I'm sorry I haven't been online in the last couple of days. Been busy traveling between jobs. I have a self-supporting outdoor ministry, and it keeps me pleasantly busy.

I really like what you wrote about Jesus and how He empowers us live to up light we have at every stage of our walk in the Spirit. He is truly our Lord and Saviour.

You said something about - "I die daily." What is your take on this passage? Does it mean that Paul sinned daily therefore he had to die daily? Or does it mean that he died once unto sin and now he maintains it on a daily basis?

And what is your take on the phrase - We begin at conversion where Christ began at conception? Is Jesus our example before or after the old man habits of sin are crucified (dead and buried)?

As you understandit how and when is 1 John 3:9 a reality for us?

The "born again" experience starts when the seed is first watered and i respond. I respond all sinful and dirty with my own filthy rags. But this is the beginning of the transformation. The seed starts to put up the first blade and though large clods of dirt and rain try to knock it down and sometimes it does, the seed is protected by the Creator God and the transformation continues thru evey stage of it's growth. When God looks at it, He doesn't see the struggling, falling, struggling again sprout, He sees the Blood of His Son covering the growing blade that will reach maturity in the future. God sees the Saint not the sinner.

- The Signs of the Times----DT- 04-30-96
- By Mrs. E. G. White.
- "Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him; and he can not sin, because he is born of God." The standard which is to test every doctrine, every theory, every profession, is the law of God. "Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin,"--break the law of Jehovah. If a man is born of God, he will respect the principles of the divine government, and will not wilfully transgress the law of God in thought, or word, or action. "Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth forever." "Of his own will begat he us with the word of truth, that we should be a kind of first-fruits of his creatures." Jesus prayed that his disciples might be sanctified through the truth, and added, "Thy word is truth."

end quote

As the sinner goes from Knowledge to knowledge and Glory to Glory each step is a higher rownd. Each lesson learned, each test a victory reach a fitness for the kingdom, clothed in the Robe of christ's righteousness which was places on us at the beginning of our walk.....God only sees that we have not sinned because we are being sanctified by the truth. Thank you Jesus

The motive is pure love and what is manifested during the process is Love. This shows the "Faith is genuine."

From my understanding of the seed and soil illustration - the seed is sinless (1Peter 1:23 and 1 John 3:9) and is the same in each case. It is the soil that varies from person to person, and only the person who has good soil experiences the miracle of rebirth.

In any case, the seed is never considered corrupt or defective. It is always and only perfect and without sin or imperfection. The soil must be good in order for the seed to survive and thrive. Thus the soil cannot symbolize sin. Eph 4:24.

Jesus is the best example I can think of to explain the soil and the seed illustration. The soil of His heart was good, not withstanding He assumed fallen flesh nature. This clearly indicates that the soil is not our fallen nature, but rather it is our heart.

The seed of Jesus, as far as character perfection is concerned, is exactly the same seed we receive when we are born again. John 1:12,13. The seed is perfect, and as it grows and unfolds it reveals perfection more and more unto the perfect day - from glory to glory. It does not accumulate perfection along the way. It begins perfect and it becomes perfect. The perfection already inherent in the seed unfolds as it progresses and matures and eventually blossoms. It isn't any more perfect when it blossoms. The difference between seed and blossom isn't perfection, but rather maturity. The blossom is in the seed from the beginning.

And so it was with Jesus - He began perfect and He became perfect, which is exactly the way it is for born again believers. They begin perfect and they become perfect. But self must first die, and then God implants within us the same seed He implanted within Jesus (minus His divinty), and just like Jesus we become perfect as the seed unfolds and matures and blossoms.

Is that how you understand the seed and the soil?

The seed is perfect and the watering by the Holy Spirit is perfect that is why i say, the "new sprout/blade" is a "new birth" that will grow and mature and blossom, and bring forth fruit in the true searching believer. The only way to have and maitain a perfect character is to partake of Jesus Divine Nature with His enabling power to reach victory. His Merits not mine. When God looks at each struggling child, He sees not the sin but the perfect man that he will become by staunchly clinging to the vine.

The clods the seeds struggle thru are our battles with self to give our wills to Christ and choose His ways over our old natures. Much effort is exertred to give sway to what is right when satan is pressuring for his way to be done. Only In Christ may we be victorious.

God consented to become a poor, sinful flesh human man and come to this sinful earth as an example for us, He overcame as we must overcome, He paid the price for our sins, that we may become rich in spiritual riches, partake of His Divine Nature, be taken to His heaveny home and spend eternity with Him.

This is impossible but it is also true, the promise is that if we are willing to follow Him, this is where it leads.

When we consent to follow Him, We become Born again. The seed dies so it can begin to grow anew.

In what way is Jesus our example - before or after we cease from sin?

The furtile seed is perfect but is nothing until it is allowed to abide in a heart and allowing the Holy Spirit to water it from the fountains of living water. The sprout is the visual evidence that the heart/mind has opened to the sanctifying truths of Gods word. Milk is fed to the tender shoot and it grows little by little. the reformation of the body and soul are in progress. Satan, alerted to loosing one of his followers alerts his army, bringing in his forces to discourage, question and frustrate the one that is learning a new life style, and saving truths. It is difficult to accept new truths, some go against all you have learned in church since a child and these need to be unlearned, God's Angels and Satan's angels contend for the soul of this new babe in Christ , like for moses body. The battle fought in the strength of God is already won by His Son Jesus and when victorious with this step, another one appears and one goes forth learning and climbing from glory to the next.

New birth: when we act on the invitation. Nicodemus heard the "plan of Salvation" from Jesus' lips.....but he did not accept the watering of that seed for three years. His Born again experience didn't happen until he saw eveidence of the truth hanging on Calvary. The perfect seeds do not always spring into perfect blades until one is ready to "be still and know that I am your God" experience the new life.

In What way is Jesus our example-before or after we cease from sin?

If we know nothing about Jesus God or Holy Spirit...it means nothing but a consciousness of a guilt. When the Holy spirit woos and one listens to the wooing.....it will grow to a conscious decision for God. He will become our example for overcoming temptation and living a godly life. When we are Hidden in His life we live in reflection of how he leads and has an active influence in all that we do and is doing for us every moment.Growing more and more like Him as we look to Him and Looking forward to His coming the the Eternity we will spend with Him. Years of thankfullnees for His Blessings.

It is always Jesus, It is always lifting Him up to others. He is the pattern and the enabling power overcome ever defilement. We shall be made anew without spot or wrinkle, complete and mature by Him living in us.

He is waiting for a purified people.....When the work is finished in our hearts, it will also be finished in the world and God can come.

quote:

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Conversions are not all alike

All are not constituted alike. Conversions are not all alike. Jesus impresses the heart, and the sinner is born again to new life. Often souls have been drawn to Christ when there was no violent conviction, no soul rending, no remorseful terrors. They looked upon an uplifted Saviour, they lived. They saw the soul's need, they saw the Saviour's sufficiency, and His claims, they heard His voice saying, "Follow Me," and they rose up and followed Him. This conversion was genuine, and the religious life was just as decided as was that of others who suffered all the agony of a violent process.--1SM 177. {PaM 125.2}

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In The Blesed Hope

Avalee

[ March 15, 2002: Message edited by: Avalee ]