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Re: David Gates' prediction re Spring 2019
[Re: Charity]
#187953
12/03/18 08:53 AM
12/03/18 08:53 AM
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SDA Active Member 2024 Supporting Member 2023
Dedicated Member
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Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 1,197
Alberta, Canada
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Kland, I was reading a post on twitter and happened upon this:
"...taking time and resources from an individual facing imminent threat of torture and/or death somewhere in the world."
If we replace "imminent" with "soon", we get this:
"...taking time and resources from an individual facing soon threat of torture and/or death somewhere in the world."
While "imminent" and "soon" may have somewhat similar meanings, the connotations are far different. "Soon" registers as relaxed, even lackadaisical: your food will be here soon; this movie is coming soon... Whereas, "imminent" invokes a solemn sense of immediacy, urgency, uncertainty, even peril! If there is any concept that must be clearly communicated by our church it is the urgent necessity of preparing for the coming of our Lord. Isn’t that why we are called Adventists?
I agree with David Gates, this statement has definitely been watered down. While, this may not signify the downfall of our church, it is indicative of a disturbing trend: one small compromise may just lead to death by a thousand cuts.
"...I will not forget you. Behold, I have graven thee upon the palms of my hands..."
Isaiah 49:15-16
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Re: David Gates' prediction re Spring 2019
[Re: Charity]
#187955
12/03/18 04:22 PM
12/03/18 04:22 PM
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SDA Active Member 2020
5500+ Member
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Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 6,368
Western, USA
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I agree with David Gates, this statement has definitely been watered down. While, this may not signify the downfall of our church, it is indicative of a disturbing trend: one small compromise may just lead to death by a thousand cuts. YES - let's scare everyone we can! Probation is closing April, 2019! Well, maybe. Have you read the comments on David Gate's video on YouTube? Some are panicking? WHY? WHY is the shortness or imminent coming terrors of the last days being used as the motivating factor? I may be dead this afternoon from earthquake, murder, or other disaster. You may be. How effective is that at motivating people? Besides it does not seem a proper way to win souls to Jesus, by appealing to one of the lowest attributes of the mind, abject fear. The love of Jesus attracts, it will subdue the hardest heart.’ {LS80 171.2} The shortness of time is frequently urged as an incentive for seeking righteousness and making Christ our friend. This should not be the great motive with us; for it savours of selfishness. Is it necessary that the terrors of the day of God should be held before us, that we may be compelled to right action through fear? It ought not to be so. Jesus is attractive. He is full of love, mercy, and compassion. He proposes to be our friend, to walk with us through all the rough pathways of life. {BEcho, June 25, 1894 par. 7} And this from the Testimonies, you should read the whole section: Those who think they must preach definite time in order to make an impression upon the people do not work from the right standpoint. The feelings of the people may be stirred and their fears aroused, but they do not move from principle. An excitement is created; but when the time passes, as it has done repeatedly, those who moved out upon time fall back into coldness, darkness, and sin, and it is almost impossible to arouse their consciences without some great excitement. {4T 308.1} Is David Gates following the Testimonies on this point?
Oh, that men might open their minds to know God as he is revealed in his Son! {ST, January 20, 1890}
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Re: David Gates' prediction re Spring 2019
[Re: ProdigalOne]
#187959
12/03/18 11:31 PM
12/03/18 11:31 PM
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FORMER-SDA Active Member 2018 Banned
Senior Member
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Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 663
Canada
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Where was this outrage when a practicing lesbian was baptized in California? Daryl, Mark, and anyone else with an opinion, I would be grateful for your thoughts Here's a thought: Where was the REJOICING when a practicing SINNER came to Jesus? Oh Wait!! Sorry, ProdigalOne, I'm being negative again. You surely don't want THAT opinion.
"All that is Gold does not Glitter, Not all who Wander are Lost." (J.R.R.T.)
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Re: David Gates' prediction re Spring 2019
[Re: ProdigalOne]
#187960
12/03/18 11:44 PM
12/03/18 11:44 PM
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SDA Active Member 2024
5500+ Member
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Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 6,494
Midland
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While "imminent" and "soon" may have somewhat similar meanings, the connotations are far different. "Soon" registers as relaxed, even lackadaisical: your food will be here soon; this movie is coming soon... Whereas, "imminent" invokes a solemn sense of immediacy, urgency, uncertainty, even peril!
ProdigalOne, In light of what you just said, what would you say in regards to it's been 100 years now, a period of time Gates mentioned as being "soon"? And regarding what APL said, although Gates did say he wasn't setting a date, (then proceeded to say maybe), when nothing happens this spring, what will others conclude about Adventists, about Gates?
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Re: David Gates' prediction re Spring 2019
[Re: JAK]
#187961
12/03/18 11:51 PM
12/03/18 11:51 PM
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SDA Active Member 2024
5500+ Member
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Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 6,494
Midland
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Where was this outrage when a practicing lesbian was baptized in California? Daryl, Mark, and anyone else with an opinion, I would be grateful for your thoughts Here's a thought: Where was the REJOICING when a practicing SINNER came to Jesus? Oh Wait!! Sorry, ProdigalOne, I'm being negative again. You surely don't want THAT opinion. JAK, what was the message Jesus gave to that sinner? Sin no more?
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Re: David Gates' prediction re Spring 2019
[Re: kland]
#187962
12/04/18 12:01 AM
12/04/18 12:01 AM
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FORMER-SDA Active Member 2018 Banned
Senior Member
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Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 663
Canada
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JAK, what was the message Jesus gave to that sinner? Sin no more? My Apologies! I didn't realize I was addressing people who no longer sin! My bad.
"All that is Gold does not Glitter, Not all who Wander are Lost." (J.R.R.T.)
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Re: David Gates' prediction re Spring 2019
[Re: ProdigalOne]
#187964
12/04/18 01:00 AM
12/04/18 01:00 AM
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OP
SDA Charter Member Active Member 2020
4500+ Member
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Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 4,583
USA
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I must admit that I am on the fence regarding David Gates. Many of you are far better informed on these issues than I am. What are your thoughts regarding these questions: Does he really contradict Sister White? Does he actually specify a time, or is his message speaking of a season rather than a specific day? Why is the church leadership so determined to discredit him? Where was this vocal outrage when representatives from our church were clasping hands with the Pope in 2016? Where was this outrage when a practicing lesbian was baptized in California? Where is the outrage at the wholesale satanic slaughter of the unborn in our "medical" institutions? Daryl, Mark, and anyone else with an opinion, I would be grateful for your thoughts on the questions raised in this video from Proclaim Him TV? https://youtu.be/52gY7Bsa4nE Prodigal, you've likely seen my endorsement of Gate's overall message. But to answer your questions about why there was no urgency or alarm over the Church's sins of commission or omission but there is a strong reaction globally over a simple 1 hour and 20 minute message by a single unpaid minister, to me that's a good sign that God is speaking to us through him. It fits the Biblical pattern: God's messengers get the attention of God's people. True, false prophets sometimes get widespread attention as well. But Gate's message is the opposite of their peace and safety refrain. I'm grateful to God for this gracious call to us. I'm cheered and invigorated by the message. Some here think this is fear mongering but the John the Beloved who wrote the most fearful prophecies in the Bible was the calmest and most hopeful. He closes the Revelation with the words, "Amen, even so, Maranatha, or come Lord Jesus". Those who are abiding in Christ will be full of loving anticipation at the thought that soon we'll be with Him, our Brother, Friend, and great God and King for ever.
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Re: David Gates' prediction re Spring 2019
[Re: Charity]
#187965
12/04/18 03:24 AM
12/04/18 03:24 AM
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SDA Active Member 2020
5500+ Member
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Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 6,368
Western, USA
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Who loves to fly. That is not cheap. to me that's a good sign that God is speaking to us through him. The fact that he speaks not according to EGW makes you think he speaks for God. Some here think this is fear mongering but the John the Beloved who wrote the most fearful prophecies in the Bible was the calmest and most hopeful. So why can't we say as John, even so come Lord Jesus, and hurry up, probation closes in April. Fearmongering - NOW is the day to get ready. NOW is the time to know the Lord as He really is. What not preach the Good News? THAT is the solution.
Oh, that men might open their minds to know God as he is revealed in his Son! {ST, January 20, 1890}
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Re: David Gates' prediction re Spring 2019
[Re: JAK]
#187966
12/04/18 04:11 PM
12/04/18 04:11 PM
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OP
SDA Charter Member Active Member 2020
4500+ Member
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Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 4,583
USA
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JAK, what was the message Jesus gave to that sinner? Sin no more? My Apologies! I didn't realize I was addressing people who no longer sin! My bad. That is the heart of the gospel JAK - that Christ will empower us to do what He has promised which is to deliver us from sin. "Sin no more" is a direct command from God but it is also one of the greatest promises of scripture.
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Re: David Gates' prediction re Spring 2019
[Re: Charity]
#187968
12/04/18 06:47 PM
12/04/18 06:47 PM
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SDA Active Member 2024
5500+ Member
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Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 6,494
Midland
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Ok, I finished listening to Gates. He seemed to go to great lengths in defending his message. He comes across like His Child saying that people don't have to listen to him, but they may be lost. Quite a bit of, this may not happen, but he believes it will and everyone who is faithful will believe it. A "better safe than sorry" message.
While I admit I have a tendency to do it myself and I try not to, why is it so many people are so anxious for an apocalypse? Why is it people what to see others hurt? Some sort of, I'm good and others aren't and they are going to pay. Rather than looking forward to death, destruction, and harm to others, why are they not taking a position of hold, hold, hold, for there are many who would be lost if not given enough time?
Some may argue we want this life end soon. If we were to give the good news of the gospel, rather than the news of destruction, would not Christ come?
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Here is the link to this week's Sabbath School Lesson Study and Discussion Material: Click Here
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