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Re: Should the Body Discipline Members for disagreeing on 28FB [Re: Mountain Man] #175365
07/15/15 02:53 PM
07/15/15 02:53 PM
APL  Offline
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Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 6,368
Western, USA
Originally Posted By: Mountain Man
Originally Posted By: APL
Originally Posted By: Mountain Man
So, yes, within the SDA Church, members who refuse to comply with the 7th day Sabbath should be disciplined in accordance with biblical standards.
Why do you keep the 7th day?

Because Jesus did (does).
Really? So if you don't keep the Sabbath, what is Jesus going to do to you?


Oh, that men might open their minds to know God as he is revealed in his Son! {ST, January 20, 1890}
Re: Should the Body Discipline Members for disagreeing on 28FB [Re: Elle] #175392
07/16/15 02:23 PM
07/16/15 02:23 PM
Mountain Man  Offline
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I do keep the Sabbath. My reward will be proportionate. "And, behold, I come quickly; and my reward is with me, to give every man according as his work shall be." "If thou sayest, Behold, we knew it not; doth not he that pondereth the heart consider it? and he that keepeth thy soul, doth not he know it? and shall not he render to every man according to his works?" "For the Son of man shall come in the glory of his Father with his angels; and then he shall reward every man according to his works."

Quote:
Chap. 236 - The Reward

Behold, I come quickly; and my reward is with me, to give every man according as his work shall be. Revelation 22:12. {AG 244.1}

In His divine arrangement, through His unmerited favor, the Lord has ordained that good works shall be rewarded. We are accepted through Christ's merit alone; and the acts of mercy, the deeds of charity, which we perform, are the fruits of faith; and they become a blessing to us; for men are to be rewarded according to their works. It is the fragrance of the merit of Christ that makes our good works acceptable to God, and it is grace that enables us to do the works for which He rewards us. Our works in and of themselves have no merit. . . . We deserve no thanks from God. We have only done what it was our duty to do, and our works could not have been performed in the strength of our own sinful natures. {AG 244.2}

We need . . . to bring the light and grace of Christ into all our works. We need to take hold of Christ and to retain our hold of Him until we know that the power of His transforming grace is manifested in us. We must have faith in Christ if we would reflect the divine character. . . . Faith in the Word of God and in the power of Christ to transform the life will enable the believer to work His works. {AG 244.3}

To His servants Christ commits "His goods"--something to be put to use for Him. He gives "to every man his work." . . . Not more surely is the place prepared for us in the heavenly mansions than is the special place designated on earth where we are to work for God. . . . {AG 244.4}

Christ has paid us our wages, even His own blood and suffering, to secure our willing service. He came to our world to give us an example of how we should work, and what spirit we should bring into our labor. He desires us to study how we can best advance His work and glorify His name in the world. {AG 244.5}

The sanctification of the soul by the working of the Holy Spirit is the implanting of Christ's nature in humanity. Gospel religion is Christ in the life--a living, active principle. It is the grace of Christ revealed in character and wrought out in good works. {AG 244.6}

Re: Should the Body Discipline Members for disagreeing on 28FB [Re: Elle] #175396
07/16/15 03:22 PM
07/16/15 03:22 PM
APL  Offline
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Western, USA
Yes - and what is Jesus going to do to you if you do not keep the Sabbath?


Oh, that men might open their minds to know God as he is revealed in his Son! {ST, January 20, 1890}
Re: Should the Body Discipline Members for disagreeing on 28FB [Re: Elle] #175401
07/16/15 05:54 PM
07/16/15 05:54 PM
Mountain Man  Offline
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We are discussing the answer to your question elsewhere. Let's stay on topic here. SDA members and leaders who refuse to live in harmony with the 28FB should be disciplined.

Re: Should the Body Discipline Members for disagreeing on 28FB [Re: Mountain Man] #175402
07/16/15 07:35 PM
07/16/15 07:35 PM
APL  Offline
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Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 6,368
Western, USA
Originally Posted By: Mountain Man
We are discussing the answer to your question elsewhere. Let's stay on topic here. SDA members and leaders who refuse to live in harmony with the 28FB should be disciplined.
It is one topic. I've asked you want discipline you would give way back, and you don't have a straight answer. Christ is our guide, what would Christ do to those who do not hold to the real FBs, the Bible? Hard for you to answer?


Oh, that men might open their minds to know God as he is revealed in his Son! {ST, January 20, 1890}
Re: Should the Body Discipline Members for disagreeing on 28FB [Re: APL] #175405
07/16/15 08:30 PM
07/16/15 08:30 PM
K
kland  Offline
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Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 6,509
Midland
Originally Posted By: APL
Originally Posted By: Mountain Man
Originally Posted By: APL
Originally Posted By: Mountain Man
So, yes, within the SDA Church, members who refuse to comply with the 7th day Sabbath should be disciplined in accordance with biblical standards.
Why do you keep the 7th day?

Because Jesus did (does).
Really? So if you don't keep the Sabbath, what is Jesus going to do to you?
Well, "discipline" you, of course! So you had better keep the 7th day for the reason of keeping from being "disciplined"!

Re: Should the Body Discipline Members for disagreeing on 28FB [Re: James Peterson] #175406
07/16/15 08:38 PM
07/16/15 08:38 PM
K
kland  Offline
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5500+ Member
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 6,509
Midland
So do you suggest that we each have our own speed limits? For that's what you have suggested.
Originally Posted By: James Peterson
Originally Posted By: kland
Originally Posted By: James Peterson
Christian denominations should NOT base their peculiarity, and hold themselves out as the ONLY light upon a hill, on ideas not explicitly stated or self-evident from the text of the Bible. It is difficult to take anyone seriously, for example, who stridently claims that congregational worship on Saturdays or belief in a trinity of divinities is a determinant of one's salvation. One's creed should be simple: John 13:35, and allow for the proliferation and discussion of ideas without the threat of the stifling of conscience.

I think what MM was trying to say,
2:3 And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it:
20:10 But the seventh day [is] the sabbath of the LORD thy God:

Isn't that objective, like going 20 over the speed limit, of which nobody can deny?

It's the reason I said "congregational worship on Saturdays". Indeed the Decalogue does say the seventh day but it must be the seventh day according to one's own time zone and culture. The Sabbath was never meant to be a strictly specific 24-hour period Jerusalem time, else many would have to be awake all night in accordance with the day set there.
Is anyone here (except maybe "feastkeepers") suggesting we should go with 24-hour period Jerusalem time?

I think most here say the 7th day is based upon our own time zone. Not sure what you mean by "culture".

Quote:
Evidently, the commandment is simply asking for one day out of seven which,
Not true. "Indeed the Decalogue does say the seventh day " I agree. The 7th day. Not a 7th day.

Quote:
because the week is cyclic over seven days, means that, mathematically and as commonsense would have it, whatever day you choose becomes the seventh day of rest from the day you started the week.
Not true. It doesn't say anything about we choosing. It says God chose it.
2:3 And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it:


Quote:
Saturdays? No problem. Sundays? No problem either. The day of congregational worship is always going to be the seventh day (or last day of the week) for that congregation. And you break the commandment when you deviate from the faith of your brethren with whom you worship over the issue. Nevertheless, another congregation does not sin by holding Tuesdays, for example as against Thursdays, as the Sabbath of the Lord any more than American SDA keep Fridays holy judging by Jerusalem time.

///
Try that with the patrolman. Say your speed limit happens to be higher than his. Objective? Indeed!

Re: Should the Body Discipline Members for disagreeing on 28FB [Re: APL] #175407
07/17/15 12:08 AM
07/17/15 12:08 AM
Mountain Man  Offline
SDA
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Active Member 2019

20000+ Member
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 22,256
Southwest USA
Originally Posted By: APL
Originally Posted By: Mountain Man
We are discussing the answer to your question elsewhere. Let's stay on topic here. SDA members and leaders who refuse to live in harmony with the 28FB should be disciplined.
It is one topic. I've asked you want discipline you would give way back, and you don't have a straight answer. Christ is our guide, what would Christ do to those who do not hold to the real FBs, the Bible? Hard for you to answer?

The Jews refused to live in harmony with FB and Jesus raised up the Christian Church. The Bible is very clear about what to do when members refuse to live in harmony with FB.

Re: Should the Body Discipline Members for disagreeing on 28FB [Re: kland] #175408
07/17/15 12:12 AM
07/17/15 12:12 AM
Mountain Man  Offline
SDA
Charter Member
Active Member 2019

20000+ Member
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 22,256
Southwest USA
Originally Posted By: kland
A: Why do you keep the 7th day?

M: Because Jesus did (does).

K: Well, "discipline" you, of course! So you had better keep the 7th day for the reason of keeping from being "disciplined"!

I keep the Sabbath because Jesus did (does). I do not fear judgment.

Quote:
Oh, let us contemplate the amazing sacrifice that has been made for us! Let us try to appreciate the labor and energy that Heaven is expending to reclaim the lost, and bring them back to the Father's house. Motives stronger, and agencies more powerful, could never be brought into operation; the exceeding rewards for right-doing, the enjoyment of heaven, the society of the angels, the communion and love of God and His Son, the elevation and extension of all our powers throughout eternal ages--are these not mighty incentives and encouragements to urge us to give the heart's loving service to our Creator and Redeemer? {SC 21.3}

And, on the other hand, the judgments of God pronounced against sin, the inevitable retribution, the degradation of our character, and the final destruction, are presented in God's word to warn us against the service of Satan. {SC 21.4}

Re: Should the Body Discipline Members for disagreeing on 28FB [Re: Mountain Man] #175409
07/17/15 01:52 AM
07/17/15 01:52 AM
APL  Offline
SDA
Active Member 2020

5500+ Member
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 6,368
Western, USA
Originally Posted By: Mountain Man
Originally Posted By: APL
Originally Posted By: Mountain Man
We are discussing the answer to your question elsewhere. Let's stay on topic here. SDA members and leaders who refuse to live in harmony with the 28FB should be disciplined.
It is one topic. I've asked you want discipline you would give way back, and you don't have a straight answer. Christ is our guide, what would Christ do to those who do not hold to the real FBs, the Bible? Hard for you to answer?

The Jews refused to live in harmony with FB and Jesus raised up the Christian Church. The Bible is very clear about what to do when members refuse to live in harmony with FB.
The Bible is clear. You are not.


Oh, that men might open their minds to know God as he is revealed in his Son! {ST, January 20, 1890}
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