Forums118
Topics9,223
Posts196,070
Members1,325
|
Most Online5,850 Feb 29th, 2020
|
|
S |
M |
T |
W |
T |
F |
S |
|
|
1
|
2
|
3
|
4
|
5
|
6
|
7
|
8
|
9
|
10
|
11
|
12
|
13
|
14
|
15
|
16
|
17
|
18
|
19
|
20
|
21
|
22
|
23
|
24
|
25
|
26
|
27
|
28
|
29
|
30
|
31
|
|
|
|
Here is a link to show exactly where the Space Station is over earth right now: Click Here
|
|
|
Re: David Gates' prediction re Spring 2019
[Re: Charity]
#187969
12/04/18 07:48 PM
12/04/18 07:48 PM
|
FORMER-SDA Active Member 2018 Banned
Senior Member
|
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 663
Canada
|
|
That is the heart of the gospel JAK - that Christ will empower us to do what He has promised which is to deliver us from sin. "Sin no more" is a direct command from God but it is also one of the greatest promises of scripture. You may think that if it suits you. I believe the core of the gospel is the good news that the creator God reached out to fallen humanity and provided a way of escape. This way of escape is provided only through the grace of God. We are saved by Grace through Faith. Which means we are saved only by the Grace of God, accessed through Faith in the blood of Jesus. So what if we stop sinning. Good. Are we now saved? That would mean that I can save myself--just stop sinning! Sinning or not sinning does not change the fact that we are sinners, have sinned, and will continue to sin. Good behavior will not save. Only Grace, through Faith. While it is true that God promises to empower us to stop sinning, that is not the good new of the gospel. That is completely secondary to the fact that He has provided a way out, through His grace, freely available to everyone through Faith.
"All that is Gold does not Glitter, Not all who Wander are Lost." (J.R.R.T.)
|
|
|
Re: David Gates' prediction re Spring 2019
[Re: Charity]
#187970
12/04/18 11:03 PM
12/04/18 11:03 PM
|
SDA Active Member 2024
5500+ Member
|
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 6,494
Midland
|
|
So JAK, could you explain what you think Jesus meant by saying,
Joh 5:14 Afterward Jesus findeth him in the temple, and said unto him, Behold, thou art made whole: sin no more, lest a worse thing come unto thee.
Joh 8:11 She said, No man, Lord. And Jesus said unto her, Neither do I condemn thee: go, and sin no more.
|
|
|
Re: David Gates' prediction re Spring 2019
[Re: Charity]
#187971
12/04/18 11:58 PM
12/04/18 11:58 PM
|
SDA Active Member 2020
5500+ Member
|
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 6,368
Western, USA
|
|
That is the heart of the gospel JAK - that Christ will empower us to do what He has promised which is to deliver us from sin. "Sin no more" is a direct command from God but it is also one of the greatest promises of scripture. The "heart of the gospel" - hm. The 1AM says: Rev_14:6-7 And I saw another angel fly in the middle of heaven, having the everlasting gospel to preach to them that dwell on the earth, and to every nation, and kindred, and tongue, and people, (7) Saying with a loud voice, Fear God, and give glory to him; for the hour of his judgment is come: and worship him that made heaven, and earth, and the sea, and the fountains of waters. So, the gospel has always been true, so in much greater that just our salvation, which is a consequence of the true Gospel which is about the Character of God. It is because of God's Character which makes salvation possible. And the salvation of this planet is a small part of the whole plan of salvation. LOST from David Gate's talk is the real Gospel. But the plan of redemption had a yet broader and deeper purpose than the salvation of man. It was not for this alone that Christ came to the earth; it was not merely that the inhabitants of this little world might regard the law of God as it should be regarded; but it was to vindicate the character of God before the universe. To this result of His great sacrifice--its influence upon the intelligences of other worlds, as well as upon man--the Saviour looked forward when just before His crucifixion He said: "Now is the judgment of this world: now shall the prince of this world be cast out. And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all unto Me." John 12:31-32. The act of Christ in dying for the salvation of man would not only make heaven accessible to men, but before all the universe it would justify God and His Son in their dealing with the rebellion of Satan. It would establish the perpetuity of the law of God and would reveal the nature and the results of sin. {PP 68.2}
Oh, that men might open their minds to know God as he is revealed in his Son! {ST, January 20, 1890}
|
|
|
Re: David Gates' prediction re Spring 2019
[Re: kland]
#187972
12/05/18 12:07 AM
12/05/18 12:07 AM
|
FORMER-SDA Active Member 2018 Banned
Senior Member
|
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 663
Canada
|
|
So JAK, could you explain what you think Jesus meant by saying,
Joh 5:14 Afterward Jesus findeth him in the temple, and said unto him, Behold, thou art made whole: sin no more, lest a worse thing come unto thee.
Joh 8:11 She said, No man, Lord. And Jesus said unto her, Neither do I condemn thee: go, and sin no more. Just what he said: "Sin no more." There is no explaining to do. And YES, he will help us do that with His in-dwelling Spirit. BUTTo say, as Charity claims: That is the heart of the gospel JAK - that Christ will empower us to do what He has promised which is to deliver us from sin. "Sin no more" is a direct command from God but it is also one of the greatest promises of scripture. that empowering us to not sin is the heartbeat of the gospel, is simply wrong, and lacks an understanding of God's character and Christ's mission. The heartbeat of the gospel is, as I've said, that God reached out to humans and provided a way of escaped, which we could not do ourselves. Furthermore: 1. Why would Christ empower US to do what HE has promised to do? 2. "Go and sin no more." is a command. I don't see any "promise" here.
"All that is Gold does not Glitter, Not all who Wander are Lost." (J.R.R.T.)
|
|
|
Re: David Gates' prediction re Spring 2019
[Re: JAK]
#187973
12/06/18 12:41 AM
12/06/18 12:41 AM
|
OP
SDA Charter Member Active Member 2020
4500+ Member
|
Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 4,583
USA
|
|
1. Why would Christ empower US to do what HE has promised to do? 2. "Go and sin no more." is a command. I don't see any "promise" here.
About empowerment, we do the willing and the doing, Christ supplies the power. "Go and sin no more" is like "pray in faith without doubting", also a command but since these are the words of God, they are backed by Divine power and authority. It's our privilege to not only believe them but also to set our wills to perform them and if we do the biddings of God become enablings.
|
|
|
Re: David Gates' prediction re Spring 2019
[Re: Charity]
#187974
12/06/18 03:31 AM
12/06/18 03:31 AM
|
SDA Active Member 2020
5500+ Member
|
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 6,368
Western, USA
|
|
About empowerment, we do the willing and the doing Ezekiel 36:25-27 Then will I sprinkle clean water on you, and you shall be clean: from all your filthiness, and from all your idols, will I cleanse you. (26) A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh. (27) And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and you shall keep my judgments, and do them.
Oh, that men might open their minds to know God as he is revealed in his Son! {ST, January 20, 1890}
|
|
|
Re: David Gates' prediction re Spring 2019
[Re: Charity]
#187980
12/06/18 03:16 PM
12/06/18 03:16 PM
|
FORMER-SDA Active Member 2018 Banned
Senior Member
|
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 663
Canada
|
|
JAK, what was the message Jesus gave to that sinner? Sin no more? My Apologies! I didn't realize I was addressing people who no longer sin! My bad. That is the heart of the gospel JAK - that Christ will empower us to do what He has promised which is to deliver us from sin. "Sin no more" is a direct command from God but it is also one of the greatest promises of scripture. So just for clarity, Charity (and kland and APL) you guys are living lives of sinless perfection?
"All that is Gold does not Glitter, Not all who Wander are Lost." (J.R.R.T.)
|
|
|
Re: David Gates' prediction re Spring 2019
[Re: JAK]
#187981
12/06/18 08:24 PM
12/06/18 08:24 PM
|
FORMER-SDA Active Member 2018 Banned
Senior Member
|
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 663
Canada
|
|
Because if you're not... You are breaking a direct command from God. (Charity's words). And if "his commands are enablings," where is this enabling? If "we do the willing and the doing, [and] Christ supplies the power." and you're still sinning...does that mean you are not willing? or doing? or is Christ not supplying the power? So if the heart of your gospel is based on YOU not sinning...you're in trouble.
Have you never read Phil.1:6 "being confident of this, that he who began a good work in you will carry it on to completion until the day of Christ Jesus." IMO Jesus BEGAN the work and Jesus will COMPLETE the work.
CHRIST begins the work and CHRIST completes the work. YOU---have faith.
To be sure, there is a component of overcoming and not sinning, but it sure as hell* ain't the "heart of the gospel."
* used intentionally
Signed: JAK the Troll
"All that is Gold does not Glitter, Not all who Wander are Lost." (J.R.R.T.)
|
|
|
Re: David Gates' prediction re Spring 2019
[Re: JAK]
#187982
12/07/18 03:43 PM
12/07/18 03:43 PM
|
FORMER-SDA Active Member 2018 Banned
Senior Member
|
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 663
Canada
|
|
The silence here is deafening, and I suspect it is because all of you know you are not living perfect lives, and yet you condemn a "practicing lesbian" for being baptized. Where was this outrage when a practicing lesbian was baptized in California? I do not claim any kind of perfection, nor to be your judges, but the <***STAFF EDIT***> HYPOCRACY here disgusts me. To condemn a sinner for coming to Christ is just unbelievable. And I expect any replies to perfectly exude the character and love of Christ, because YOU ALL have achieved perfection in this life.
Last edited by Daryl; 12/12/18 10:58 PM. Reason: Staff Edit.
"All that is Gold does not Glitter, Not all who Wander are Lost." (J.R.R.T.)
|
|
|
Re: David Gates' prediction re Spring 2019
[Re: APL]
#187990
12/08/18 05:56 AM
12/08/18 05:56 AM
|
SDA Active Member 2024 Supporting Member 2023
Dedicated Member
|
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 1,197
Alberta, Canada
|
|
I agree with David Gates, this statement has definitely been watered down. While, this may not signify the downfall of our church, it is indicative of a disturbing trend: one small compromise may just lead to death by a thousand cuts. YES - let's scare everyone we can! Probation is closing April, 2019! Well, maybe. Have you read the comments on David Gate's video on YouTube? Some are panicking? WHY? WHY is the shortness or imminent coming terrors of the last days being used as the motivating factor? I may be dead this afternoon from earthquake, murder, or other disaster. You may be. How effective is that at motivating people? Besides it does not seem a proper way to win souls to Jesus, by appealing to one of the lowest attributes of the mind, abject fear. The love of Jesus attracts, it will subdue the hardest heart.’ {LS80 171.2} The shortness of time is frequently urged as an incentive for seeking righteousness and making Christ our friend. This should not be the great motive with us; for it savours of selfishness. Is it necessary that the terrors of the day of God should be held before us, that we may be compelled to right action through fear? It ought not to be so. Jesus is attractive. He is full of love, mercy, and compassion. He proposes to be our friend, to walk with us through all the rough pathways of life. {BEcho, June 25, 1894 par. 7} And this from the Testimonies, you should read the whole section: Those who think they must preach definite time in order to make an impression upon the people do not work from the right standpoint. The feelings of the people may be stirred and their fears aroused, but they do not move from principle. An excitement is created; but when the time passes, as it has done repeatedly, those who moved out upon time fall back into coldness, darkness, and sin, and it is almost impossible to arouse their consciences without some great excitement. {4T 308.1} Is David Gates following the Testimonies on this point? David Gates made a reply video to answer objections to his Even At The Door message. He said that he was being accused of date setting. He pointed out that every mention of date setting by Sister White referred to setting a date for Christ’s return. He has set no such date, and is merely one who is "in faith and holy hope... tracing down the roll of fast-fulfilling prophecy and... seeking to purify their souls by obeying the truth." "God has a people upon the earth who in faith and holy hope are tracing down the roll of fast-fulfilling prophecy and are seeking to purify their souls by obeying the truth, that they may not be found without the wedding garment when Christ shall appear. 4T 306.3 Many who have called themselves Adventists have been time setters. Time after time has been set for Christ to come, but repeated failures have been the result." 4T 306.4 You say that he is spreading fear? Does the watchman on the wall spread fear when he spies danger rapidly approaching and performs his sacred duty by raising the alarm? Perhaps, he does; however, this is not because of a desire to frighten, but to galvanize God’s people, to rouse them from sleep, to warn that the time to seek God is shorter than it has ever been. David Gates does not appear to be recruiting new church members. In fact, he has decried the practice of some South American churches that "baptize" thousands of people at once, without grounding them in the truth. To the contrary, he is warning those in the church who are asleep that the time is short. Today is the day we must fill our lamps, purify our souls, and seek God with all our hearts! I am still seeking the truth concerning the veracity of his message, but I must say that so far, I see only a humble soul, who to his own harm, is faithfully labouring against the will of bureaucrats and legions of church members who long for smooth words that will allow them to continue to sleep.
"...I will not forget you. Behold, I have graven thee upon the palms of my hands..."
Isaiah 49:15-16
|
|
|
|
Here is the link to this week's Sabbath School Lesson Study and Discussion Material: Click Here
|
|
|