quote:

---

Jesus is to be loved and trusted. All who will be obedient He leads upward step by step, as fast as they can advance, that, while standing by the side of the Sin-bearer, in the light that proceeds from the throne of God, they may breathe the air of the heavenly courts. Beside his great Intercessor, the repentant sinner stands above the strife and accusation of tongues. "Who is he that will harm you, if ye be followers of that which is good? But and if ye suffer for righteousness' sake, happy are ye: and be not afraid of their terror, neither be troubled."{DG 240.4}

---

The repentant sinner. Why didn't she say, "Beside his great Intercessor, the saint stands above the strife and accusation of tongues."???

Sounds to me that though repentant, he was still referred by her in this quote as a sinner saved by grace.

Askel, to insist that since born again believers fall in and out of sin on a regular basis proves that sinning and repenting is just a natural part of being saved neglects what the Bible says about living without sin. Properly understood 1 John 1:8 is not saying that sinning is normal and part of being a Christian. It's simply saying that all have sinned (past tense), not that all sin every day or all the time. Please refer to the list of texts I quoted earlier.

We come to Jesus as sinners, and thank God He does not send us away as sinners. Through the miracle of rebirth He promises - Go, and sin no more. It's important to notice that he did not say - Go, and gradually eliminate sin.

Why do we make it seem as if sin is too big and powerful to live without? I get the feeling that most people believe sin is too strong to overcome or to resist. Where does this kind of thinking originate? Living without sin is not the challenge facing Christians, rather the goal of a born again believer is to imitate the example of Jesus.

1 Peter
2:21 For even hereunto were ye called: because Christ also suffered for us, leaving us an example, that ye should follow his steps:
2:22 Who did no sin, neither was guile found in his mouth:

But if we make sin out to be some giant which is not easily resisted or overcome then what will people think when they learn that the Bible promises us more than victory? The good fight of faith is not about resisting sin and temptation, it's more about imitating the example of Jesus, it's about maturing in the fruit of the Spirit.

I believe we need to get out of this mind set that resisting temptation is some kind of major accomplishment, and start realizing that true conversion is about growing in grace and maturing in the fruit of the Spirit - just like Jesus did as He matured from childhood to adulthood.

The parables of the unprofitable servants (Mat 25 and Luke 17) clearly teach that there is more, much more, to life than merely resisting temptation. It's not until we begin to reproduce the lovely character of Jesus that we have entered into the miralce of salvation and righteousness by faith. It's good to know that the Bible doesn't say - no sin by faith. Instead it plainly says - righteousness by faith. Not sinning is not righteousness. Right doing is righteousness.

Do you see what I mean?

"I believe we need to get out of this mind set that resisting temptation is some kind of major accomplishment, and start realizing that true conversion is about growing in grace and maturing in the fruit of the Spirit - just like Jesus did as He matured from childhood to adulthood."

Mike

I would venture my humble opinion, to say this comment is way off base:

DA.720.002
Yet Judas made no open opposition, nor seemed to question the Saviour's lessons. He made no outward murmur until the time of the feast in Simon's house. When Mary anointed the Saviour's feet, Judas manifested his covetous disposition. At the reproof from Jesus his very spirit seemed turned to gall. Wounded pride and desire for revenge broke down the barriers, and the greed so long indulged held him in control. This will be the experience of everyone who persists in tampering with sin. The elements of depravity that are not resisted and overcome, respond to Satan's temptation, and the soul is led captive at his will.

HS.136.001
A relentless and determined foe has prepared his wiles for every soul that is not braced for trial, and guarded by constant prayer and living faith. We cannot individually, or as a body, secure ourselves from his constant assaults; but in the strength of Jesus every temptation, every opposing influence, whether open or secret, may be successfully resisted. Remember that "your adversary the devil, as a roaring lion, walketh about, seeking whom he may devour." Therefore "be sober, be vigilant."

GCB.1899-10-01.008
The Lord Jesus Christ, when in human flesh, successfully resisted every temptation of the enemy. His efforts of superhuman love, made to save the race, were successful. From him men and women may receive power to overcome, if they will consent to cease from sin. Christ gave every son and daughter of Adam unmistakable evidence that through the provisions God has made they may overcome. Each one must rely on the merits of a crucified and risen Saviour. He takes every repenting soul into covenant relation with himself.

I can't see how resisting temptations is something wee need to "get away from, when it comes to us everyday; and Jesus says: "To him that overcometh, will I....."

Sounds pretty major to me...

How would I ever have gotten off drugs, if I had listened to what you just wrote?

"Grow in grace," means "resist temptation." And that is indeed a major thing.

"We come to Jesus as sinners, and thank God He does not send us away as sinners. Through the miracle of rebirth He promises - Go, and sin no more. It's important to notice that he did not say - Go, and gradually eliminate sin."

David, after rereading what I wrote about resisting temptation I must apologize for making it seem as though resisting and overcoming are not important. Thank you for clarifying that point.

The main thing I was trying to get across is that by contrast reproducing the character of Jesus is more important than ceasing from sin, which is NOT to say that ceasing from sin is unimportant. The idea that ceasing from sin is the end goal of a Christian is unbiblical. Ceasing from sin is the starting point of Christianity. From there the focus should be on imitating the example of Jesus by maturing in the fruit and attributes of God.

But if we spend our life as Christians pretending temptation is our major challenge then we shall fail to focus on being Christlike. If we focus on not sinning then we are not focusing on Jesus. He never sinned, thus if we make not sinning our primary goal then nothingness is our focus. Not sinning is not righteousness. If all we ever do in life is not sin then we haven't accomplished anything. As Morris Venden put it - Being good by not being bad is not being good.

Jesus did not come and demonstrate how to avoid doing nothing wrong. Doing nothing wrong is still doing nothing. Rather Jesus left us an example of doing everything right. He did the will of His Father. Jesus encourages us to showcase the glory of God by living a life full of faith and good works.

But if we make temptation out to be some monster so terrible that it requires all our time and energy to out smart it, then I'm afraid we will be too distracted with sin and temptation to devote enough time to what really matters - righteousness by faith. Again, please don't misunderstand me. I'm not saying resisting temptation isn't necessary or important. Satan is defeated. Jesus is the mighty, all powerful Saviour. We should exalt Him and His power to save to the utter most.

DA 493.1
There are Christians who think and speak altogether too much about the power of Satan. They think of their adversary, they pray about him, they talk about him, and he looms up greater and greater in their imagination. It is true that Satan is a powerful being; but, thank God, we have a mighty Saviour, who cast out the evil one from heaven. Satan is pleased when we magnify his power. Why not talk of Jesus? Why not magnify His power and His love?

1 Corinthians
10:13 There hath no temptation taken you but such as is common to man: but God [is] faithful, who will not suffer you to be tempted above that ye are able; but will with the temptation also make a way to escape, that ye may be able to bear [it].

2 Peter
2:9 The Lord knoweth how to deliver the godly out of temptations, and to reserve the unjust unto the day of judgment to be punished:

Philippians
2:13 For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of [his] good pleasure.

Philippians
1:6 Being confident of this very thing, that he which hath begun a good work in you will perform [it] until the day of Jesus Christ:

These texts very clearly teach that resisting temptation is something that God empowers us to do in His strength and in His power. Victory does not depend upon our inherited weaknesses, but rather it relies solely upon staying connected to Jesus. Fighting the good fight of faith means exercising our all God given strength to keep our eyes firmly focused upon Jesus our Saviour.

Victory belongs to those who fight to abide in Jesus, not to those who fight with all their focus on not sinning. We must fight the good fight of faith NOT the fruitless fight of sin. We cannot overcome temptation by focusing on not sinning. We may overcome only as we make Jesus the focus of our time and attention. And then righteousness will be so attractive and so desirable that temptation will lose all it's power and appeal. And we come off more than conquerors in Jesus.

quote:

---

Posted by Mike Lowe:
"We come to Jesus as sinners, and thank God He does not send us away as sinners. Through the miracle of rebirth He promises - Go, and sin no more. It's important to notice that he did not say - Go, and gradually eliminate sin."

---

Do I understand you now correctly:
"We come to Jesus as sinners, and thank God He does not send us away as sinners"; and next time when we come to Jesus we come also as sinners?? Is it right?

If so, then where is the problem?

Perhaps they (like us, like Peter, like Abraham--called 'father of a multitude' before he even had a child) are given a new name by God even before they reach their growth-potential in Him.

Very well said!

Pastor Mike

I see some of your point; I think; let me ask a question, that perhaps will help me to answer some that I have about your post.

What is it that makes someone like Jesus?

Aksel, so long as we abide in Jesus we are saints. But if we disconnect ourselves and wander off in sin then the only way to come back to Jesus is as a sinner. The common denominator for a sinner is sin and separation. Sin separates, and repentance restores. Is that right?

David, a person is Christlike if they are like Christ. To live without sin is to be like Jesus. 1 Peter 2:21,22. And to mature in the fruit of the Spirit is to be like Jesus. Luke 2:52 and Heb 5:8,9 and 1 Peter 4;1,2.