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Re: Where is the Ark of the Covenant? [Re: dedication] #174024
06/08/15 01:09 PM
06/08/15 01:09 PM
J
James Peterson  Offline
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Active Member 2019

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Joined: Jul 2013
Posts: 1,195
Canada
Originally Posted By: dedication
True the temple burned and many people died as well, but that is not proof that all the furniture burned as well. The Babylonians took much of the temple's things to Babylon. We read in Daniel that King Belshazzar had access to items taken from God's sanctuary. Daniel 5:3 Then they brought the golden vessels that were taken out of the temple of the house of God which [was] at Jerusalem; and the king, and his princes, his wives, and his concubines, drank in them. These people had no reverence for God, and their use of the things from God's temple was a serious insult to God.

That is not because God was preserving anything inherently holy; but a sign to the Jews that they were going to be preserved in Babylon and return again to Jerusalem until the coming of the Messiah (Dan. 9:25-27)

Originally Posted By: dedication
As to the ark -- We have no statement anywhere in scripture that the ark of the covenant was destroyed. So what happened to the ark? Was it taken by Nebuchadnezzar? Was it destroyed with the city? Or was it removed and hidden safely away? We do have a precedent in scripture that might give an answer. Years earlier Pharaoh Shishak of Egypt raided the temple during the reign of Solomon’s son Rehoboam. 2 Chron. 12:9 So Shishak king of Egypt came up against Jerusalem, and took away the treasures of the house of the LORD

But apparently someone (the Levites) managed to hide the ark somewhere as it was no longer in the temple, but the Levites knew where it was. Years later when king Josiah reinstituted the Jewish feasts (the Passover) he asked the Levites to place the ark of the covenant in the temple again. 2 Chron. 35:1 Moreover Josiah kept a Passover unto the LORD in Jerusalem... 35:3 And said unto the Levites that taught all Israel, which were holy unto the LORD, Put the holy ark in the house which Solomon the son of David king of Israel did build

It was a NEWLY MADE ark of the covenant. The Temple in which Jesus walked was not the temple that Solomon built, but a NEWLY MADE temple, one he nevertheless fiercely referred to as, "My Father's House ..."

Originally Posted By: dedication
So it is very possible that the same was done before the Babylonians raided and destroyed the temple. The non-canonical book of 2 Maccabees reports that just prior to the Babylonian invasion, Jeremiah "prompted by a divine message gave orders that the tent of meeting and the ark should go with him. Then he went away to the mountain from top of which Moses saw God's promised land. When he reached the mountain, Jeremiah found a cave-dwelling; he carried the tent, the ark, and the incense altar into it, then blocked up the entrance. Some of his companions came to mark out the way, but were unable to find it. when Jeremiah learnt of this he reprimanded them. The place shall remain unknown, he said, until God finally gathers his people together and shows mercy to them. then the Lord will bring these things to light again, and the glory of the Lord will appear with the cloud, as it was seen both in the time of Moses and when Solomon prayed that the temple might be worthily consecrated. (2 Maccabees 2:4-6)

"Possible"? There is a reason why those books are "non-canonical". But, by the way, what of #3?

Originally Posted By: James Peterson
3. For those who are wise, those unencumbered by heavy SDA doctrinal chains, if in the old covenant the Decalogue were written on tablets of stone and placed in the AoC, then seeing that in the new covenant the law is written ON YOUR HEART (Jer. 31:33), tell me then ... where is the place of your heart, hmmmmm? (See John 4:21-24 for help in answering)

///

Re: Where is the Ark of the Covenant? [Re: Windsor] #174033
06/08/15 09:33 PM
06/08/15 09:33 PM
Johann  Offline
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Active Member 2014

Retired Pastor
3000+ Member
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 3,014
Iceland
When Ron Wyatt visited Denmark about 15 or 20 years ago I was living there. I did not attend his meetings, but two of my friends did. They told me he showed some videos of his finding, but they were so dark and unclear that nothing could be recognized. They got some of his material which, on further examination, proved nothing. Both of those friends were editors used to evaluate such things, but it seems like they discovered nothing to write about.


"Here is a last piece of advice. If you believe in goodness and if you value the approval of God, fix your minds on the things which are holy and right and pure and beautiful and good. Model your conduct on what you have learned from me, on what I have told you and shown you, and you will find the God of peace will be with you."
Re: Where is the Ark of the Covenant? [Re: Alchemy] #174041
06/09/15 04:52 AM
06/09/15 04:52 AM
APL  Offline
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5500+ Member
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 6,368
Western, USA
Originally Posted By: Alchemy
Originally Posted By: APL
Originally Posted By: Alchemy
Personally, I do agree that Ron Wyatt's understanding go the Exodus and the location of Mt. Sinai is by far the most Biblical understanding available.
And unproven as are all of Wyatt's claims.


I disagree completely on this point.

It surely can't be on the Sinai peninsula by St, Catherine's Monastery, unless you have some proof to support that idea!
Proof - still not absolute proof. You say there is proof? You disagree completely, so you must have proof. What is it? It is not Wyatt, he has shown himself to be not trustworthy repeatedly, so where is the PROOF.


Oh, that men might open their minds to know God as he is revealed in his Son! {ST, January 20, 1890}
Re: Where is the Ark of the Covenant? [Re: APL] #174054
06/09/15 11:43 AM
06/09/15 11:43 AM
A
Alchemy  Offline
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Active Member 2018

Most Dedicated Member
Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 2,264
Asia
Originally Posted By: APL
Originally Posted By: Alchemy
Originally Posted By: APL
Originally Posted By: Alchemy
Personally, I do agree that Ron Wyatt's understanding go the Exodus and the location of Mt. Sinai is by far the most Biblical understanding available.
And unproven as are all of Wyatt's claims.


I disagree completely on this point.

It surely can't be on the Sinai peninsula by St, Catherine's Monastery, unless you have some proof to support that idea!
Proof - still not absolute proof. You say there is proof? You disagree completely, so you must have proof. What is it? It is not Wyatt, he has shown himself to be not trustworthy repeatedly, so where is the PROOF.


Again, if you follow the Biblical account, crossing the Red Sea at the point to land on the Arabian peninsula makes the most sense. The Israelites would have needed to cross there to avoid the Philistines for instance.

Re: Where is the Ark of the Covenant? [Re: Windsor] #174079
06/09/15 07:16 PM
06/09/15 07:16 PM
APL  Offline
SDA
Active Member 2020

5500+ Member
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 6,368
Western, USA
It may make sense, but where is the proof?


Oh, that men might open their minds to know God as he is revealed in his Son! {ST, January 20, 1890}
Re: Where is the Ark of the Covenant? [Re: Windsor] #174080
06/09/15 07:27 PM
06/09/15 07:27 PM
dedication  Online Content
Global Moderator
Supporting Member 2022

5500+ Member
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 6,716
Canada
Knowing where the sites are is not of utmost importance. True, finding archeology evidence for Biblical accounts strengthens faith in the reliability of the scriptures, yet there is no salvific value in the places or the objects themselves.

Finding the ancient ark of the covenant and building a third temple over in Palestine has no salvific value -- the earthly temple services ended at the cross.

Christ, with His own blood entered the heavenly sanctuary.

Hebrews 8:5 [Earthly priests] serve unto the example and shadow of heavenly things, as Moses was admonished of God when he was about to make the tabernacle.

Hebrews 9: 11 Christ being come an high priest of good things to come, by a greater and more perfect tabernacle, not made with hands, that is to say, not of this building;
9:12 Neither by the blood of goats and calves, but by his own blood he entered in once into the holy places, having obtained eternal redemption for us.
9:24 For Christ is not entered into the holy places made with hands, [which are] the figures of the true; but into heaven itself, now to appear in the presence of God for us:




The ark of the covenant represents God's throne.
His presence is pictured as being between the covering cherubim.

Psalms 99:1 The LORD reigns; let the people tremble: he sits between the cherubims; let the earth be moved.

The law (ten commandments) being placed under the mercy seat represents the foundational law of God's government. The principles of this law supports God's throne. The principles of that law represents His rule of righteousness.

The wording on those tablets of stone given to Moses is written to convict sinful mankind. They are written in stone to show their eternal unchanging importance.

Once convicted of our sinfulness and led to Christ in repentance the principles of that law are to be written upon our hearts -- in their positive form. We will honor God first and above all, we will not place any created object or image in God's place, we will speak His name with awe and reverence and long to represent Him in ways to bring Him glory. We will delight to set apart His sanctified day as a day for special fellowship with Him. etc.

We are not "THE temple" but God seeks to "tabernacle" with us -- thus in a sense by His cleansing Holy Spirit we are "temples of the Holy Spirit", in that He dwells with us.


Christ's ministry in the heavenly sanctuary is far greater than just us, but it certainly does include a work to cleans our lives of sin and make us fit for His presence eternally.

Christ is establishing the list of redeemed right now of those who will walk with Him in white for eternity!

Rev. 3:5,4 He that overcometh, the same shall be clothed in white raiment; and I will not blot out his name out of the book of life, but I will confess his name before my Father, and before his angels. ...and they shall walk with me in white: for they are worthy.


Re: Where is the Ark of the Covenant? [Re: dedication] #174086
06/10/15 11:40 AM
06/10/15 11:40 AM
J
James Peterson  Offline
NON-SDA
Active Member 2019

Dedicated Member
Joined: Jul 2013
Posts: 1,195
Canada
Originally Posted By: dedication
Knowing where the sites are is not of utmost importance. True, finding archeology evidence for Biblical accounts strengthens faith in the reliability of the scriptures, yet there is no salvific value in the places or the objects themselves. Finding the ancient ark of the covenant and building a third temple over in Palestine has no salvific value -- the earthly temple services ended at the cross.

That is VERY true.

///

Re: Where is the Ark of the Covenant? [Re: James Peterson] #177864
11/08/15 06:42 PM
11/08/15 06:42 PM
jamesonofthunder  Offline
Banned
SDA
Active Member 2015

3500+ Member
Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 3,613
USA
No this is not true.

"But in God’s appointed time He will bring forth these tables of stone to be a testimony to all the world against the disregard of His commandments and against the idolatrous worship of a counterfeit Sabbath." Manuscript 122, "The Law", November 23, 1901. {8MR 100.3}

***** STAFF EDIT *****

Last edited by Daryl; 11/09/15 11:46 PM. Reason: Removed inappropriate content.

Search me oh God and know my heart, test me and know my anxious thoughts, see if there is any offensive way in me and lead me to the way everlasting. Amen
Re: Where is the Ark of the Covenant? [Re: Windsor] #177892
11/09/15 11:57 PM
11/09/15 11:57 PM
Daryl  Online Canadian

Site Administrator
23000+ Member
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 25,133
Nova Scotia, Canada
EGW wrote:
Quote:
The Lord gave me a view of the heavenly sanctuary. The temple of God was opened in heaven, and I was shown the ark of God covered with the mercy-seat. Two angels stood at either end of the ark, with their wings spread over the mercy-seat, and their faces turned toward it. This my accompanying angel informed me represented all the heavenly host looking with reverential awe toward the Law of God which had been written by the finger of God.—LS (1880) 237. {TA 250.1}

So where is the ark of the covenant?

I think the above EGW quote answers that question.


In His Love, Mercy & Grace,

Daryl smile

John 8:32 And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.

http://www.christians-discuss.com/forum/index.php
Re: Where is the Ark of the Covenant? [Re: Windsor] #177903
11/10/15 02:08 AM
11/10/15 02:08 AM
jamesonofthunder  Offline
Banned
SDA
Active Member 2015

3500+ Member
Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 3,613
USA
The earthly ark is a model of the heavenly. God showed Moses what to build but the earthly ark is still here.

"The ark containing the law of God, the altar of incense, and other instruments of service found in the sanctuary below, have also their counterpart in the sanctuary above. In holy vision the apostle John was permitted to enter heaven, and he there beheld the candlestick and the altar of incense, and as `the temple of God was opened,' he beheld also `the ark of His testament' (Revelation 11:19)."--4SP 261.

"Before the temple was destroyed, God made known to a few of His faithful servants the fate of the temple, which was the pride of Israel, and which they regarded with idolatry, while they were sinning against God. He also revealed to them the captivity of Israel. These righteous men, just before the destruction of the temple, removed the sacred ark containing the tables of stone, and with mourning and sadness, secreted it in a cave where it was to be hid from the people of Israel, because of their sins, and was to be no more restored to them. That sacred ark is yet hid. It has never been disturbed since it was secreted."--4SG 114, 115 (1864);1SP 414 (1870); SR 195.

***** STAFF EDIT *****

Last edited by Daryl; 11/10/15 07:29 PM. Reason: Removed inappropriate content.

Search me oh God and know my heart, test me and know my anxious thoughts, see if there is any offensive way in me and lead me to the way everlasting. Amen
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