest struggles to correct these errors, and a full reception of the truth in carrying out its principles, by the grace of God, that the victory can be gained." {4T 485.3}
But as I read it President Obama is now the King of the North and Iran is the king of the south. So how does that fit with the postulation "Babylon is the king of the north"? You're asking dedication how your chosen specific interpretation fits in with her general interpretation? I presented light as I see it. and as we get closer to Christ's Advent, Daniel and Revelation are explaining themselves. Light is being seen for what it is LIGHT! She can compare the light with what she teaches and everyone can decide for themselves what is light and what is darkness. My current views are in the book America, The Obama Nation. You can get the e-book ($10) or the paperback ($15). Send me a private message if you want either. I won't be rewriting the material on the web it just takes too much time.
"Ignorance is sin, when knowledge can be obtained" (HR, September 1, 1866 par. 3). www.loudcry101.com
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Re: Identifying the Kings of the North and South - Daniel 11
[Re: Alchemy]
#174595
06/24/15 03:41 PM
06/24/15 03:41 PM
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My point has always been that Babylon is the king of the north. And that Babylon, or the king of the north, has morphed so-to-speak with different countries at different times in history. But that, Babylon was established as the king of the north ... The question then follows who is Babylon? The woman riding the beast in Rev 17 or the beast itself But as I read it President Obama is now the King of the North and Iran is the king of the south. So how does that fit with the postulation "Babylon is the king of the north"? Blessings His child, Babylon is made up of the papacy, apostate protestantism and spiritualism. The woman in Revelation 17 has the name written on her forehead, and can not be on her hand, "Mystery, Babylon the Great". According to the Great Controversy, the woman in Revelation 17 is apostate Protestantism and the beast is the papacy. Thus the name on the woman's forehead in Rev 17 is the mark of the beast. The Mark of the beast upon which she is riding. The beast and the papacy cannot be the woman, because Catholicism cannot be both the woman and the beast.
"Ignorance is sin, when knowledge can be obtained" (HR, September 1, 1866 par. 3). www.loudcry101.com
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Re: Identifying the Kings of the North and South - Daniel 11
[Re: His child]
#174609
06/25/15 05:25 AM
06/25/15 05:25 AM
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As to your question -- who is Babylon of Rev. 17? ...
The picture in Revelation 17 shows that religion (the woman which represents both Catholicism and apostate Protestantism) unite to revive the old papal supremacy politically enforced system.
...
Then who is the beast in Revelation 17? If the papal beast in Revelation 13 is being expanded and explained in rev 17, then how can the woman be Catholicism? The "expansion" shows what the situation looks like in the end. In Revelation 13 it was clearly Papal Rome in political and ecclesiastical power. But it received a deadly wound. It wasn't the religious side that received the deadly wound, but the political power to enforce with armies and civil laws that was severed. In the end things won't be so clear. There will be the RELIGIOUS UNION (the woman -- the unfaithful Christian comprised of Catholism and apostate Protestantism) That part will seem very religious and be very DECEPTIVE with all its "bringing peace to the world" "love" "back to God" "standing together against terror" etc. talk. But underneath it will be the beast -- the tyrannical power of papal supremacy using national governments and armies to enforce it's agenda.
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Re: Identifying the Kings of the North and South - Daniel 11
[Re: His child]
#174610
06/25/15 06:14 AM
06/25/15 06:14 AM
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According to the Great Controversy, the woman in Revelation 17 is apostate Protestantism and the beast is the papacy. Thus the name on the woman's forehead in Rev 17 is the mark of the beast. The Mark of the beast upon which she is riding. The beast and the papacy cannot be the woman, because Catholicism cannot be both the woman and the beast.
EGW does not divide it so neatly In these paragraphs Babylon is comprised of both Roman Catholicism and apostate Protestantism. Look at this statement: The woman, Babylon, of Revelation 17, is described as “arrayed in purple and scarlet color, and decked with gold and precious stones and pearls, having a golden cup in her hand full of abominations and filthiness. . . . And upon her forehead was a name written, Mystery, Babylon the Great, the mother of harlots.” Says the prophet, “I saw the woman drunken with the blood of the saints, and with the blood of the martyrs of Jesus.” [Revelation 17:4-6.] Babylon is further declared to be “that great city, which reigneth over the kings of the earth.” [Revelation 17:18.] The power that for so many centuries maintained despotic sway over the monarchs of Christendom, is Rome. The purple and scarlet color, the gold and precious stones and pearls, vividly picture the magnificence and more than kingly pomp affected by the haughty see of Rome. And no other power could be so truly declared “drunken with the blood of the saints” as that church which has so cruelly persecuted the followers of Christ. 88GC 382
Babylon is said to be “the mother of harlots.” By her daughters must be symbolized churches that cling to her doctrines and traditions....Many of the Protestant churches are following Rome's example of iniquitous connection with “the kings of the earth;” the State churches, by their relation to secular governments, and other denominations by seeking the favor of the world. And the term Babylon—confusion—may be appropriately applied to these bodies, (88GC 383) You see-- it is the uniting of religions that resurrect the beast that received the deadly wound, bringing again the force of the nations' political armies to implement religious agendas. Let the principle once be established in the United States, that the church may employ or control the power of the State; that religious observances may be enforced by secular laws; in short, that the authority of church and State is to dominate the conscience, and the triumph of Rome in this country is assured. {GC88 580.3}
God's Word has given warning of the impending danger; let this be unheeded, and the Protestant world will learn what the purposes of Rome really are, only when it is too late to escape the snare. She is silently growing into power.
Why is this important? The danger is NOT in governments uniting to stop the Muslim fanatics from killing people -- that is the work governments should do. What we are seeing is RELIGIONS uniting under the papal head to lead in "restoring peace" using government armies. It's when religions employ or control the power of the State.... Just like the prophecy predicted.
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Re: Identifying the Kings of the North and South - Daniel 11
[Re: Charity]
#174622
06/25/15 05:30 PM
06/25/15 05:30 PM
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When does the time of trouble begin? AFTER the King of the North has come to his end.
Daniel 11:45 And he shall plant the tabernacles of his palace between the seas in the glorious holy mountain; yet he shall come to his end, and none shall help him.
Daniel 12:1 And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which stands for the children of your people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time your people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book.
What do we look for which will be a guidepost as to what it happening in the Heavenly Sanctuary?
Oh, that men might open their minds to know God as he is revealed in his Son! {ST, January 20, 1890}
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Re: Identifying the Kings of the North and South - Daniel 11
[Re: Charity]
#174628
06/25/15 08:55 PM
06/25/15 08:55 PM
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APL, you need to show that "shall come to his end" can mean "came to his end".
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Re: Identifying the Kings of the North and South - Daniel 11
[Re: His child]
#174630
06/25/15 09:03 PM
06/25/15 09:03 PM
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[fearfulness about proclaiming what the word of God means before it happens]
Could you show where in the Bible it says the Supreme Court of the U.S. declares independence from God in June 2015? When a nation fills its cup to overflowing with rebellion against God, judgment follows (see my previous post). So what you're really saying is you made up the part about [fearfulness about proclaiming what the word of God means before it happens] to mean something in June 2015.
My prophetic discernment understands that when the Supreme Court legislates gay marriage as the law of the entire United States, the court will have placed an abomination that makes desolate (because it destroys its adherents) above the law of God. Thus God will remove His divine protection from the US.
And it sounds like you are saying the current vote which you already knew about, you are meaning that to be "U.S. declares independence from God in June 2015". Of course you could say, "California Set to Mandate Childhood Vaccines Amid Intense Fight", shows U.S. declaring independence from God in June 2015". Or any other news article.....
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Re: Identifying the Kings of the North and South - Daniel 11
[Re: kland]
#174631
06/25/15 11:06 PM
06/25/15 11:06 PM
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APL, you need to show that "shall come to his end" can mean "came to his end".
What does "at that time" refer to?
Oh, that men might open their minds to know God as he is revealed in his Son! {ST, January 20, 1890}
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Re: Identifying the Kings of the North and South - Daniel 11
[Re: dedication]
#174633
06/26/15 02:20 AM
06/26/15 02:20 AM
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According to the Great Controversy, the woman in Revelation 17 is apostate Protestantism and the beast is the papacy. Thus the name on the woman's forehead in Rev 17 is the mark of the beast. The Mark of the beast upon which she is riding. The beast and the papacy cannot be the woman, because Catholicism cannot be both the woman and the beast.
EGW does not divide it so neatly
In these paragraphs Babylon is comprised of both Roman Catholicism and apostate Protestantism.
Look at this statement:
The woman, Babylon, of Revelation 17, is described as “arrayed in purple and scarlet color, and decked with gold and precious stones and pearls, having a golden cup in her hand full of abominations and filthiness. . . . And upon her forehead was a name written, Mystery, Babylon the Great, the mother of harlots.” Says the prophet, “I saw the woman drunken with the blood of the saints, and with the blood of the martyrs of Jesus.” [Revelation 17:4-6.] Babylon is further declared to be “that great city, which reigneth over the kings of the earth.” [Revelation 17:18.] The power that for so many centuries maintained despotic sway over the monarchs of Christendom, is Rome. The purple and scarlet color, the gold and precious stones and pearls, vividly picture the magnificence and more than kingly pomp affected by the haughty see of Rome. And no other power could be so truly declared “drunken with the blood of the saints” as that church which has so cruelly persecuted the followers of Christ. 88GC 382
Babylon is said to be “the mother of harlots.” By her daughters must be symbolized churches that cling to her doctrines and traditions....Many of the Protestant churches are following Rome's example of iniquitous connection with “the kings of the earth;” the State churches, by their relation to secular governments, and other denominations by seeking the favor of the world. And the term Babylon—confusion—may be appropriately applied to these bodies, (88GC 383)
The part you omitted from the 88GC 383 quotation is telling:
Babylon is said to be “the mother of harlots.” By her daughters must be symbolized churches that cling to her doctrines and traditions, and follow her example of sacrificing the truth and the approval of God, in order to form an unlawful alliance with the world. The message of Revelation 14 announcing the fall of Babylon, must apply to religious bodies that were once pure and have become corrupt. Since this message follows the warning of the Judgment, it must be given in the last days, therefore it cannot refer to the Romish Church, for that church has been in a fallen condition for many centuries. Furthermore, in the eighteenth chapter of the Revelation, in a message which is yet future, the people of God are called upon to come out of Babylon. According to this scripture, many of God's people must still be in Babylon. And in what religious bodies are the greater part of the followers of Christ now to be found? Without doubt, in the various churches professing the Protestant faith. At the time of their rise, these churches took a noble stand for God and the truth, and his blessing was with them. Even the unbelieving world was constrained to acknowledge the beneficent results that followed an acceptance of the principles of the gospel. In the words of the prophet to Israel, “Thy renown went forth among the heathen for thy beauty; for it was perfect through my comeliness, which I had put upon thee, saith the Lord God.” But they fell by the same desire which was the curse and ruin of Israel,—the desire of imitating the practices and courting the friendship of the ungodly. “Thou didst trust in thine own beauty, and playedst the harlot because of thy renown.” {GC88 382.3}
When reading the context and not omitting important information, it is as clear as I indicated. The woman in Rev 17 is apostate Protestantism The beast is the papacy. Rev_17:5 "And upon her forehead was a name written, MYSTERY, BABYLON THE GREAT, THE MOTHER OF HARLOTS AND ABOMINATIONS OF THE EARTH.” That is the Mark of the papal beast upon the Protestants' forehead. "The seal of a king contains three things, first the name, second his title or claim to authority, and thirdly, the region of his rule." http://biblelight.net/seal.htmThe seal of the beast upon which the Protestant woman is riding: first the name: BABYLON THE GREAT second the title or claim to authority: MOTHER OF HARLOTS AND ABOMINATIONS And thirdly, the region of rule: THE EARTH I once posted much of this information as a file for your group. But when you added the disclaimer, I deleted it. 1Co_3:2 "I have fed you with milk, and not with meat: for hitherto ye were not able to bear it, neither yet now are ye able." Heb_5:12 "For when for the time ye ought to be teachers, ye have need that one teach you again which be the first principles of the oracles of God; and are become such as have need of milk, and not of strong meat."
"Ignorance is sin, when knowledge can be obtained" (HR, September 1, 1866 par. 3). www.loudcry101.com
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