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Re: Is "Polygamy" a Sin?
#47393
05/08/06 08:28 AM
05/08/06 08:28 AM
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Active Member 2011
3500+ Member
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Joined: May 2002
Posts: 3,965
Sweden
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Considering the example of Abraham, I find it interesting that him marrying Hagar, the egyptian, was distrusting God (Gal 4) while marrying Sarah, Abrahams fathers daughter (Gen 20) and thus his sister was according to Gods promise. And some 10 generations down the line, on the mount where Moses recieved the law from God, it would become detestable before God for Abraham to marry his fathers daughter while it would have been acceptable to marry the nonrelated Hagar. What to do with this mess?
/Thomas
Galatians 2
21 I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain.
It is so hazardous to take here a little and there a little. If you put the right little's together you can make the bible teach anything you wish. //Graham Maxwell
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Re: Is "Polygamy" a Sin?
#47394
05/08/06 12:07 PM
05/08/06 12:07 PM
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Dedicated Member
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Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 1,163
Muncie, IN
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Daryl, I find it interesting that you aren't as insistent that inspiration equals infallibility when you read the Bible as you are when you read EGW. Could you have elevated her to a position she does not deserve? Why do you disagree with Jesus when He taught that at death the righteous go to Abraham's bosom and the wicked go to a burning hell?
Darius A. Lecointe, J.D., Ph.D.
No weapon formed against me shall prosper.
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Re: Is "Polygamy" a Sin?
#47395
05/08/06 04:49 PM
05/08/06 04:49 PM
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5500+ Member
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Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 6,154
Brazil
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Quote:
That is sufficient, but it is here I am struck by the irony. We wish to claim that polygamy is a sin but have no problems accepting it when it is done serially under the name of divorce and remarriage.
That's the point, Darius. Divorcing and marrying one at a time is less objectionable than marrying two at a time. Why is then divorce and remarriage condemned in the Bible as adultery?
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Re: Is "Polygamy" a Sin?
#47396
05/08/06 04:59 PM
05/08/06 04:59 PM
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Dedicated Member
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Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 1,163
Muncie, IN
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Quote:
Quote:
That is sufficient, but it is here I am struck by the irony. We wish to claim that polygamy is a sin but have no problems accepting it when it is done serially under the name of divorce and remarriage.
That's the point, Darius. Divorcing and marrying one at a time is less objectionable than marrying two at a time. Why is then divorce and remarriage condemned in the Bible as adultery?
We should be careful not to present church teachings as divine teachings. The Creator never said that serial marriages are less objectionable than polygamy. That is how we have set it up in the west. And I suggest you take another look at the passage about divorce and remarriage. It is not called adultery. Christ said that the man who divorces his wife CAUSES her to commit adultery.
Darius A. Lecointe, J.D., Ph.D.
No weapon formed against me shall prosper.
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Re: Is "Polygamy" a Sin?
#47397
05/08/06 05:06 PM
05/08/06 05:06 PM
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5500+ Member
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Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 6,154
Brazil
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Quote:
Considering the example of Abraham, I find it interesting that him marrying Hagar, the egyptian, was distrusting God (Gal 4) while marrying Sarah, Abrahams fathers daughter (Gen 20) and thus his sister was according to Gods promise. And some 10 generations down the line, on the mount where Moses recieved the law from God, it would become detestable before God for Abraham to marry his fathers daughter while it would have been acceptable to marry the nonrelated Hagar. What to do with this mess?
Thomas,
Abraham's distrust in God was not related to whom he married, because he was already married when he received the promise; his distrust was related to the birth of a son through someone who was not his wife.
As to the change of rules regarding marrying sisters/brothers, you have to consider that at the beginning of the world, the only way for the race to multiply was the intermarriage between Adam's sons and daughters. This was modified later to half-sisters/brothers, and still later there was no need for marrying close relatives. The rules were modified because, with the weakening of the race, this came to represent a risk. This is not a mess. God was just being coherent.
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Re: Is "Polygamy" a Sin?
#47398
05/08/06 05:11 PM
05/08/06 05:11 PM
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Dedicated Member
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Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 1,163
Muncie, IN
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Quote:
As to the change of rules regarding marrying sisters/brothers, you have to consider that at the beginning of the world, the only way for the race to multiply was the intermarriage between Adam's sons and daughters. This was modified later to half-sisters/brothers, and still later there was no need for marrying close relatives. The rules were modified because, with the weakening of the race, this came to represent a risk. This is not a mess. God was just being coherent.
Why do we wish to turn rules of pragmatism into sins? We seem bent on inventing sins at every turn. How badly we must want to be thought superior to others.
Darius A. Lecointe, J.D., Ph.D.
No weapon formed against me shall prosper.
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Re: Is "Polygamy" a Sin?
#47399
05/08/06 09:32 PM
05/08/06 09:32 PM
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Active Member 2011
3500+ Member
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Joined: May 2002
Posts: 3,965
Sweden
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Well, this was probably at least some 400 years of childmaking after the flood so there would have been plenty of time for people to grow up and be aviable for starting families. This is illustrated by Abrahams biography with all the different kingdoms and citystates he was involved with.
Secoundly, the parents of Moses, much closer to the lawgiving (Ex 6) may give something to ponder.
Though you are probably right. As far as I am aware there is no indication that any of the bibles authors took this as a problem with the persons mentioned.
/Thomas
Galatians 2
21 I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain.
It is so hazardous to take here a little and there a little. If you put the right little's together you can make the bible teach anything you wish. //Graham Maxwell
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Re: Is "Polygamy" a Sin?
#47400
05/08/06 11:23 PM
05/08/06 11:23 PM
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Active Member 2012
14500+ Member
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Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 14,795
Lawrence, Kansas
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Quote:
And I suggest you take another look at the passage about divorce and remarriage. It is not called adultery. Christ said that the man who divorces his wife CAUSES her to commit adultery.
Are you remembering what Christ said in Matt. 19?
Quote:
7"Why then," they asked, "did Moses command that a man give his wife a certificate of divorce and send her away?"
8Jesus replied, "Moses permitted you to divorce your wives because your hearts were hard. But it was not this way from the beginning. 9 I tell you that anyone who divorces his wife, except for marital unfaithfulness, and marries another woman commits adultery."
Those who wait for the Bridegroom's coming are to say to the people, "Behold your God." The last rays of merciful light, the last message of mercy to be given to the world, is a revelation of His character of love.
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Re: Is "Polygamy" a Sin?
#47401
05/08/06 11:29 PM
05/08/06 11:29 PM
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Active Member 2012
14500+ Member
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Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 14,795
Lawrence, Kansas
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Quote:
Why do we wish to turn rules of pragmatism into sins? We seem bent on inventing sins at every turn. How badly we must want to be thought superior to others.
All sins are rules of pragmatism (which is not to say that all rules of pragmatism are sin). Jesus laid out the principle of divorce/remarriage being adultery by referring to the fact that in the beginning God created Adam and Eve, one man and one woman. This principle is easily understood, and easily seen to apply to polygamy. Had God intended for a man to have more than one wife, He would have created multiple help mates for Adam to start with.
I'm curious (sorry if I already asked this, I can't remember). Do you understand that polygamy, according to the teachings of the New Testament, is a sin?
Those who wait for the Bridegroom's coming are to say to the people, "Behold your God." The last rays of merciful light, the last message of mercy to be given to the world, is a revelation of His character of love.
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Re: Is "Polygamy" a Sin?
#47402
05/09/06 12:39 AM
05/09/06 12:39 AM
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Quote:
Daryl, I find it interesting that you aren't as insistent that inspiration equals infallibility when you read the Bible as you are when you read EGW. Could you have elevated her to a position she does not deserve? Why do you disagree with Jesus when He taught that at death the righteous go to Abraham's bosom and the wicked go to a burning hell?
Darius,
I am just as insistent, if not even more insistent. I will look at what she says in relation to what the Bible says. If I do not see an apparent contradiction, I will accept what she says as God's inspired messenger. I will definitely accept what she says over what you say. You are definitely not God's inspired messenger.
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