We are going to take a point by point look at some of the beliefs of the Presbyterian Church that would be of particular interest to us. Feel free to discuss them as we come to them.

Here is the first one:

quote:

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#1 - What is sin?

A. Sin is any want of conformity unto, or transgression of, the law of God [a].

[a]. Lev. 5:17; Jas. 4:17; I John 3:4

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This one seems to be right on the mark, doesn't it!

__________________________
Great peace have they which
love thy law: and nothing
shall offend them.
Psalms 119:165

Daryl

What law are they talking about?

Welcome, An Inquirer, to this forum!

That is a good question that you asked.

I will let them, the Presbyterians, answer that question, but first, let us post the references they gave here.

Leviticus 5:17 "And if a soul sin, and commit any of these things which are forbidden to be done by the commandments of the LORD; though he wist it not, yet is he guilty, and shall bear his iniquity."

James 4:17 "Therefore to him that knoweth to do good, and doeth it not, to him it is sin."

1 John 3:4 "Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law."

So what law do you ask? Is there any other law? Let us go on to one of their own beliefs about that.

quote:

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#2 - Wherein is the moral law summarily comprehended?

A. The moral law is summarily comprehended in the ten commandments [a].

[a]. Deut. 4:13; Matt. 19:17-19

#3 - What is the sum of the ten commandments?

A. The sum of the ten commandments is, To love the Lord our God with all our heart, with all our soul, with all our strength, and with all our mind; and our neighbour as ourselves [a].

[a]. Matt. 22:37-40

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To answer An Inquirer's question, it seems to me that they are referring to the law as the 10 commandments.

__________________________
Great peace have they which
love thy law: and nothing
shall offend them.
Psalms 119:165

Daryl

If you look deeply into their church's doctrine of sin, their Calvinist roots begin to show.

Presbyterians believe that infant baptism took the place of Old Testament circumcision. It shows that God has elected those whom He saves. The implication is that our salvation from sin (original sin in this case) is all God's doing, not our doing. This is why Calvinists reject adult baptism (unless you've just become Christian). To a Calvinist, adult baptism smacks too much of "Hey, look what I've done to earn my own salvation! I have decided to change my course in life and to get baptized."

I find Romans 6 to be a perfect antidote to a perceived "selfish" view of baptism. We're baptized into Christ's death--it is all what He has done--even though we're adults!

Sorry if I got ahead of the study on this one, but it relates directly to how Presbyterians view sin.

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Be glad for all God is planning for you. Be patient in trouble, and always be prayerful. Rom. 12:12 NLT

I will be getting to the one on baptism later on, however, thank you for your thoughts. We will see how your thoughts compare with their's later on.

__________________________
Great peace have they which
love thy law: and nothing
shall offend them.
Psalms 119:165

Daryl

Doesn't the bible say whatever is not of faith is sin? Therefore, disobeying a law is only one aspect of sin - that is, it runs deeper. Doing good works apart from God doesn't constitute obedience, but filthy rags.
Zyph.

That is why Romans 3:23 says, "For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;"

And in Romans 3:10 it also says, "As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one:"

Therefore, we have all transgressed God's law, His 10 Commandments.

__________________________
Psalms 119:165 "Great peace
have they which love thy law:
and nothing shall offend them."

Daryl

Hold on. How is it that "whatever is not of faith is sin" is somehow deeper than 1 John 3:4, "sin is the transgression of the law"? Let's be careful. Sin is what we do more than what we are. Choice is the issue, not equipment.

It is not unusual that we share many of our Biblical positions with the Presbyterians. Many of the early Advent believers were members of the Presbyterian church but were expelled by that organization because of their belief in the imminent return of Christ in 1844.

It is one thing to make a profession of a certain Biblical position but it is quite another thing to actually live up to your profession.

That applies equally to Adventists as it does to other denominations. It is quite clear however that the practice of the Presbyterian Church falls far short of their profession with regard to the fourth commandment!!

[This message has been edited by Allen Fowler (edited May 27, 2001).]

Hi Allen,

I think you will find it interesting when we get to what they have to say about the 4th Commandment.

I also agree with Pastor Larry regarding the choice factor. We can't help what we are, namely sinners, for all have sinned, however, we can choose what we do over what we are in relation to our being sinners saved by grace.

__________________________
Psalms 119:165 "Great peace
have they which love thy law:
and nothing shall offend them."

Daryl

[This message has been edited by Daryl Fawcett (edited May 27, 2001).]