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Here is a link to show exactly where the Space Station is over earth right now: Click Here
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Re: It has been done!
#20603
03/14/06 08:58 PM
03/14/06 08:58 PM
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OP
Dedicated Member
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Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 1,163
Muncie, IN
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Your last comment shows the confidence you have in your arguments.
We know that the human race belongs to the Creator. Please tell us when he handed ownership to someone else and what kind of transaction it was.
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Re: It has been done!
#20604
03/14/06 10:27 PM
03/14/06 10:27 PM
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Active Member 2011
3500+ Member
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Joined: May 2002
Posts: 3,965
Sweden
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I was thinking that if you want to get into grammar, wouldnt it be proper to do the grammar study in the greek instead of studying the grammar of the translation. Not unlikely the greek may clarify ambiguities in the translation.
/Thomas
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Re: It has been done!
#20605
03/14/06 10:30 PM
03/14/06 10:30 PM
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SDA
Active Member 2023
5500+ Member
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Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 5,642
California, USA
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quote:
Originally posted by Darius:
Your last comment shows the confidence you have in your arguments.
No argument from me. Just taking what the angel said, as is. Far be it from me to argue with the angel.
quote:
Originally posted by Darius:
We know that the human race belongs to the Creator. Please tell us when he handed ownership to someone else and what kind of transaction it was.
Here is what you said at the start of this thread: Instead of jumping to conclusions, deal with what I posted. Do you accept the message of the angel or do you not. We will have time enough to decide whether your present beliefs agree with the angel or not.
Here is your rendition of the verse: Matt. 1:21, "She will give birth to a son, and you are to give him the name Jesus, because he will save his people from their sins."
So, let's deal with what you posted. Do you see anything in there that describes who "His people" are?
As you so eloquently framed the challenge before us: Do you accept the message of the angel or do you not? We will have time enough to decide whether your present beliefs agree with the angel or not.
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Re: It has been done!
#20606
03/15/06 12:45 AM
03/15/06 12:45 AM
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Active Member 2012
14500+ Member
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Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 14,795
Lawrence, Kansas
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Darius, I'm not sure if you saw my question earlier. I asked you to specify what you understand the word "saved" to mean when saying that Christ saved the human race.
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Re: It has been done!
#20607
03/15/06 11:35 AM
03/15/06 11:35 AM
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OP
Dedicated Member
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Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 1,163
Muncie, IN
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Tom, to save means to rescue. The human race did not rebel; it was kidnapped by the enemy. All Jesus came to do was to take his human race back. I suspect he would have done it much earlier if man had not foolishly tried to aid in his rescue by creating religions, thus increasing the confusion about the nature of Christ. Your example of Lincoln is correct. All the slaves were emancipated, including those from news was kept. When we tell people that they are not saved we are acting like those slave-owners who refused to pass on the news of Emancipation.
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Re: It has been done!
#20608
03/15/06 01:36 PM
03/15/06 01:36 PM
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Dedicated Member
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Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 1,009
Ohio
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Did man create religion or was it formed by God? quote:
And God said unto Abraham, Thou shalt keep my covenant therefore, thou, and thy seed after thee in their generations. This is my covenant, which ye shall keep, between me and you and thy seed after thee; Every man child among you shall be circumcised. And ye shall circumcise the flesh of your foreskin; and it shall be a token of the covenant betwixt me and you. And he that is eight days old shall be circumcised among you, every man child in your generations, he that is born in the house, or bought with money of any stranger, which is not of thy seed. He that is born in thy house, and he that is bought with thy money, must needs be circumcised: and my covenant shall be in your flesh for an everlasting covenant. And the uncircumcised man child whose flesh of his foreskin is not circumcised, that soul shall be cut off from his people; he hath broken my covenant.
Genesis 17:9 - 14 NCV
Did the Human Race Rebel?
quote:
Elijah approached the people and said, "How long will you not decide between two choices? If the Lord is the true God, follow him, but if Baal is the true God, follow him!" But the people said nothing.
1 Kings 18:21 NCV
If it is up to the people to choose, they must be the ones to rebel.
It is not for us to say who is saved and who is not. We only tell people the way to be saved.
quote:
He brought them outside and said, "Men, what must I do to be saved?" They said to him, "Believe in the Lord Jesus and you will be saved -- you and all the people in your house."
Acts 16:31 - 32 NCV
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Re: It has been done!
#20609
03/16/06 03:07 AM
03/16/06 03:07 AM
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Quote: posted by Darius| When we tell people that they are not saved we are acting like those slave-owners who refused to pass on the news of Emancipation. |
Just so that I understand what you’re really saying, do you think this is a true statement?
Because Jesus came to rescue the human race, and because He was successful, everyone in the human race will be in heaven.
If you say no, then we’re pretty much, as snowman pointed out early in this discussion, arguing semantics. If you say yes, then I can see why we’re still discussing it.
Jeff
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Re: It has been done!
#20610
03/15/06 04:08 PM
03/15/06 04:08 PM
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OP
Dedicated Member
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Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 1,163
Muncie, IN
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Jeff, we have pretended that there is no difference between being saved and deciding whether one wants to be in the kingdom or not. We cannot judge our doctrines by their outcome but by what they reveal about the Creator. Being saved is a legal act. Where one spends eternity is a personal decision.
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Re: It has been done!
#20611
03/15/06 08:08 PM
03/15/06 08:08 PM
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Active Member 2011
3500+ Member
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Joined: May 2002
Posts: 3,965
Sweden
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So a person can be saved but choose not to spend eternity with God? Where would he then spend it? As dead? In hell? What, may I ask, is a person who rejects Gods invitation to live with Him saved from and what is this person saved to?
/Thomas
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Re: It has been done!
#20612
03/15/06 08:21 PM
03/15/06 08:21 PM
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OP
Dedicated Member
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Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 1,163
Muncie, IN
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Vaster, the question you need to ask is Why did we need to be saved, rescued, or ransomed? These are the verbs the Bible uses.
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Here is the link to this week's Sabbath School Lesson Study and Discussion Material: Click Here
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