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Re: Should Churches Close Because Of Pandemic? [Re: ProdigalOne] #192137
03/26/20 09:51 AM
03/26/20 09:51 AM
K
kland  Offline
SDA
Active Member 2024

5500+ Member
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 6,512
Midland
...
Yes, there is a flu going around.
Yes, there are people dying from it.
Yes, and just like varying each year, sometimes the flu is more sever and sometimes less severe.
What "they" are doing is mean spirited, selfish, and self serving.

Millions of people are going to be harmed.
But it's not from the flu. It's from self-serving people in charge and coercing those in charge.
This isn't about the flu.
This isn't about double Pences.
Nor about Omegas spontaneously turning into "W"s.
This is a plan. A plan being laid in place for years. A plan for future control. To control buying and selling.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YZKti8eD0H8

Re: Should Churches Close Because Of Pandemic? [Re: ProdigalOne] #192140
03/26/20 09:01 PM
03/26/20 09:01 PM
dedication  Online Content
Global Moderator
Supporting Member 2022

5500+ Member
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 6,705
Canada
Looks like Trump is thinking the same thing as the speaker, that this lock down is BAD.
He wants to lift the "lock down" to save the economy.
See Save the economy
Trump says:
"If he listened to medical professionals, Mr. Trump says, he would shut down the country for so long it would be devastating. The protracted economic anguish would result in more suffering than from the virus itself."

And people think he's "mad", there's plenty of outcry against him lifting the "lock down".

Re: Should Churches Close Because Of Pandemic? [Re: ProdigalOne] #192143
03/27/20 10:38 AM
03/27/20 10:38 AM
K
kland  Offline
SDA
Active Member 2024

5500+ Member
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 6,512
Midland
I'm not sure why the surface, other than copper, should affect how long the virus is active. But here's from usatoday, before they change it.

How long does the coronavirus live on surfaces?

The virus can last on cardboard for up to 24 hours.
The coronavirus can exist on stainless steel objects for two to three days.
Plastic objects can harbor the virus for two to three days.

So why other articles about post offices focusing on cardboard instead of their countertops and door handles. Seems like a media campaign's first step for doing away with dollars.

Re: Should Churches Close Because Of Pandemic? [Re: ProdigalOne] #192145
03/28/20 03:59 PM
03/28/20 03:59 PM
dedication  Online Content
Global Moderator
Supporting Member 2022

5500+ Member
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 6,705
Canada
There is a definite focus on getting away from actual money and making all transactions digital --- digital money,
Even tithes and offerings are being HIGHLY encouraged to go digital, especially now when churches are closed.
Digital money -- governments will know exactly what you buy and spend your money on, how much you have, etc. etc. and can stop you from using it by the flick of switch.
No more having a cache of bills under the mattress or in a jar like grandma used to have, for emergencies..

Social life as we knew it is cancelled!
Camp Meetings for this summer cancelled.
All youth camps for this summer cancelled.
Graduation and Alumni gatherings cancelled.
General Conference 2020 cancelled (postponed to next May)
All churches closed.
Restaurants closed.
Activity centers closed.
Libraries closed.

Thousands have been laid off from their jobs.

Economic crises looms ahead for the whole "shut down" country.
If this lock down continues for months we will face something far worse than the chance of contacting a virus.

" The centralizing of wealth and power; the vast combinations for the enriching of the few at the expense of the many; the combinations of the poorer classes for the defense of their interests and claims; the spirit of unrest, of riot and bloodshed; the world-wide dissemination of the same teachings that led to the French Revolution--all are tending to involve the whole world in a struggle similar to that which convulsed France. {Ed 228.2}

Request for prayer has gone forth that God grant us a little more time -- there are still so many that need to be reached.

Re: Should Churches Close Because Of Pandemic? [Re: APL] #192155
03/29/20 08:18 AM
03/29/20 08:18 AM
ProdigalOne  Offline OP
SDA
Active Member 2024
Supporting Member 2023

Dedicated Member
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 1,205
Alberta, Canada


Excellent advice! Thank you.


"...I will not forget you.
Behold, I have graven thee upon the palms of my hands..."

Isaiah 49:15-16
Re: Should Churches Close Because Of Pandemic? [Re: ProdigalOne] #192158
03/29/20 11:09 AM
03/29/20 11:09 AM
dedication  Online Content
Global Moderator
Supporting Member 2022

5500+ Member
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 6,705
Canada
For some older folk the restrictions have actually brought a blessing.
They were already in a state of "isolation" due to their age and physical handicaps, and hadn't attended church for years. Now they tune in with their laptops or phones to our internet groups and join us in worship!
No, it's not as good as physical visitation -- but for some it's better then what they had before.

Maybe this will help us realize how the "shut ins" felt and make us more aware of people's need to be in touch with others.

Re: Should Churches Close Because Of Pandemic? [Re: ProdigalOne] #192159
03/29/20 06:50 PM
03/29/20 06:50 PM
D
D R  Offline
Charter Member
SDA
Active Member 2020

Senior Member
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 719
East Coast Canada
The Question: Should Churches Close Because Of Pandemic?
The Answer: YES!

The answer of YES is: Legal, Moral and Ethical.

Imagine the local SDA Church is "open" for Sabbath services and there are 80 people present.
As this is a typical SDA Church, the sanctuary will see the 80 people sitting about 6 inches to 2 feet apart.
Door knobs, benh arms, washrooms, ALL would be cross contaminated through the service.

3 of the people had not self isolated after returning for a trip to New York City 10 days ago.
these 3 are active carriers and only show signs of COVID-19 in their 12th day (Monday after the Sabbath service).

Congratulations 24 other people from this Church service are now contaminated with active virus.
Only 18 of them show signs of COVID-19 in the next 2 weeks BUT they were not aware and have infected 40 others
who have infected 66 others and have infected 126 others and now in the 5th week since that original Sabbath service:
OVER 380 with full COVID-19. With the death rate at 4% that could realistically be 15 PEOPLE DEAD!

This is serious and Science acknowledges this.

We are not denying our Lord by closing our Church services for a few weeks or even 2 months.
We are able to still communicate and even worship through ZOOM, Facebook Live, ...

Re: Should Churches Close Because Of Pandemic? [Re: D R] #192161
03/30/20 12:43 AM
03/30/20 12:43 AM
ProdigalOne  Offline OP
SDA
Active Member 2024
Supporting Member 2023

Dedicated Member
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 1,205
Alberta, Canada
Originally Posted by D R
The Question: Should Churches Close Because Of Pandemic?
The Answer: YES!

The answer of YES is: Legal, Moral and Ethical.

Imagine the local SDA Church is "open" for Sabbath services and there are 80 people present.
As this is a typical SDA Church, the sanctuary will see the 80 people sitting about 6 inches to 2 feet apart.
Door knobs, benh arms, washrooms, ALL would be cross contaminated through the service.

3 of the people had not self isolated after returning for a trip to New York City 10 days ago.
these 3 are active carriers and only show signs of COVID-19 in their 12th day (Monday after the Sabbath service).

Congratulations 24 other people from this Church service are now contaminated with active virus.
Only 18 of them show signs of COVID-19 in the next 2 weeks BUT they were not aware and have infected 40 others
who have infected 66 others and have infected 126 others and now in the 5th week since that original Sabbath service:
OVER 380 with full COVID-19. With the death rate at 4% that could realistically be 15 PEOPLE DEAD!

This is serious and Science acknowledges this.

We are not denying our Lord by closing our Church services for a few weeks or even 2 months.
We are able to still communicate and even worship through ZOOM, Facebook Live, ...



These are valid points. What are your thoughts concerning the powers governments around the world are quickly granting themselves? Will all of the human rights of citizens be returned once the emergency is over? Will another "emergency" occur next year?


"...I will not forget you.
Behold, I have graven thee upon the palms of my hands..."

Isaiah 49:15-16
Re: Should Churches Close Because Of Pandemic? [Re: D R] #192165
03/30/20 10:06 AM
03/30/20 10:06 AM
K
kland  Offline
SDA
Active Member 2024

5500+ Member
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 6,512
Midland
Originally Posted by D R
Congratulations 24 other people from this Church service are now contaminated with active virus.
Only 18 of them show signs of COVID-19 in the next 2 weeks BUT they were not aware and have infected 40 others
who have infected 66 others and have infected 126 others and now in the 5th week since that original Sabbath service:
OVER 380 with full COVID-19. With the death rate at 4% that could realistically be 15 PEOPLE DEAD!

This is serious and Science acknowledges this.

Would that not be a concern for the flu virus for other years?
In the 2017-2018 flu season, over 60,000 people in the U.S. alone died from the flu. But they didn't shut churches and businesses down for that.

Re: Should Churches Close Because Of Pandemic? [Re: ProdigalOne] #192166
03/30/20 10:12 AM
03/30/20 10:12 AM
K
kland  Offline
SDA
Active Member 2024

5500+ Member
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 6,512
Midland
I notice the EPA doesn't willing give up their powers they assume from taking advantage of any "emergency" situation.

I believe next year's emergency is the plan. More vaccines, forced vaccines.

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