Anyone who has been following the news in the USA has to be aware of the scandle that is rocking the Catholic church in America. Pedophile priests have been abusing children, expecially boys, for years. The recent case in Boston that sent a (now) former priest to prison has opened wide a door to something that the church had tried to keep quiet for decades. It has been so bad, that the pope called the American archbishops to Rome a couple of weeks ago. According to polls, most Americans don't think it accomplished much.

Back in Boston, another priest has been charged with rape in a case brought by the now grown man and his parents. He was six at the time this crime was taking place. To add insult to injury, Boston Archbishop Law has said that the boy and his parents are at least partly to blame for this heinous crime!

What a terrible secret to have laid open to public view, that many in the priesthood, who must take vows of celibacy, are homosexual pedophiles. The funding for Catholic charities and other projects has slowed dramatically because of it.

But there is more.

In Europe, the papers last year were crying a similar story, but this time involving nuns. You can access information about it in the article The Harlotry Of Rome

quote:

---

The Rape of Nuns By Priests in 23 Countries – It’s Official.

Dr. Ian R.K. Paisley

In ‘The Independent’ of 21st March 2001 glared the heading of a report, ‘Vatican Confirms Report of Sexual Abuse and Rape of Nuns by Priests in 23 Countries’.

---

Doesn't the Bible say, Be sure your sins will find you out?

Sorry Linda; not trying to hassle you, but the entire planet is quite aware of these sordid matters, and I live on the edge of the jungle in a non-christian nation and the media is full of this sinful subject. But being like the world pointing to the dark, focusing on the dark, will never bring anyone to the light.
Sister White had this same difficulty 110years ago among Adventists; please don't take offense, but ponder this:

"Writers and speakers among us will have to learn that the highest obligations of the Christian life involve the giving of careful attention in heeding the messages that God has sent to us. It is essential that we have a knowledge of our own motives and actions in order to have constant self-improvement. I long to see men in responsible positions feeling the burden in regard to themselves, so that they will exercise Christian politeness, and speak and write in a courteous manner. The Lord wants his workers to represent him, the great missionary worker. The manifestation of zeal and rashness always does harm. The proprieties essential for Christian life must be learned daily in the school of Christ. He who is careless and heedless in uttering words or in writing words for publication to be sent broadcast into the world, is disqualifying himself to be entrusted with the sacred work which devolves upon Christ's followers at this time. Those who practice giving hard thrusts are forming habits that will have to be repented of. To discharge every duty that devolves upon those who are entrusted with sacred responsibility, in the right manner, calls for humble prayer, and a close study of the life of Christ.
A surgeon, a physician, a teacher, a guide, needs to study carefully and attentively the way in which to do the work which is entrusted to his hands, and how much more should those who are entrusted with the sacred responsibility to watch for souls as they that must give an account, study to work in harmony with the truth, and in accordance with the wisdom which is from above, which is first pure, then peaceable, gentle, and easy to be entreated, full of mercy and good fruits, without partiality, and without hypocrisy, and "the fruit of righteousness is sown in peace of them that make peace."
I am pained when I see the sharp thrusts which appear in the [American]Sentinel{A public SDA magazine}. I speak to my brethren who are communicating with the people through that paper: It is best for you to be as wise as serpents, and as harmless as doves. We should carefully and severally examine our ways and our spirits, and see in what manner we are doing the work given us of God, which involves the destiny of souls. The very highest obligation is resting upon us. Satan is standing ready, burning with zeal to inspire the whole confederacy of satanic agencies, that he may cause them to unite with evil men, and bring upon the believers of truth speedy and severe suffering. Every unwise word that is uttered by our brethren will be treasured up by the prince of darkness.

But I would like to ask, How dare finite human intelligences speak careless and venturesome words that will stir up the powers of hell against the saints of God, when Michael, the archangel, durst not bring against Satan a railing accusation, but said, "The Lord rebuke thee, O Satan"? It will be impossible for us to avoid difficulties and suffering. Jesus said, "Woe unto the world because of offenses! for it must needs be that offenses come; but woe to that man by whom the offense cometh!" But because offense will come, we should be careful not to stir up the natural temperament of those who love not the truth, by unwise words and by the manifestation of an unkind spirit. The truth works by love and purifies the soul. It is the privilege and duty of every child of God to have spiritual apprehension. If we are children of the light, we should walk in the light as Christ is in the light, and testify before the world, before angels and men, that the truth has power to transform human character, and to cause men to represent Christ. With David our testimony should be, "Thy gentleness hath made me great." O that we might have divine perceptions, and be able to appreciate the holy, sacred efficiency of the truth which fell from the lips of Christ! O that a permanent impression might be made upon the hearts of all!" {Special Testimonies to Ministers and Workers #A03 p.25.2}

Ikan,

I trust that you have noticed that the name of this forum is Endtime Events. It's purpose is for anyone who is a member of this forum to place news worthy items they believe may be of importance to Christians in general and SDAs in particular. As I currently moderate this forum, I will continue to place news items here.

Since you seem to be unhappy with the existance of this part of MSDAOL, I invite you to begin a topic in the Suggestion Box forum and post your concerns there. As I have noticed that you have not seemed to post in any of the other forums, I kindly invite you to look at them. There are various topics in other forums here at Maritime that are much more active that the Endtime Eventsforum. Among those other topics and forums there must be something to which you could profitability contribute.

I want to also point out something else. I see that you are in Borneo, which is next door to Malayasia, a country that has been torn by religious persecution in the last few years. As an SDA, you must have some understanding of the Bible prophecies, and you obviously have a knowledge of the SOP. You have to be aware then, that the USA will form the image to the beast. There are a number of things that must happen in America for that to occur. Many American SDAs are watching the news because we are seeing the movements taking place that will soon bring about the very final events and the second coming of Jesus. We don't want to be caught unaware. That is one of the main purposes of posting news items here.

Since the attacks on the World Trade Center and the Pentagon on 9/11, great changes have taken place in this country. Those concerned with religious liberty are watching and keeping Americans posted as to what is happening. These events are going to impact us for eternity. As the end comes, we must be ready. Please pause and think about this. There is a place for this forum and its contents here at MSDAOL. Why not tell us of your personal view of what is taking place so close to your country? We want and even need to know. Just as what is happening in Malayasia seems very distant to us, so the events happening in America probably seem very distant to you. But it is this country that will compell, actually force, the rest of the world to bow to the beast power. We must watch.

[ May 05, 2002: Message edited by: Linda Sutton ]

So my post of Sister White's you would not consider "newsworthy" enough? But the sexual sins of others is supposed to create faith and godly trust in Adventists...hmmm...interesting idea.

It is not a question of what is or isn't newsworthy enough.

We are told to be watchful of what is happening around us that would relate to the signs of the 2nd Coming.

What you have posted also has merit and is thus also newsworthy, however, until I know where you are coming from in this topic with that post, it may belong more to another topic or even to another of our MSDAOL forums.

==========

Corrected a spelling error only.

[ May 12, 2002: Message edited by: Daryl Fawcett ]

Do we concentrate on the sins of others, to the neglect of our own--to include issues of the same nature within our church?

Like "redemtive transfers?" I have been thinking ever since this thing broke open that this denomination's leaders better wake up and take a very close look at how they are handling pastors and other church/school leaders who commit sexual sins. Those memos sent to Cardinal Law gives away the fact that he was aware of what was happening in his archdiocese. The pigeons have come home to roost for him. It may not stop with the Catholic church.

I think most of us know that these sexual sins happen in our own SDA church too and as other churches have done..they move the pastor on to another place. My late husband's daughter was molested by her stepfather and during the trial the lawyer for him brought up the fact that our church(not my church now) had a pastor who molested a child and was moved to another church and nothing was done about it. At the time I could not see why that was brought up for this case but it was. In other words these things will come back to haunt our church in time.

Sadly, perhaps the quotes given by myself from our God-given messenger, Sister White, were too esoteric for the original premise of this section of the forum; my apologies for expecting others to see things from my perspective so readily. However, I still adjure that our own spiritual interests as individuals and hence as a church are best served by avoiding, even in private, dissecting, advertising, and proclaiming the sins of others, as it will lead to a morbid "eye", spiritually. By beholding we are transformed.
If this is a serious discussion on End Time Events, and not a 'slug-fest' on the fallen churches (why is it we never hear any concern about Protestant false doctrines in America?) perhaps correct Adventist eschatology can be discussed. Yes, I understand the title covers "Events"...May I suggest a few?
1.Is not rabid killing over Israeli/Palestinian soil not a sign of a complete misunderstanding by Christians, Muslims, and Jews of God's promise to Abraham? Wasn't it a promise of a New Earth and not the "rented house" of Canaan which the Hebrews were to use as a missionary post to preach the gospel to the entire world, not some sort of eternal nation state?
Has no one seen that the fallen churches in America have projected this theory to their political leaders? Surely this is an endtime event that any Adventist who studies will see as quite relevant.

2.How about EGW's quote in The Great Controversy (page 601?) About "when the hand of apostate Protestantism reaches across he gulf to embrace Romanism....together with Spiritualism" (sorry this is a rough rememberance; I am not at my desk)
I hear very little about the third power being discussed among us Adventists, spiritualism. Does no one see that it is the wonders that demons will and are presenting to non-Adventists (not just Pentecostalism; the 'living' state of the dead is the norm among every religion on earth, except us)and non-belivers alike that will give 'proof' to the claims of fallen churches, the confederacy of false Christianity? Surely there are many things here that would be under the "End Time Events" umbrella...

3. Wouldn't the depictions of other religions about the Advent be useful here? Does anyone realize that Muslims are expecting Christ to return, also? Or that orthodox Jews put stones on their loved ones graves to throw at Jesus, in case He does "actually return"?

But, you may be right Linda and Daryl; perhaps no one is interested in such things here... maybe folks would rather discuss ravished nuns and paedophiles. But I see no value or correlation with those topics with Christ's warning to "watch".

[ May 10, 2002: Message edited by: Ikan ]

What you posted here, Ikan, is relevant to this particular topic, The Sins of Babylon Laid Open, and can be, and also need to be explored further here.

[ May 10, 2002: Message edited by: Daryl Fawcett ]

I see value in what Ikan has posted; but also in what Linda posted regarding the sexual sins of some in positions of 'authority'. While it's true that our main focus should be on "whatsoever things are true,...honest,...just,...pure,...lovely, whatsoever things are of good report" (Philippians 4:8), we're also told to "reprove, rebuke, exhort with all longsuffering and doctrine" (2 Timothy 4:2), and to "sigh and...cry for all the abominations that be done" (Ezekiel 9:4). It would be pretty hard to speak out against sin if we could never even speak of sin at all. Like the three monkeys that hear no evil, see no evil, and speak no evil, our witness would be crippled and mute.

Sister White indeed wrote about the danger in attacking other denominations needlessly, in bringing on a time of trouble prematurely by words unwisely chosen. But that doesn't mean we should never speak of sin at all. The light we have doesn't live in a vacuum. We're surrounded by moral darkness until Jesus comes, so it's only natural to speak of such things to a degree. Hearing Christians call sin by its right name is the only way some people will ever know what is sin in God's eyes, and what is not. "Babylon is fallen" is an end-times issue, and we're seeing yet another glaring example of the fact playing out right before our eyes. When prophecy is fulfilled before us, should we not comment on that fact? Even if it involves things that aren't too pleasant? The Bible would be a much smaller book if we took out all the narratives and prophecies that deal with things that aren't too pleasant. We live in an unpleasant world, though hopefully we live in insulation from it, if we're abiding in God's will.

***

Considering some of the good issues Ikan raises:

The Israel-in-prophecy thing is really pertinent these days. The "Christian Right" with their (mis)understanding of the prophecies regarding Israel is having its influence on the shaping of U.S. foreign policy. Writings and web sites such as Steve Wohlberg's should be brought to the attention of as many people as possible:

http://www.truthleftbehind.com/IsraelinProphecy.html

is a good place to start. Also the book Exploding the Israel Deception, available from the site. Sometimes I post at the "Left Behind" web board, and try to point the people there to Pastor Wohlberg's site.

Spiritualism is taking root deeper than ever before, to be sure. In America, shows like "Crossing Over with John Edward" are hypnotizing millions. Just lately, CBS ran the psychic-thriller miniseries "Living With the Dead", starring Ted Danson. The ratings were out the roof. "Psychic hotlines" do booming business. These are all signs of the mindset of the American public...is it any better in other countries, I wonder.

Another thing that gives me pause is the fact that people these days in the U.S. have been shown to put more stock in their feelings than in any belief in an absolute moral truth. Barna Research did a study that's available online at

http://www.barna.org/cgi-bin/PagePressRelease.asp?PressReleaseID=106&Reference=F

on the subject. Quote: "Less than one out of three born again Christians adopt the notion of absolute moral truth. The surveys also found that few Americans turn to their faith as the primary guide for their moral and ethical decisions."

Wow. If even professing Christians don't rely upon the Bible when it comes to ordinary, every-day decision making, what in the world are they going to do when confronted with demonic miracles, and Satan's glorious impersonation of Christ that will be "unsurpassed by anything that mortal eyes have yet beheld" (GC 624)?

It's like Paul said: "The time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears; and they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables." 2 Timothy 4:3,4.

Thank God for the light we have, greater than any on earth. We need to shine this light into the dark places, and light them up too. But to do that, we have to acknowledge the darkness for what it is. We shouldn't dwell on the darkness; but neither should we go to the opposite extreme and refuse even to mention the darkness, either.

[ May 12, 2002: Message edited by: John ]

Thanks for the excellent response, John. I agree with most of your reply, however I stand firm at resisting even the "natural tendency" to dwell on the sins of others, especially ones so obviously dark and publically reported as is this case. However turning from evil to search the good is not "living in a vacuum".

I also see that you applied 2 Timothy to those outside of the church, which is a unfruitful. We cannot expect the world, fallen churches and especially leaders in Roman churches to be able to or willing to endure sound doctrine or rebukes or our exhortations; these are Paul's instructs to us in the remnant, and no where else. We must not expect those that have rejected Christ's last message of mercy as enrobed in the Third Angel's Message to have the willingness or power to lead deep christian lives.
This may be the reason some Adventists are "shocked" by the hypocrisy of other denominations, although there is no support for them being able to be righteous if they refuse God's light.

You are quite right about spiritualism's influences, but have you seen this:

"As we near the close of time, there will be greater and still greater EXTERNAL PARADE of heathen power; heathen deities will manifest their signal power [make their unique, miracle working powers], and will exhibit themselves before the cities of the world; and this delineation [Victorian English for portrait or picture] has already begun to be fulfilled. By a variety of images the Lord Jesus represented to John the wicked character and seductive influence of those who have been distinguished for their persecution of God's people.[Who have been the main persecutors of the remnant church throughout the ages?] All need wisdom carefully to search out the mystery of iniquity that figures so largely in the winding up of this earth's history. . . "Testimonies to Ministers p117 para.5

The more I study the Word and the SOP, the more I understand that it is miracle working powers of evil angels that will con the world's masses into looking to that mixture of fallen Protestantism, popery and the supernatural for answers.

Those in "christian" nations are mostly unaware that the 3/4ths of earths people have no connection, concern or insight into what the Vatican is up to or what constitutes Protestantism, let alone Adventism even is.{I refer the skeptical here to http://www.adherents.com/Religions_By_Adherents.html} I live in Asia; I often have to explain to others that all christains are not catholoics.

Most of earth's people care little about the latest pontifical shenanigans, and are not surprised at the sins of Rome, the Southern Baptist Union or the GC.

BUT even a hardened communist Chinese atheist will start start searching for some sort of answers when "heathen deities will manifest their signal power", when "dead Uncle Wong" returns to haunt them and point them to a false christianity...Think about it... Brother Ikan

[ May 12, 2002: Message edited by: Ikan ]

[ May 12, 2002: Message edited by: Ikan ]

[ May 14, 2002: Message edited by: Ikan ]

Ikan, I agree with everything you've posted here. To draw attention to the sins of others just to say "gotcha" is at best questionable, and seems to be along the lines of fault finding - or judging. A religion based on picking out the bad bits hardly has room for the love of Jesus, which illuminates the understanding to grasp the realities of world events. The political influence of right wing Protestants is the only explanation for the USA's support of Israel's unacceptable behaviour on many occasions.

Didn't Mrs White also say it was getting (in her day) to be inappropriate for Christians to be reading the newspapers?

Yes, zyph, Sister White says this:
"The apostle [Peter] sought to teach the believers how important it is to keep the mind from wandering to forbidden themes or from spending its energies on trifling subjects. Those who would not fall a prey to Satan's devices must guard well the avenues of the soul; they must avoid reading, seeing, or hearing that which will suggest impure thoughts. The mind must not be left to dwell at random upon every subject that the enemy of souls may suggest. The heart must be faithfully sentineled, or evils without will awaken evils within, and the soul will wander in darkness. {AH 403.3}
Everything that can be done should be done to place ourselves and our children where we shall not see the iniquity that is practiced in the world. We should carefully guard the sight of our eyes and the hearing of our ears so that these awful things shall not enter our minds. When the daily newspaper comes into the house, I feel as if I want to hide it, that the ridiculous, sensational things in it may not be seen. It seems as if the enemy is at the foundation of the publishing of many things that appear in newspapers. Every sinful thing that can be found is uncovered and laid bare before the world. {AH 403.4}
Those who would have that wisdom which is from God must become fools in the sinful knowledge of this age, in order to be wise. They should shut their eyes, that they may see and learn no evil. They should close their ears, lest they hear that which is evil and obtain that knowledge which would stain their purity of thoughts and acts. And they should guard their tongues, lest they utter corrupt communications and guile be found in their mouths." {Adventist Home page 404.1}

Clear as a bell to me...one must realize that an Adventist's life is a deepening of the sensitivity of the heart to God and dulling of it to the world. This doesn't mean stupidity, but those who think "You gotta know all about sin to reject it." are only rationalizing their own sinful past and/or present.
They have every right to do that: there is no force in true religion. But to call it good, valuable or wise, that I must protest.

Anyone have any thoughts on my previous mention of "heathen deities"???

[ May 13, 2002: Message edited by: Ikan ]

I think this EGW quote is referring to sin seduction or sin watching, not signs watching.

Watching for the signs leading up to the 2nd coming of Christ is different than reading, for example, about so and so's pornographic activity.

Take the following text as another example:

quote:

---

Luke 17:26 And as it was in the days of Noe, so shall it be also in the days of the Son of man.
27 They did eat, they drank, they married wives, they were given in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark, and the flood came, and destroyed them all.
28 Likewise also as it was in the days of Lot; they did eat, they drank, they bought, they sold, they planted, they builded;
29 But the same day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven, and destroyed them all.
30 Even thus shall it be in the day when the Son of man is revealed.

---

We all know what is being spoken about here. All we need to do is to go back and read from the Old Testament what sins were being committed there. It is interesting though that the above text makes it almost seem like normal everyday living, however, it wasn't normal everyday living that brought sbout the Flood and the destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah. Perhaps the above text shows that we should be focusing on the general direction of events rather than the specific sinful events themselves. I don't know. It is just a thought or a wondering on my part.

Ohn the other side of the coin, the Bible says below:

quote:

---

Revelation 18:1 And after these things I saw another angel come down from heaven, having great power; and the earth was lightened with his glory.
2 And he cried mightily with a strong voice, saying, Babylon the great is fallen, is fallen, and is become the habitation of devils, and the hold of every foul spirit, and a cage of every unclean and hateful bird.
3 For all nations have drunk of the wine of the wrath of her fornication, and the kings of the earth have committed fornication with her, and the merchants of the earth are waxed rich through the abundance of her delicacies.
4 And I heard another voice from heaven, saying, Come out of her, my people, that ye be not partakers of her sins, and that ye receive not of her plagues.
5 For her sins have reached unto heaven, and God hath remembered her iniquities.

---

So, how do we go about calling out God's people from Babylon unless we focus on the sins of Babylon as a means of showing them why they need to be called out of Babylon??

[ May 12, 2002: Message edited by: Daryl Fawcett ]

Sorry Daryl: I still cannot see how one can construe the original premise of this forum (the discussion of the sexual sins of Catholic clerics) as "signs". The general gearing up of the casual discussion of other's sexual sins, therefore, would also be another "sign"; a sign of a morbid fascination with darkness, and lack of interest in actual fulfilled prophecy.
No one here is ignorant of the evils in the world, but many are not fully satisfied with all their knowledge of God's desires for His people to search the heritage He has left us concerning what has already passed and what we need to have for our growth in grace as we approach even scarier times ahead. I appeal to all to scan my posts here one more time.

Well, pardon me folks if I feel a little bit like Charlie Brown! After, all, we've been posting news items in this forum for over two years.

This post will self-destruct in 24 hours [because it will be removed by myself].

[ May 12, 2002: Message edited by: Linda Sutton ]

I have removed the graphic, but am leaving the post since to remove it would make the next post look out of place.

[ May 13, 2002: Message edited by: Linda Sutton ]

Linda,

As far as I am concerned, what you have posted in this forum is acceptable to me.

If there are those who have a concern about what has been posted here, they have the choice of not reading what is in this particular forum of MSDAOL.

If they wish to post about what is being posted here, that is OK to me as well. Everybody is entitled to their opinion as long as they respect what is being posted by others including your choice of news topics as the moderator of this particular forum.

With that in mind, let us continue to post any news that is relevant to the end times.

What I have posted here myself isn't agreeing or disagreeing with what anybody is posting here, topic wise or post wise.

[ May 12, 2002: Message edited by: Daryl Fawcett ]

This thread has value in that it can serve to promote discussion of what is a valid sign of the 2nd Advent. As has been illustrated here, not everyone agrees on what is as valid sign.

Note that I have not taken a position as to whether of not the sexual sins of Roman Catholic clergy are a sign of the end. Any further comment that I make does not address that question, or indicate my personal position.

But I will refer you to Matthews 24. Please note the last part of vs.6, and the last part of vs. 14. Prior to bothe of these verse various conditions in the world are listed (war, love of sin, etc.), but those lists are all followed by as comments that indicates that the "end" is still in the future. Read Matt. 24 carefully. Some Adventistss look at this fromt he standpoint that war and the other stuff are not real good indicators of the "end," as they will exist right up to the end. Some would say that the best sign in Matt. 24, is the gospit to the entire world.

Again, I am not commenting one way or another as to where I am. But, this thread is serving a purpsoe in bringing out this division in understandign Matt. 24.

My question that I asked before: How should we differ in the way we relate to this sexual sins of RC clergy, and those of our own SDA clergy. I believe that the public awareness of issues with this in the RC Church is currently producing an increase in perception of this problem in the SDA Chruch. i.e. Are we any better than the RC Chruch?

I agree.

We are no less prone to committing this sort of sin as are the clergy of the RC church.

Irrespective of our doctrinal differences, both churches should know better.

So the question is: Is this any more a sin of Babylon than it is a sin of any church?

I've heard these forums can be addicting Ikan. I had a friend tell me I shouldn't spend too much time on them. What do you think?

Did you mean Friend or friend?

[ May 14, 2002: Message edited by: Ikan ]

No, I don't think anyone would try to pawn off sins in our church as having less deadly effect on the persons involved then other churches. But I wonder whether we see God as winking at sin among us because He has singled us out to be His bearers of His Last Message of Mercy. Their is always a subtle possibilty of this, which secret pride will foster. Here again is what Sister White reveals as related by her grandson (this was all about sexual sins):

"But in a vision given to Ellen White, which she wrote out while at the Abbey home in Brookfield on Sunday, February 12,[1854] she declared:
'I saw the situation of many in our meeting at Oswego. They were in the way of the work of God.... The ax has not been laid at the root of the tree. Those who have indulged in the wicked passions of the heart have been fellowshipped.... God will not look upon sin now (in condoning it) any sooner than He did anciently when Israel sinned. Sins have not been held forth in their sinful character,but have been made to appear as though sins have been lightly regarded by God.

I saw the seventh commandment had been broken by some who are now held in fellowship by the church, and in consequence God's frown is upon the church. This sin is awful in these last days and the church has brought God's frown and curse upon them in regarding this sin lightly.--MS 1, 1854. {1BIO 290.4}
"She referred to the far-reaching effects of the toleration of such sins in the church:
'Said the angel, "This is not the sin of ignorance. It is a known sin, and will receive the awful visitation of God, whether committed by old or young." Never was this sin regarded by God to be so sinful as at present, because God is purifying to Himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works.'--Ibid. {1BIO 290.6}
"After writing at length in this vein, she again quoted the words of the angel: {1BIO 290.7}
'Said the angel, "Fearful is the work of the third angel, and awful is his mission. He is to select the wheat from the tares, and bind or seal the wheat for the heavenly garner."'--Ibid.

Well...that's plain talking if I ever heard it. Looks like sexual sins and others too are extra sinful among those who claim to be His peculiar people.

I am sadly inclined to agree as there is either slackness or timidness in this area.

Is it because it has become so acceptable in our society that we are afraid to deal with it ourselves?

I don't really know. I am just wondering why.

This topic may be becoming more of a church issues topic.

Bingo and Amen, Daryl! I agree; the entire subject of the sins of Adventists should be on the Church Issues forum and the sins of other faiths avoided altogether. Let Sister White's words be the Elijah, warning others, not us. We assume a role that is not ours.

So that being said, does anyone care to discuss the following Endtime matters?:

1. How the Israeli/Palestinian war is based on false understandings of God's promise to Abraham, by Jews, Christians and Muslims.

2. That even more astounding manifestations of supernatural events will be seen worldwide,and very soon, as prophecied by Sister White.

3. What Muslims believe about the End of Time.

These are pure Endtimes stuff, and real eye openers.

[ May 16, 2002: Message edited by: Ikan ]

You should post those endtime items as new and separate topics.

Unless Linda, feels differently, and she can reopen it if she does, I think it is time to bring this topic to a close.