While some in Adventism are awake to the times, in general the church is rapidly losing its prophetic understanding. Six weeks ago I talked to a pastor in Virginia who had retired last year. He told me he took an early retirement because his conference and union were so enmeshed in the Emerging Church movement that he couldn't be a part of it any longer.

The good news is that at the same time this is going on the Lord is raising up an army of Spirit-filled Sabbath-keeping non-Adventists who fully believe in the current application of the prophecies. There is general agreement among them that 2015 is a significant year prophetically because it's a Jubilee. They also agree that the seals, thunders, and trumpets are either immanent or underway in some degree but that the Lord will turn up the heat exponentially shortly. Here's a link to one site where some of them congregate. http://z3news.com/w/. They are not consciously aware that they are a prophetic movement but in substance, that is what they are.

To give an overview, I'll summarize what they say the Lord is telling them through scripture and prophecy to expect:

1. An economic collapse will come in stages starting not later than February 2016 with the market taking a number of blows until it reaches historic lows in the fall of 2016. (I wouldn't bank on this but because they are generally true to scripture I'll not be surprised if this prophecy is truly from the Lord. The same with the remaining six.)

2. Heightened social disorder and tensions in America will appear at the same time the economic collapse begins in February 2016 or earlier . This is the start of thousands of American cities burning.

3. Rioting will be a major cause of the urban destruction but foreign missiles and earthquakes and natural disaster such as eruptions and asteroid strikes will also be major causes.

4. World War III will start with America and Russia and China being the major players which will result in many American cities being destroyed by nuclear missiles launched from submarines off the coastal USA. They predict Chinese and Russian invasions. There is no definite time frame for this I'm aware of but one man claims the Lord showed him that an Asian missile from North Korea I think would be launched December 3, 2015. Some think the Lord will allow the US to intercept this one.

5. All of the above leads to famine and pandemics and, over time, depopulation and desolation, but as the population globally begins to shrink God will see to it that his people are given not only food but major resources to advance the gospel.

6. The visible church will go underground but become all the more effective by assuming business roles that will be covers for evangelism and that these businesses will be remarkably successful.

7. They are saying that all of this will reveal hearts as the mark of the beast is enforced; That the purified church will rise to the occasion as Holy Spirit is poured out. They urge that if you want to be ready, you have to learn now to walk by faith in the Spirit and be His hands and feet today doing good and reaching out to the lost now so that you know how to act then.

8. They teach the essence of the sanctuary doctrine; their focus is entering by faith into the Most Holy Place for cleansing and atonement and power for complete victory over sin!

Praise the Lord! The stones are crying out. Living stones that are true to the light they have. How should Adventists respond? Should we tell them to be quiet and that no one is allowed to prophesy post Ellen White? Or should we praise God.

And if December 3 does not pan out, then what, a revision? And if February 2016 does not pan out, then what, a revision? And if the fall of 2016 does not pan out, then what? And if December 3 does pan out, does that prove it was from the LORD? Can the devil not make all these things happen and even foretell their happening? Is all of this really necessary? What is THE MESSAGE that we are to give to the world?

It is the darkness of misapprehension of God that is enshrouding the world. Men are losing their knowledge of His character. It has been misunderstood and misinterpreted. At this time a message from God is to be proclaimed, a message illuminating in its influence and saving in its power. His character is to be made known. Into the darkness of the world is to be shed the light of His glory, the light of His goodness, mercy, and truth. {COL 415.3}

This is the work outlined by the prophet Isaiah in the words, "O Jerusalem, that bringest good tidings, lift up thy voice with strength; lift it up, be not afraid; say unto the cities of Judah, Behold your God! Behold, the Lord God will come with strong hand, and His arm shall rule for Him; behold, His reward is with Him, and His work before Him." Isaiah 40:9,10. {COL 415.4}

Those who wait for the Bridegroom's coming are to say to the people, "Behold your God." The last rays of merciful light, the last message of mercy to be given to the world, is a revelation of His character of love. The children of God are to manifest His glory. In their own life and character they are to reveal what the grace of God has done for them. {COL 415.5}

That is the message, and it will not fail.

I looked at them. They are pretty mundane, the usual alarmist solemnity: war, pestilence and mayhem. And the ever soon WW3, scaremongering about the powers that be. What exactly is the point in regurgitating the Bible with a modern spin without insight or meaning? It's as if God delights in violence and fear. They are false prophets, and I'm not afraid of them at all. (Deut. 18:22)

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These Sabbatarians are giving the message that we've been commissioned to give, the good news. I gave some of their prophecies as something to consider, but the focus of their message is "Behold your God," just as you quote APL.

James, by that definition all of the prophets would be fear mongers. These folk aren't saying anything other than what the prophets and Christ himself has always said - repent because the day of the Lord is near. It's the gospel that Christ is at the door. What better news!

APL, I have a few reasons for posting this.

1) They could be right, so this is a heads up. What they are saying just recently is very specific and is not far off and if true will have a global impact because the American economy is the single biggest factor in driving the global economy. These events - social upheaval and economic down turn - are supposedly only two months away.

2) To help us test the accuracy of their prophecies.

3) To help test the source. If they are precisely fulfilled and those giving them meet the other tests of scripture, I'd be more inclined to listen to both their predictions and messages.

4) To promote repentance.

5) To draw attention to the current and future application of the prophecies. Orthodox Adventism relegates most apocalyptic prophecy to history whereas the scriptures and Ellen White and these modern prophets are in agreement that the end-time prophecies apply to the end times.

Well, why not study the prophecies in the Bible? It seems those on z3 have given Satan an easy way into their hearts!

"The could be right?" Could be? Is that reassuring? And "is not far off", as I said, lets say nothing happens, then what? Maybe they will be right next time, so "heads up!"And if they are inaccurate, then make they will be next time, so "heads up!" Again, can not Satan duplication these things? How will tell the difference.How? Scared straight? Where does repentance come from? Only from God. We cannot repent on our own. So you have concluded that they are prophets. Interesting.

I found it "interesting" that they made a big deal about 2 cows being born with the number "7" on their head as if this was a very important sign. Like seeing the virgin Mary in a piece of toast. Is that where we should be looking for signs?

I find these statements very interesting Brother Mark because I mentioned to you in an email over a year ago and 6 months ago I believe, that Revelation 17 says the seventh papal king since the title "king" was given back to the pope, retired on the anniversary of the signing of the Lateran Treaty, and lightning struck St Peter's Basilica and I am starting to believe that this was the starting point of 3 1/2 years 'til he dies, and now you and your friends have a similar message but connected to the results to look for instead of the sign/ starting point. You go way out on a limb there. Those dreams you linked to are not from God.

The prophecy in Rev 17 says the seventh king "must remain a little while" (ESV) and Jesus said in John 7:33, 12:35, 13:33 & 16:16 that His ministry would be a "little while" which indicates a definite time of 3 and 1/2 years, as His ministry was predicted and fulfilled on time.

If you look at all of those quotes in John (7,12,13 & 16) it is quite profound the mysteries involved. John 16 has many end time elements, including "they will put you out of the synagogues" and "But these things have I told you, that when the time shall come, ye may remember that I told you of them." Also He talks about the Comforter coming (early and latter rain). But the most intriguing element to chapter 16 is when He told them in verse 16 "A little while, and ye shall not see me: and again, a little while, and ye shall see me, because I go to the Father. 17 Then said some of his disciples among themselves, What is this that he saith unto us, A little while, and ye shall not see me: and again, a little while, and ye shall see me: and, Because I go to the Father?"

This prophecy has two elements to it, two time frames; the early and latter rain. This is an obvious reference to the 3 1/2 years of His ministry til His death, and the time till the Early Rain, but also the end of probation and the testing time that comes before the second coming. Then he answers their question about the riddle...

"Truly, truly,(emphatically) I say to you, you will weep and lament, but the world will rejoice (like the three and a half years of the French Revolution; the slaying of the two witnesses/ when they cry Peace and safety). You will be sorrowful, but your sorrow will turn into joy. 21 When a woman is giving birth, she has sorrow because her hour has come."

That is an obvious reference to the birth of the 144,000 as Revelation 12:1-6 alludes to in a secondary sense after the birth of Christ, the man child. The 144,000 are the remnant of the seed.

Then He says in verse John 16:25 “I have said this to you in figures; the hour is coming when I shall no longer speak to you in figures but tell you plainly of the Father."

Benedict XVI retired on Feb 11, (same month you are espousing) 2013. Three and a half years later would be August 11, 2016. Not February like you guys are saying. The fact that Benedict XVI said he had a "mystical experience" which told him to retire on the anniversary of the signing of the Lateran Treaty, then lightning struck the Basilica, had very profound elements that God illustrate to me that day. He gives me these things so when the time comes I will recognize the fulfillment. I am starting to believe from what God showed me that the lightning strike was a starting point till the death of the seventh king who "MUST REMAIN a short time".

Revelation 12:1-6 says that after the BIRTH of the the 144,000 "Woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea! for the devil is come down unto you, having great wrath, because he knoweth that he hath but a short time. 13 And when the dragon saw that he was cast unto the earth, he persecuted the woman which brought forth the man child. But isn't it interesting that Luke 10:18 says “I saw Satan fall like lightning from heaven." And Benedict was told to retire on the anniversary of when the popes became kings again and lightning struck the basilica?

Every one of the previous popes length of life were dependent on God. So this comprehension would not be connected to the TIME of Daniels and Revelations time prophecies. Time shall be NO MORE connected to those prophecies, but must still fall in the right places after the prophecies before them are fulfilled. All in their place.

There are several references to Revelation 12:17 being fulfilled in the 144,000.



The bridge the angel makes in Revelation 10:1-6 with his right foot on the sea and left foot on the earth is the bridge of time that God permitted for the development of the Image to the beast in America from 1929 till the sixth king, JPII, who reestablished the Jesuits to Rome in 1981, also reestablished the office of the Inquisition where Benedict XVI (the seventh) came onto the scene. Then right before he died JPII brought Bergoglio to Rome, making him a Cardinal in 2001, who almost succeeded Pope JPII back then. Now Bergoglio the Jesuit, was Pope Francis almost 12 years to the day after the election of Benedict XVI. The eighth king came from "Out of" the seven hills of Rome and is the "beast that was" restored.

I have not been told to proclaim some of this as fact yet, but I am not discouraged when praying either and everything else is solid in the Spirit. If these things are fulfilled this way then imagine the impact on being able to say this is fulfilled to the world. There are certain things I need verification on first, but some here will accuse me of time setting.

Brother Mark, please be careful talking like you have the prophetic gift. I care for you, but you do not yet have that gift as you claim. Peace.

Correction; the bridge the angel makes standing between the sea and the earth begins in 1844, but includes the time frame of the establishment of the Image to the beast. ending when the seventh king Benedict 16 retires, beginning the 3 1/2 years.

I agree. The calves with the "7" on their heads should be questioned. Many though are biased against modern prophecy to the point that no amount of evidence will persuade them. We want hearts that are open to the evidence regardless of the "unusual" sources God may use. History is repeating. The gentile Magi were more knowledgeable of the prophecies and in tune with the living prophetic gift than God's people.

Here's a link to a paper I wrote inviting investigation into how Ellen White applied end-time prophecy.